Coffee House

What is the Lib Dems’ problem with ‘the Jews’?

25 July 2014

3:58 PM

25 July 2014

3:58 PM

The Liberal Democrats have always been a party of contradictions. In the time I’ve been a member, as well as a journalist covering the party, few of its contradictions have baffled me more than the fact that it is called the Liberal Democrat party but it unequivocally fails to support the only liberal democracy in the Middle East.

There has always been a strong link between British Jewry and Liberal parties, but the present day Liberal Democrats are broadly not trusted by the Jewish community. This is despite the best efforts of Nick Clegg and others to rebuild links.

This was brought home to me only a couple of months ago, when I was knocking on doors for the Lib Dems as a council candidate in the London Borough of Barnet. My ward took in part of the Jewish community in Golders Green. One evening a man answered the door, only to slam it very quickly when I told him which party I was from, shouting: ‘I won’t vote for you, you’re an anti-Semitic party.’ If only he had been an one off…

For a party that tries to be accessible and politically correct, the Lib Dems have a cultural blind spot over the Jewish community. A perfect example is that, come October, they will have held their autumn party conference over Yom Kippur, the holiest day in the Jewish calendar, four years in a row. Once happens, twice is a bad coincidence, four times and you’re telling a community that you don’t really pay them much attention.

[Alt-Text]


You can’t help but ask: what is the Lib Dems’ problem with ‘the Jews’?

Many people joined due to a strong belief in human rights and a determination to stick up for the ‘little guy’. Honourable positions to hold, but easily warped when looking at the Middle East. Lib Dems, particularly at the grassroots level, see Israel with a thriving economy and a proper military, and assume that this makes it an evil Goliath, and the Palestinians therefore the noble David. It’s a binary view, not to mention a misinformed one.

They all too easily ignore that Israel is about the same size as Wales or the state of New Jersey and has been attacked ever since its formation. They don’t think about the human rights of Israeli citizens to live their daily lives without being bombarded by Hamas’s missiles.

With these foundations laid, the likes of David Ward and Jenny Tonge can share their vile views under some political cover. Indeed, there are plenty of Lib Dem members who publicly agreed with David Ward this week, and the same was true of Tonge before she was finally given her marching orders.

It demonstrates how easily anti-Israel and anti-Zionist sentiment can veer towards what could be regarded as anti-Semitism. It’s hard for the party leadership to take action against these outbursts. The perpetrators can legitimately say that party members are backing them. The leadership fears a backlash from activists. The Lib Dems remain a member and process driven party. Many times this works to the party’s advantage. Not so in matters of discipline. I have little doubt that Clegg and his whips would have liked to show David Ward the door this week, but the bureaucratic way the party is setup made that almost impossible. That said, it’s hard to imagine either of the other two major parties hiding behind ‘process’ when dealing with such comments from their benches.

David Ward’s despicable comments this week were just the latest in a series of incidents that have dogged the Liberal Democrats. With a bit of subtlety and nuance, it’s more than possible to make comments that are stridently critical of Israel without approaching the realms of anti-Semitism.

Subtlety and nuance were exactly what was missing from Ward this week, and his defender, former MEP Edward McMillan Scott. I have no idea how I’d now answer that man in Golders Green.

Subscribe to The Spectator today for a quality of argument not found in any other publication. Get more Spectator for less – just £12 for 12 issues.


Show comments
  • dmartin1910

    I think non-Democrats make too many assumptions about “Lib-Dems'” viewpoint on Israel. I am totally sympathetic with Israel’s claim to the land. I don’t think going to Iran is the best WAY to handle the problem, but that is a military plan/action disagreement, not a cause disagreement. I know many other “Lib-Dems” who feel the same way.
    I think it’s awful what the author said happens with party meetings every Yom Kippur. That is appalling and that is a government/office offense, not the “citizen Democrat’s” viewpoint. When I started seeing some posts about Lib-Dem Jews being an embarrassment to other Jews I was truly baffled and started looking online to see where these opinions came from. Individual politicians may have done some offensive things, but that needs to be communicated to the constituency so we can let them know with our votes that as “inclusives”, Democrats don’t approve of that behavior! I think it’s more of a big business/warfare/power problem than a liberal Democrat problem, myself. Jimmy Carter did more to progress relations with Israel and the Islams than ANY Republican ever did. And a lot of that was AFTER he left office because the “good ole’ boy” network wouldn’t let him get anything done.

  • Jacques Strap

    About half a million people died in Iraq as a result of war-related causes between the US-led invasion in 2003 and mid-2011……

  • Chubby Green

    SWP are opposed to Israel as are all left-wing fanatics like George Galloway. They’re no more anti-semitic than the left-wing BBC they’re merely a left-wing party.

  • Gentleman Jim Crow

    Why should a British political party organise its affairs around the 0.7% of the population who are Jewish?

