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Lib Dems David Ward and Edward McMillan-Scott on bombing Israel and ‘disputatious Jews’

23 July 2014

23 July 2014

There’s quite a stooshie this morning, following David Ward’s latest contribution to peace in the Middle East. The Liberal Democrat MP for Bradford East tweeted yesterday evening:

 

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Readers will recall that Ward has form here: accusing ‘the Jews’ of atrocities in Palestine on one occasion. Ward has been roundly condemned overnight. Grants Shapps, the Conservative Party Chairman, accused Ward of ‘inciting violence’, while Fleet Street reports that Ward may face internal disciplinary action. But, not all Liberal Democrats have rounded on Ward. On the contrary, Edward McMillan-Scott, a former MEP, leant his support:


Charming.

Update: Edward McMillan-Scott and David Ward have both apologised for these comments.


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  • http://www.macuniversal.com Malcolm Sinclair

    An issue which appears to be raised lies in the words ‘the Arabs will have very little land to defend’. This shows a total lack of understanding of the factual basis in relation to this area of the Middles East. When you say ‘Arabs’ what do you mean? Do you mean Arabs or Muslims or just Palestinians? When you say ‘land to defend’ that presupposes ownership to begin with. Neither Gaza or the West Bank or what used to be called Palestine has ever been ‘owned’ by the Palestinians. The sovereign entity was of course the Ottoman Empire. Ownership eventually passed via the Great Powers to the United Nations. They made a decision which if anyone doesn’t know what that was then, with respect they shouldn’t be taking an active part in this blog. These issues are wholly distinct from the moral argument that Palestinians ‘ought’ to have land of their own.
    A real problem at the moment is the manner in which these events are being portrayed by the Western Media which is little short of unbelievable. I am still trying to get my head around the kind of reporting by ITN, Sky, BBC and particularly Channel 4. I find little material difference between them and Al Jazeera. Of course there is nothing wrong with reporting the tragic humanitarian consequences of war, any war. That , however is only part of the story. The real story which many people want to hear and understand lies in the direct and indirect causes. I cannot believe that I am in the UK having to watch and listen to these propaganda artists who apparently have the right by the abuse of the doctrines ‘freedom of press’ and ‘freedom of expression’ to literally invade my home with their own personal and often self centred views. None of them have even tried to explain the meaning of the right of self defence or the true meaning of concepts such as ‘proportionality’ and the like. Perhaps, however, more important than anything else has anyone seen a T.V. programme or read an article which doesn’t begin with or include the words ‘Hamas’ or ‘Hamas militants’ by clearly stating: ‘The terrorist group Hamas has fired rockets at the sovereign state of Israel indiscriminately in a way which if they landed in some ones home they are likely to cause serious injury or death…..’ I am sorry, but to me there is no place in our country for the kind of reporting we are presently witnessing. No doubt had many of these so called reporters been around and reporting during the Second World War they would have been carrying pictures of women and children in Dresden after bombing by the RAF with the consequence of potential sympathy from the British people! They would, rightly, not have got it. These reporters should realise that probably the only reason why they are here to-day and able to report in the way which they are doing is because of the sacrifices made by many in defending the right of a sovereign state to defend its own people against terror attacks.

  • Mike

    Anyone can apologise after the event but its the knee jerk reaction that shows their true colours and Ward has shown his racism and bigotry against Israel !

  • Matthew Meadow

    Whether we like it or not, the west is at war with religious fascism. If Israel, which is at the epic centre, looses this crucial battle, the Islamic world will be emboldened without limits to take on their next challenge: which is us in the west. The first front on which this battle needs to be won, is in the media. In this sense The Spectator is doing more then a decent job, thanks.

  • http://www.military.com/spouse/military-deployment/reintegration/returning-to-home-life-after-deployment.html Jeffrey Dowling

    Thanks to Dr Brave for bringing back my wife,and brought great joy to my family?