    • sheridan porter

      Exactly Jim- far easier to back the fascist death-cult Hamas when your constituency is Bradford. Forget the 0.7%- they’ll never vote for you anyway, so call for their mass murder and say you’d be happy to pull the trigger then count the votes coming in from the Salafist fellow travellers. It worked just great in the 1930s, so Cleggy needs to get those brown shirts out and whip up the rhetoric. The 0.7% is dropping ever faster as our excitable vibrant immigrant population continues its campaign of terror and intimidation, so don’t worry about them, they’ll soon be gone.

  • Thats_news

    A party of dog killers. Every decent person should leave the Liberal Party (AKA LibDems) now.

    • HenryWood

      Is that you, Bron? 🙂

  • lookout

    Anti Israel is anti Semitic, Martin Luther King, he was a true liberal

    • Damaris Tighe

      Martin Luther King was a friend of Israel. In those days the left knew what’s what.

  • Jen The Blue

    There was an article on the Lib Dem site attacking David Ward and I was shocked by the number of Lib Dem members who disagreed with the journo and backed the vile Ward.
    But then when I think about, what else would I expect from the nastiest party in British politics?

    • Damaris Tighe

      The sooner they’re booted into fourth place the better.

  • Jackthesmilingblack

    Aren’t you confusing Israel with “za Jews”, Charlotte?

    • Newcombe

      LibDems say Israel when in a nudge, nudge, wink, wink kind of way, they mean Jews. We all know that, but are just afraid to say it.

      • mightymark

        Exactly – I keep reading things like “they are doing what was done to them at Auschwitz” – “them” being………?

        • Damaris Tighe

          and there’s a sort of salacious joy in it as well.

          • jjjj

            ‘The pleasures of Antisemitism’, an article by Eve Gerrard is apposite here.

    • Newcombe

      Do Muslims in the West, but also in other Islamic countries like Pakistan, Indonesia etc. support Palestinians or Hamas?

  • Newcombe

    It is simple democracy at work: votes.

    Jewish population is first, not large enough and second, not united enough to swing election results. Being the man in the middle, in a non-man’s land, LibDems have to appeal to the lowest common denominator to win votes in marginal seats, and unfortunately for Jews in Britain, that is where most of the Muslim votes are.

    Being “anti-Israeli” (read Jewish) brings in the votes. Now you or the moderators might not like what I’ve said, and instead may prefer some convoluted PC argument, but that is the simple truth.

    • Newcombe

      Below I have rewritten an extract of my above post:

      Jewish population (and other non-Muslim religious minorities like Sikhs, Hindus etc.) is first, not large enough and second, not united enough to swing election results. Being the man in the middle, in a non-man’s land, LibDems have to appeal to the lowest common denominator to win votes in marginal seats, and unfortunately for Jews in Britain (and other non-Muslim religious minorities like Sikhs, Hindus etc.), that is where most of the Muslim votes are.

      So whenever it comes to taking sides on both domestic and international matters (and lets face it, Israel/Palestine is not the only conflict or territorial issues in the world involving Muslim and other religious groups), politicians in Britain (and the West) will increasingly (and arguably) come down on the side of the voters who deliver.

      Again, simple democratic truth. Yes, unpalatable – maybe (so that means all non-Muslim minorities are at a disadvantage!), controvercial – perhaps (how dare I accuse politicians of pandering to voters!), non PC – yes, but reality – most certainly.

  • Augustus

    Only idiot Lib Dems would defend Hamas. Even Hamas is not defending Hamas: “Hamas operatives are fleeing, abandoning their positions, leaving behind weapons and other material that the IDF is using to expand its assault on the terror group. They simply escape, leaving behind weapons and suicide bomb vests that were laid out for battle.” So, even cowards! Typical Muslims! And typical losers too – probably sue for peace to get favourable terms while they re-arm for next time. Don’t you think we all ‘get it’?

  • peter walker

    Amazing to see Israel being called a ‘liberal democracy’ even as its tanks, for the third time in five years, are hammering and shelling a huge captive population of non-Jews, non-Jews who may not drive on West Bank highways (wrong race), who may not join the aforementioned ‘liberal democracy’ as equal citizens (wrong race again), but who may not have state of their own, who may not even apply to join UN agencies without ‘severe punishments’ just for applying, who may not fish off their own beaches, who may not even dig wells on their ancestral land, or add a spare bedroom to their ancestral homes, who face house-demolitions without even a trial of guilt, and whose children are shot at the whim of IDF marksmen with complete impunity. Some liberality! Some democracy!

    • Damaris Tighe

      No. Some roads in the West Bank are for cars with Israeli number plates only. They may be owned by Jews or Israeli Arabs or Thai agricultural workers. They exist because some Palestinians have the nasty habit of attacking Israeli cars, which has resulted in the deaths of babies & their mothers.

      I can see you’re dying to convict the Israelis of Jewish racialism but you are plain wrong.

    • Wessex Man

      very interesting that your well founded comment was posted 13 hours ago to only one reply from the ranters and that only about roads! Well done.

      • HenryWood

        Very interesting that your many ill founded comments about Israel seem to occupy so much of a self-proclaimed Christian’s time. Are you not an equal opportunities Christian who is prepared to stand against all slaughters of civilians everywhere? Why do you spend very little or even no time condemning much bigger slaughters all around the world? There is even a much larger humanitarian crisis going on just north of Israel. Palestinians in Syria are suffering far greater inhumanities than those allegedly visited upon Gaza. Why do you have this obsession with Palestinian deaths in Gaza but not in other parts of the Middle East? Do your Christian beliefs only kick in when a Jew is firing the gun?

    • lookout

      Check out the video on Steve Quales site where Hamas are beating Palastinian with sticks and batons to make them stay in an area were the Israelis have told them to leave because of retaliation strikes after Hamas rocket attacks on Israel, Abbas of Fatah was supposed to have elections 3 years ago, no election, just a totalitarian state were no Jews allowed to live, remind you of anywhere?

  • http://www.cix.co.uk/~kwh kwh

    I’m going to hazard a guess that the whole ‘mass murder, apartheid state’ thing probably informs their views. One cannot accurately describe Israel as a ‘liberal democracy’ when it is absorbing [i.e. stealing] the occupied territories without enfranchising the Palestinian population of those territories; all very pre-Mandela South-Africa from here, and that’s not democracy! Further nobody cheering the slaughter in Gaza could be described as Liberal, and several of the governing coalition could better be described as Judaofascists, as they exhibit intolerance & hate on a scale that would disbar you from office in many parts of the world…

    If you aspire to be a liberal democracy, expect to be held to a higher standard!

    • MrsDBliss

      Israel left the disputed territories some time ago. They’ve still had rockets fired at them.

      • Damaris Tighe

        The Israelis left Gaza but they’re still in parts of the West Bank because there’s no peace agreement with the Palestinian Authority. But your point is a good one because the present conflict is in Gaza. 🙂

        • Alexsandr

          gaza and west bank have separate governments just now. what has west bank issues got to do with Gaza or Hamas?

          • Damaris Tighe

            None whatsoever. That’s what I was saying to MrsDBliss. Read the two posts again – she made a good point but there was a factual error that I corrected.

        • Wessex Man

          ANSWER PETER WALKER’S COMMENT FIRST!

          • HenryWood

            Oh look! A self-proclaimed Christian anti-ranter yelling his head off. Wot a hypocrite.

            • Wessex Man

              not really , just trying to get the attention of someone not unlike you, who wants to shut daown all debate except that of which you approve, the only Hypocrites around here are Israel supporters like you and the Lib/dums.

              • HenryWood

                Stop ranting and try debating.

  • John Gerard

    Here’s a human shield, Hamas style!

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uWSuvNiz19s

  • Roger Hudson

    So only a Liberal cad wears socks with sandals? Are beards effeminate? All vital questions.
    Liberal surely means “i don’t care who you are, what you believe, what you do as long as it doesn’t adversely affect others”. There are good and bad Liberals as well as good and bad Jews.
    Everybody should be treated as an individual, not a member of a ‘type’.

    • MrsDBliss

      Except Judaism is a, ethnicity not a belief system. Therefore if you’re a Liberal your signing up to those beliefs. As a political party you might not align with all the beliefs, but when such blatant racism is on display and the party doesn’t deal with it then either you’re happy with racism or an anti-Semite to remain.

  • Bonkim

    Utter rubbish – why should the Lb-dems support Israel if it commits war-crimes?

    Israel today is a far cry from the Jewish nation once persecuted around the world. It is a major military power and not short on ruthless application of power and diplomatic guile to get what it wants. Add to that many Israelis have dual nationality and enjoying the benefits of both and influencing the politics of the countries they live in. No longer the underdog.

    • Damaris Tighe

      “No longer the underdog.” So what? Right isn’t automatically on the side of the underdog. It’s this sort of woolly, sentimental, un-thinking support of any party that’s losing, without any consideration of the morality of the situation, that’s subverting every worthwhile cause.

      • Bonkim

        Morality rests on the side of the Palestinians – idiot-Goonk! Israel was founded on stolen land helped by international powers who wanted a homeland for Europe’s persecuted Jews. So the lib-Dems have their morality O.K. I suppose you need some brain to think – visit the Wizard of OZ.

        • Damaris Tighe

          Israel was established by the UN which partitioned the land between Jews & Arabs. However, even if you consider Hamas’s cause is just – which I don’t concede – it’s against international law to launch rockets at civilian areas with the intention of causing civilian casualties. Israel is here to stay. It evacuated Gaza long ago. Israel is fully entitled to try to put a stop to the rockets.

          If you & your family ever have to live under this sort of attack I doubt you would be so nonchalant about it.