    Hello to every one out here, am here to share the unexpected miracle that happened to me three days ago, My name is Jeffrey Dowling,i live in TEXAS,USA.and I`m happily married to a lovely and caring wife,with two kids A very big problem occurred in my family seven months ago,between me and my wife so terrible that she took the case to court for a divorce she said that she never wanted to stay with me again,and that she did not love me anymore So she packed out of my house and made me and my children passed through severe pain. I tried all my possible means to get her back,after much begging,but all to no avail and she confirmed it that she has made her decision,and she never wanted to see me again. So on one evening,as i was coming back from work,i met an old friend of mine who asked of my wife So i explained every thing to her,so she told me that the only way i can get my wife back,is to visit a spell caster,because it has really worked for her too So i never believed in spell,but i had no other choice,than to follow her advice. Then she gave me the email address of the spell caster whom she visited.(bravespellcaster@gmail.com}, So the next morning,i sent a mail to the address she gave to me,and the spell caster assured me that i will get my wife back the next day what an amazing statement!! I never believed,so he spoke with me,and told me everything that i need to do. Then the next morning, So surprisingly, my wife who did not call me for the past seven {7}months,gave me a call to inform me that she was coming back So Amazing!! So that was how she came back that same day,with lots of love and joy,and she apologized for her mistake,and for the pain she caused me and my children. Then from that day,our relationship was now stronger than how it were before,by the help of a spell caster . So, was now stronger than how it were before,by the help of a spell caster . So, i will advice you out there to kindly visit the same website http://bravespellcaster.yolasite.com,if you are in any condition like this,or you have any problem related to “bringing your ex back. So thanks to Dr Brave for bringing back my wife,and brought great joy to my family once again.{bravespellcaster@gmail.com} , Thanks.

    Are you passing through any of these problems,

    DO YOU NEED YOUR EX BACK VERY FAST

    DON YOU WANT YOUR LOVER TO LOVE YOU AS NEVER LIKE BEFORE

    ARE YOU SUFFERING FROM A LONG TIME SICKNESS

    ARE YOU FACING FINANCIAL PROBLEMS

    ARE YOU SEEKING FOR A GOOD JOB

    DO YOU WANT TO BECOME A HOUSE OWNER

    ARE YOU LOOKING FOR A FIRST CLASS GRADE

    DO YOU WANT TO COME OUT FIRST IN YOUR EXAMS

    ARE YOU A STAR AND YOU WANT TO BE SO POPULAR TO THE WHOLE WORLD

    DO YOU WANT TO BE RICH

    DO YOU WANT YOUR BUSINESS TO KEEP MOVING

    DO YOU HAVE A COMPANY OF ANY KIND AND YOU WANT IT TO EXPAND

    DO YOU WANT YOUR HUSBAND OR WIFE TO KEEP TO YOUR WORLD

    ARE YOU FACING ANY MARITAL PROBLEMS

    ARE YOU FINDING IT DIFFICULT TO GET PREGNANT FOR YOUR HUSBAND

    ARE YOU EXPERIENCING MISCARRIAGES ANY TIME YOU TAKE IN

    DO YOU WANT TO COMPETE IN ANY LOTTERY GAME

    ARE YOU FACING HARDSHIP

    HAVE YOU BEEN THREATENED BY SOMEONE

    DO YOU WANT TO BE SUCCESSFUL IN ANY THING YOU LAY YOUR HANDS ON

    IS YOUR SON OR DAUGHTER BEHAVING STRANGELY

    ARE YOU FACING WITCH CRAFT MANIPULATIONS

    DO YOU WANT TO CAST A STRONG LOVE SPELL ON YOUR GIRL OR BOY FRIEND

    DO YOU NEED MAGIC POWERS TO DO ANY THING YOU WANT

    ARE YOU FINDING IT DIFFICULT TO CHOOSE A LIFE PARTNER

    DO YOU WANT YOUR PARENTS TO BE PROUD OF YOU

    ARE YOU EXPERIENCING FAILURE AND DISAPPOINTMENT IN ANY THING YOU DO.(ETC)

    If you are facing any of these problems all you just need do is to contact him immediately email ( bravespellcaster@gmail.com )

    • Archibald Heatherington

      Somebody, please, make it stop!