          • Bonkim

            In simple terms those that have nothing to lose don’t care if what is there of others is lost.

          • Bonkim

            So you go out and kill a few hundred trouble makers, blow up their homes, blockade the roads – and then feel you are safe.

        • Fergus Pickering

          There realy is plenty of land round there. Only a very small amount belongs to Israel.

          • Alexsandr

            lets not forget Israel is only about the size of wales.

            • GraveDave

              Well at least give Wales its proper hat old boy.

            • Bonkim

              but fighting above its weight. People cleverer than in Wales and more determined.

              • Damaris Tighe

                Your petticoat is slipping.

          • Bonkim

            Nothing belonged to Israel pre-1947 – but yes as an occupying force anything can belong to Israel as long as it is able to hold on to it.

            • Damaris Tighe

              Nothing belonged to Palestine either.

      • AJH1968

        i would put it like this, the Liberal Democrats are deliberately pandering to a large ultra conservative minority (with their tacit anti-semetic bias) in order to buy votes. Without any thought to the consequences, and a complete lack of principle and integrity. The outcome will be toxic for the party in the future. I do not think they strive to be anti-semetic, but neither do they try very hard to disabuse people of the notion that they could be anti-semetic.

    • Claire Finn

      Lots of people have dual nationality, not just Israelis. Thousands of Irish also have US nationality. Your implication is simply a variant of the old disloyal international Jew.

      • GraveDave

        The English don’t even have a nationality. But we still get the blame when things go wrong.

        • Bonkim

          The English with their Imperial history always were always above petty nationalism – why worry when everyone is proud to be British.

      • Bonkim

        Why keep a second passport – suspicious – regards loyalty – get serious someone with split loyalty – you are never sure which side they will spy for when it comes to the crunch. Many Japanese and German Americans were interned during WW2.

        • Damaris Tighe

          You have plenty to say about Israel & the loyalties of Jews but, on another thread, have no problem with the burqa. Your petticoat is slipping.

  • George Scoresby

    Stop picking on the Lib Dems. We are all Hamas now. The Joos have been asking for it. Please give it to them, Muslim brothers, and leave us Dhimmis alone.

    • Damaris Tighe

      We’re all Hamas now, we’re all Hezbollox now, how pretentious can you get?

      • George Scoresby

        you don’t do irony, do you?

        • Damaris Tighe

          I wasn’t getting at you, it was in agreement – the you wasn’t YOU!

          • George Scoresby

            What can I say? I don’t do irony very well myself.

            • Damaris Tighe

              🙂

  • alabenn

    You say.
    In the time I’ve been a member
    Are you still consorting with them, groping chairman, child molesting MPs, law perverting members and lying convicts, do you really think a bit of Jew hating would be hard for this sorry lot.

  • Conway

    Sadly, the Lib Dems are neither liberal nor particularly democratic.

  • anyfool

    By the way, British Jewry and Liberal affinities are from the Victorian times, you confuse Liberals of the old persuasion with the mealy mouthed nonentities who call themselves Liberal now, they have nothing in common but the word liberal, a word that has been prostituted beyond recognition by the likes of Thorpe, Steele the laughable Pantsdown and his latest pimp Clegg.
    You really ought to go and lie down in a dark room and contemplate why you were so easily taken in by the whole sordid lot.

  • Augustus

    Why do Lib Dems have such a propensity for supporting the wrong side of any cause, assuming they can actually see the facts (something they seem to instinctively ignore)? How could any civilized human being not unequivocally condemn Hamas and all who support them? Their tactics and goals are blatantly obvious, their lies transparent, and the fact that they actually desire their own civilians killed to use as political props is indisputable. One can’t help wondering if they would feel the same if their own neighbourhoods had been under attack for years by snipers, bombers, rockets and missiles by a terrorist group who, with millions of aid money at its disposal, created a terrorist state next door with a loudly proclaimed mission to exterminate them. But when Israel takes up arms it becomes fashionable in the liberal mind-set to despise Israel and Jews. So they’ll take the side of anyone or any group that opposes Israel.

  • laurence

    I’ve recommended it a few times on here, but it’s worth recommending again: Nick Cohen’s excellent What’s Left? Here you’ll find a pretty persuasive analysis and critique of how the liberal left ended up with some wholly unpleasant bedfellows.

    The Liberal Democrats will hopefully be no longer with us after the next election. Alas, the ghastly views espoused by various unsavoury members of this party, Tonge, Hughes, Ward, will re-surface elsewhere.

  • madasafish

    Applying logic to the the Lib Dems?

    That makes one fundamental mistake: they don’t think logically.

  • The_Missing_Think

    Maybe the Lib Dems haven’t got a problem with the Jews?

    Maybe the Jews have got a problem?

    Who else goes all loopy over the word…. the?

    It’s like the ‘n’ word, it all hinges on the user’s obvious modern historical attributes, not the actual word itself.

    In a word… baggage.

  • The Masked Marvel

    It’s both amusing and irritating to watch the same people who rush to tell us not to condemn all Muslims everywhere for the actions of extremist Muslims now telling us it makes sense to condemn all Jews everywhere for the actions of Israel.

  • http://jamesdowden.wordpress.com/ James Dowden

    The way you should answer the man in Golder’s Green is by joining the Conservative Party.

    • TimboX

      The way you should answer the man in Golder’s Green is by joining UKIP

    • Fergus Pickering

      I really don’t think anybody should join any party whatsoever, or sign anything he has not written himself. Or herself.

  • http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TDUvqXK4DEM DCinAZ

    It’s because they’re low-info and respond emotionally to visual stimuli in the absence of critical thinking. And also, America’s enemies are their friends. What does that say?

    • Damaris Tighe

      Sentimentalism.

  • OldSlaughter

    It’s standard with a wing of the Lib Dem’s mentality. They are for the weak, regardless of logic or principle.

    • pedestrianblogger

      Largely true but, if the weak are not the “right” kind of weak (persecuted Christian minorities in the Middle East, for example), they don’t give a damn.

      • Damaris Tighe

        They really have to be feckless as well to qualify.

      • MrsDBliss

        They don’t even fight back. Hamas is the instigator of this conflict.

      • OldSlaughter

        Yes, true. But then the enemy would be brown. And they are weak on the bigger stage. So it cannot happen.

  • S&A

    Bigotry amongst the rank-and-file, combined with moral cowardice on the part of the leadership.

    The sooner the Lib Dems are eliminated electorally, the better.

  • Damaris Tighe

    “[They] see Israel with a thriving economy & a proper military, & assume it makes it an evil Goliath”: this is the hub of the problem. Lefty-liberals have a bias against success. They dislike school prizes (rewarding merit) & they dislike making judgements between the deserving & the undeserving when awarding welfare payments. This is a complete world view which favours the undeserving simply because they’re small & needy & without regard to their behaviour. That’s why they hate Israel & love the Palestinians & nothing will persuade them to change their minds.

  • Right-Minded

    The Jews I’ve met are overwhelmingly nice and friendly people, BUT they’re also almost always very left-wing and liberals themselves. This is my problem with British Jews, I believe they are buying into and seeking the destruction of the British & English identity by supporting left-wing parties en masse, resulting in immigration, islamisation and even anti-Semitism funnily enough.

    However, I have no problem with Israel’s current operations in Gaza, ultimately they are defensive and to prevent its people from constant bombardment and fear. They have every right.
    As for the Lib Dems, they’re a vile party, I disagree with them strongly on almost every policy issue, and I look forward to their continued electoral destruction.

    • Damaris Tighe

      Agree with you except there are a lot of Jews who support the Tories & UKIP. They just don’t shout about it as much.

    • MrsDBliss

      I should imagine their support of liberalism is as a result of the holocaust. Original liberalism was about creating a society that didn’t persecute people for being outside the social norms.
      However since the 60s the majority of the client groups, like women etc, had achieved equality, so equality had to be redefined and new client groups sought.
      I always think modern liberals are like the tail end of the Victorian period. At the begining of the Victorian period charity for the poor, sexual morality to better society, politics aligned with the poor were very much the development of that period. However towards the end, as those good morals had been entrenched by the hard work and sacrifice of those looking to change the excesses of the Georgian society, and the virtues were accepted social practice people espoused them without little personal sacrifice and used them as a means to belittle others.
      People’s obsession with ‘checking your privilege’ etc always reminds me of Victorians covering piano legs. Their anti-Semitism is the equivalent if a Victorian man having a mistress.

    • Archibald Heatherington

      Right wing, proud-to-be-British, jingoistic Jew here!

      It’s a poorly-kept secret that actually, despite stereotypes, Jews in Britain are really mostly pretty conservative, often with a big “C” too. If that weren’t the case, there couldn’t have been four Jews in Thatcher’s Cabinet without a hugely bizarre feat of racist selection, and good Lady Thatcher, while a philosemite, was certainly not a racist. There are just lots of Jewish Conservatives.

      I hope we’ll be able to fit all the Lib Dem MPs in the back of a taxi come 2015.

  • ADW

    Does it really need explaining? The left detest Jews because they don’t behave like proper ethnic minorities. They are supposed to be an oppressed group forever agitating for government handouts and favours, Instead they are self-reliant and at the top or near enough with all social statistics.

    The left hates Israel because it is the only country with Western values in the Middle East, and there is a handy ethnic minority to support. Thus, when King Fahad of Jordan expelled the Palestinians,that was fine, because Jordan was not a democracy. The fact that the Arab countries controlled the disputed territories until 1967 yet did nothing to create a Palestinian state may be brushed over for the same reason.

    • Andy

      It was King Hussain of Jordan. King Fahad was King of Saudi Arabia from 1982 to 2005.

      • ADW

        You’re correct, sorry, my bad (it’s after 5pm on a Friday being my excuse)

    • Damaris Tighe

      The racism of low expectations?

      • ADW

        The racism of shunting people into fashionable minority groups, combined with the logical absurdities that come from trying to champion them all. Ken Livingstone found out the impossibility when he wanted to support gays and Muslims, then found the latter didn’t like the former very much. His solution was to abandon the former. With Jews, Ken decided they were all millionaire bankers and wouldn’t vote for him anyway, so instead he played to the Islamist gallery by making the odd anti semetic remark.

    • The_Missing_Think

      “They are supposed to be an oppressed group forever agitating for government handouts and favours…”
      _____

      That’s absurd.

      Remind me, who was screaming ‘Grey Uniform’ at any that tried to keep it just plain old Londonistan?

      So loudly, that 99.99% of the people reading this, here now today, are cowed into being more pro-Londonistan, than risk being called a grey uniformer. They’re broken.

      FYI – The DNA victim card, is used by ‘oppressed groups’ for favours.

      Screaming ‘Grey Uniform’, is screaming ‘oppressed victim’.

      • ADW

        Not quite sure you grasped what I was saying, I’m afraid.

        • The_Missing_Think

          “They are supposed to be an oppressed group forever agitating for government handouts and favours…”
          _____

          I unpack and decode the re-quote as… They don’t play the race card for ‘grants’ or anything else, because they don’t need to, unlike the others.

          Am I right or wrong?

      • HenryWood

        Can you tell me what “grey uniform” means, please? I tried looking it up on Google and the only link not mentioning school/grey uniforms was to this comment of yours in this thread.

  • global city

    The Liberal Democrats take most of their inspiration from internationalist ‘progressive liberal’ mores, not good ol’ liberalism. Progressives decided decades ago that Israel should be an enemy…and the Lib Dems, like all bovines have fallen into lock-step with the slavering wing of the SWP.

    • Martin Keegan

      Decades ago, or, to be precise, in 1966.

  • Andy

    You seem to be too stupid to see what is before your face. David Ward is a ghastly evil man, and yet the leadership of the LibDems doesn’t seem to want to do what it should – get rid of the scumbag.

    Like all of the Left the Libdems are only too happy to jump into bed with Islamofascists who loath and hate western democracy. So don’t be surprised when people slam the door in your face and call you Anti-Semitic because that is what you are.

    • Inverted Meniscus

      Exactly. Why draw a distinction between the Lib Dems and Fascist Labour?

  • Archibald Heatherington

    The LibDems support neither liberalism nor democracy.

    How can you be surprised that they’re full of absurd and unpleasant contradictions when their name invokes ideals they don’t hold, much in the manner of the Democratic Republic of the Congo or the Democratic People’s Republic of Korea?

    • Damaris Tighe

      Spot on.

  • swatnan

    In fact its the Tory Party which has so many closet anti semites in it; but they wouldn’t admit to it. And the Labour Party is too much tied into British Jewry (from Karl Marx, onwards) that Ed is going to have difficulty extricating itself from all that entanglement, which clouds Labours vision of doing the right thing. So its left to the Lib Dems to say and possibly do the right thing by the whole people of the Midd;e East, not just the Jews.

    • Colonel Mustard

      You really do write some bollox.

      http://davidduke.com/the-torah-party-jewish-supremacism-in-britain/

      Michael Howard, Olive Letwin, etc. Conservative Friends of Israel.

      • swatnan

        even their Jews are anti semitic..

        • Colonel Mustard

          I reckon you must be…

          • Wessex Man

            a cmplete halfwit but we already knew that Colonel!

    • Inverted Meniscus

      Do you ever, just for one day, think about taking a rest from talking utter bollux? We all know you are a socialist nutter and thus impervious to sense or reason but please, give it a rest.

    • Fergus Pickering

      In fact, meaning you think.

    • MrsDBliss

      Your first point is just conspiracy nonsense. I’m not a fan of the Tories, but your just making accusations which are unverifiable. It’s the lyrical equivalent of calling someone a slapper.
      Your third point is actually saying that the ‘right thing to say and possibly do” is to verbally support Hamas attacks on Israel and, as per the second part of your sentence, if they achieved government they’d what? Fund it too? A party committed the eradication of the Jewish state? This is how you rebut the argument that libDems are anti-Semitic?

      • swatnan

        In fact I dislike both zionist Israel and the islamist Hamas with equal intensity, and would prefer both to disappear off the face of the Earth, and leave the rest of us to live our lives in peace and security.
        All the problems in the ME emanate from this intractable problem. We need a new and better solution.

        • Andy

          ‘All the problems in the ME emanate from this intractable problem.’
          That comment shows how little you know, much less understand, the Middle East.

          • Alexsandr

            the problems in the ME stem from one religion wanting to eradicate all others, and especially the Jews.
            Read your Koran.

            • Andy

              I’ve read it: he hasn’t.

        • HenryWood

          Do you honestly believe that should Israel cease to be, that the violent tribes of Muslims living in the Middle East would somehow come to realise they have been practising their Religion of Peace all wrong, and would realise that the world could be all sweetness and light if they changed their ways. It would be the first time in the history of Islam.

  • Colin

    The fact that you know what you know about them, yet continue to be a member, is in itself a bit of a clue. The problem is, the lib dem party is full of people who are able to stomach or even condone these actions, and, at the same time profess to be appalled. People like you, in fact.

    A bit like saying: “That Hitler, he was a bit of a bugger, but it’s ok, because he built the autobahns and got the trains running on time. Grow up!

    • S&A

      She says she’s ‘been a member’.

      The use of the past tense suggests she’s no longer a Lib Dem.

      • uberwest

        She states in the article that she was canvassing for them 2 months ago.

        • S&A

          Actually she says ‘a couple of months’, which some people use to mean over two.

          And in any case, she could still have left them between her time canvassing and now.

  • JoeDM

    But it’s not just Lib Dems. Most of the so-called ‘progressive’ left now would rather support islamofascism than liberal democracy.

    • MaxSceptic

      I gain some comfort from knowing that should these nice Islamofacists ever gain power, these dumb ‘progressives’ will be first against the wall.

      • Atticus

        Actually I think they would be the first to join the club!

      • telemachus

        I think you may find that the progressives are more likely to gain power
        And you might as well book your wall space now

    • The Masked Marvel

      Indeed. The author wonders what has happened to the relationship between Jews and Liberal parties, but fails to notice that neither today’s LibDems nor Labour are particularly liberal.

    • dmartin1910

      What? Where is the fact that statement is based on? I don’t believe that.

  • Pootles

    I suspect that the Lib-Dems are getting a rather easy ride on this. Can you imagine the furore if it were UKIP that was the party with the anti-Semitic problem ?

    • Alexsandr

      they should be challenged about the Hamas policy of eradicating israel, as documented in their charter.
      how can a British political party not be challenged on supporting such a dreadful organisation?
      (Thats not counting the fact that HAMAS and ISIS are affiliated, and ISIS wants to mutilate the genitals of every female.)

      • LaurenceBoyce

        When did any Lib Dem ever support Hamas or Isis? You seem to be rapidly departing from reality here.

        • Whyshouldihavetoregister

          David Ward supports Hamas. So did Jenny Tonge. So does Alistair Carmichael (my MP, alas.)

          • LaurenceBoyce

            Completely and utterly untrue. Like so many on this thread, you are putting 2 and 2 together and making 17.

            • http://owsblog.blogspot.com Span Ows

              if you take the 1 and twist it out of shape and then take the 7 and bash and manipulate it into a curve you can sort of get 2 + 2; this twisting and manipulating is what happens to the truth in the I/P conflict. If for instance you get your news solely from the BBC you would not have the faintest idea about what is really happening or why. When any debate is started and lefty fools bang on about genocide and apartheid and terrorist state and Israeli murders you know they probably get the BBC world view and so have no idea whatsoever. The ‘supporting the Gazan people’ claim falls flat one or sentences into any defence of their stance.

            • Wessex Man

              I’ll add two and two together and ask what you thought about Jenny Tonge’s accusation that Israeli Aid workers were harvasting body parts in the Haiti disaster.

            • dmartin1910

              Thank you! It’s like they want it to be true so they have another reason to justify hating liberalism. But it just ISN’T true.

        • Alexsandr

          if you are sympathetic to the Gaza people over Israelis, then, by definition, you are supporting Hamas.

          • Damaris Tighe

            You can sympathise with the Gazan people, hate Hamas & support Israel’s actions re Gaza. They’re not incompatable.

            • Mike

              Absolutely agree but for lefties, thats an impossible position to take !

              • dmartin1910

                Wrong.

            • Tom M

              Yes they are. Do not forget the “election” in which Hamas was elected. They stood on a ticket of eradicating the state of Israel. This is an all but continuous theme on Gaza television, it is not a covert plot.
              The population of Gaza elected their leaders on this openly debated ambition.

              • Damaris Tighe

                Indeed, electorates have to be responsible for what they elect which is what’s happening in Gaza. It doesn’t stop me sympathising with the Gazans who hate Hamas or who weren’t even born when the election took place. Nor does it stop me from defending Israel’s right to self-defence at every opportunity.

                • Tom M

                  OK we can agree. I’ll go with that.

          • Jack

            If you think all Gazan people support Hamas, then you are, by definition, a fool.

          • Wessex Man

            What a stupid race filled comment!

          • dmartin1910

            I’m a democrat and I support Israelis over Palestinians or any other Islamic. I don’t think this is a party issue with this topic. I think it’s a personal belief issue. We have to ask more of these types of questions of our candidates before electing them into office.

        • Mike

          There’s such a thing called implied support by not attacking Hamas or Isis.

  • JoshuaCzajkowski

    Easy…the state of Israel stands for National Sovereignty, equality before the law of all its people, protection of its citizens, liberty and the democratic will of its people.

    • global city

      Exactly. It goes against all of the internationalist ideals espoused by the social democrat community.

      • Damaris Tighe

        All the post-modernist post-nationalist ideals.

        • global city

          In that utopia, I wonder who the ‘progressives’ think will rule over the Islamists? are they going to lay down their arms and their nutty religious hate in the seering logic of one world, secular rule?

          Perhaps one of the lunatic progressives who visit these threads could provide us with an answer?

          • Damaris Tighe

            Indeed. What they’re going to get if they’re not careful is a Caliphate.

      • GraveDave

        Doesn’t believe in race mixing though does it.

        • global city

          No. It is about sharp division and mistrust. Identity politics is a poison, deliberately advanced to cause the atomisation and destruction of any society into competing and resentful groups.

  • LaurenceBoyce

    “A perfect example is that, come October, they will have held their autumn party conference over Yom Kippur, the holiest day in the Jewish calendar, four years in a row.”

    That is really very lame. The party conferences are rather obviously stage-managed so that they occur on consecutive weeks for the three main parties. Yom Kippur doesn’t really come into it, and nor should it.

    I not sure I’m going to take anything you say too seriously from now on.

    • MrsDBliss

      So the fact that this stage management is more important than the sensibilities of Jews doesn’t mean they’re anti-Semitic? This from a party that espouses equality and diversity and inclusiveness at all other times? It isn’t, after all, impossible to move it – just inconvenient. It is also not seen as a much if a political liability to offend this group of people – I hate to introduce the obvious comparison, but would this happen during Ramadam?
      I note that your comments are normally all for the ‘inclusiveness’ mantra – you’re ready to impart your morally superior tone frequently. What is it about the Jews that you don’t think it is important to take your usual line?

      • GraveDave

        This from a party that espouses equality and diversity and inclusiveness at all other times?

        The libdems are still the whitest party of ‘straights’ going.
        (Despite their past reputation of rent boys and pederasty.)

  • Martin Keegan

    I get the feeling that the author is afraid to say more.

  • kyalami

    I am astonished you continue to support such a bigoted party.

  • bugalugs2

    “What is the Lib Dems’ problem with ‘the Jews’?”

    “anti-Israel and anti-Zionist sentiment can veer towards what could be regarded as anti-Semitism. It’s hard for the party leadership to take action against these outbursts. The perpetrators can legitimately say that party members are backing them. The leadership fears a backlash from activists.”

    I rather think you’ve answered your own question, haven’t you? If the leadership is afraid that too much of the membership shares the anti-semitic views of such ‘renegades’ then the obvious conclusion is that the LibDems ARE an anti-semitic party in large part.

    • Right-Minded

      Exactly right, it can be further explained by looking into the demographics of the constituencies of the Lib Dem MPs who most oppose Israel – e.g. Mr. Ward represents Bradford East…

      • RAnjeh

        It’s not just David Ward, it’s widespread across the Lib Dems. In Manchester Gorton in 2010, the Lib Dem candidate ran a very anti-Semitic campaign against Gerald Kaufman (and he happens to be pro-Palestinian). In 2005, Lorna Fitzsimons was the victim of a very anti-Semitic Lib Dem campaign led by Paul Rowen because she was a member of Labour Friends of Israel. They just can’t help themselves!

        • Damaris Tighe

          I’ve long thought that if there really is a ‘nasty party’ it’s the LibDems.

        • artemis in france

          Kaufman, another useful idiot who thinks that if he toadies to the libéral Left enough, radical Islamics will spare him when the day of reckoning comes for Jews and Israel. With Hamas, Isis, Boko Harum et al, how long before Jews everywhere are fleeing to Israel to save their lives? No wonder Israel is determined to destroy those tunnels. Will Kaufman join the exodus or will he continue to believe in the Palestinian cause (they voted for Hamas and its “destroy Israel” promise)? He’s a quisling, working against the interests of his own people – and himself.

    • dmartin1910

      I’m sorry, but that statement in quotes doesn’t even make sense.The leadership fears backlash from Islam activists or Pro-Israel activists? And HOW does that mean they’re anti-Israel and anti-Zionist? I hear a lot of barking, but no substantive proof. Maybe leftist-liberal means something else outside of the US, but here it stands for being more inclusive, and more sensitive to the rights of ALL, not just those who agree with us, as long as it doesn’t present a danger to others or break laws. Now maybe FAR left activists/anarchists, but not mainstream center to slightly left of center Democrats. Could UK Lib-Dems be that different from US Lib-Dems? Because this attitude does not represent the platforms OUR Democrats espouse at ALL.

Close
Can't find your Web ID? Click here