      • http://www.military.com/spouse/military-deployment/reintegration/returning-to-home-life-after-deployment.html Jeffrey Dowling

        Thanks to Dr Brave for bringing back my wife,and brought great joy to my family?

        Hello to every one out here, am here to share the unexpected miracle that happened to me three days ago, My name is Jeffrey Dowling,i live in TEXAS,USA.and I`m happily married to a lovely and caring wife,with two kids A very big problem occurred in my family seven months ago,between me and my wife so terrible that she took the case to court for a divorce she said that she never wanted to stay with me again,and that she did not love me anymore So she packed out of my house and made me and my children passed through severe pain. I tried all my possible means to get her back,after much begging,but all to no avail and she confirmed it that she has made her decision,and she never wanted to see me again. So on one evening,as i was coming back from work,i met an old friend of mine who asked of my wife So i explained every thing to her,so she told me that the only way i can get my wife back,is to visit a spell caster,because it has really worked for her too So i never believed in spell,but i had no other choice,than to follow her advice. Then she gave me the email address of the spell caster whom she visited.(bravespellcaster@gmail.com}, So the next morning,i sent a mail to the address she gave to me,and the spell caster assured me that i will get my wife back the next day what an amazing statement!! I never believed,so he spoke with me,and told me everything that i need to do. Then the next morning, So surprisingly, my wife who did not call me for the past seven {7}months,gave me a call to inform me that she was coming back So Amazing!! So that was how she came back that same day,with lots of love and joy,and she apologized for her mistake,and for the pain she caused me and my children. Then from that day,our relationship was now stronger than how it were before,by the help of a spell caster . So, was now stronger than how it were before,by the help of a spell caster . So, i will advice you out there to kindly visit the same website http://bravespellcaster.yolasite.com,if you are in any condition like this,or you have any problem related to “bringing your ex back. So thanks to Dr Brave for bringing back my wife,and brought great joy to my family once again.{bravespellcaster@gmail.com} , Thanks.

        Are you passing through any of these problems,

        DO YOU NEED YOUR EX BACK VERY FAST

        DON YOU WANT YOUR LOVER TO LOVE YOU AS NEVER LIKE BEFORE

        ARE YOU SUFFERING FROM A LONG TIME SICKNESS

        ARE YOU FACING FINANCIAL PROBLEMS

        ARE YOU SEEKING FOR A GOOD JOB

        DO YOU WANT TO BECOME A HOUSE OWNER

        ARE YOU LOOKING FOR A FIRST CLASS GRADE

        DO YOU WANT TO COME OUT FIRST IN YOUR EXAMS

        ARE YOU A STAR AND YOU WANT TO BE SO POPULAR TO THE WHOLE WORLD

        DO YOU WANT TO BE RICH

        DO YOU WANT YOUR BUSINESS TO KEEP MOVING

        DO YOU HAVE A COMPANY OF ANY KIND AND YOU WANT IT TO EXPAND

        DO YOU WANT YOUR HUSBAND OR WIFE TO KEEP TO YOUR WORLD

        ARE YOU FACING ANY MARITAL PROBLEMS

        ARE YOU FINDING IT DIFFICULT TO GET PREGNANT FOR YOUR HUSBAND

        ARE YOU EXPERIENCING MISCARRIAGES ANY TIME YOU TAKE IN

        DO YOU WANT TO COMPETE IN ANY LOTTERY GAME

        ARE YOU FACING HARDSHIP

        HAVE YOU BEEN THREATENED BY SOMEONE

        DO YOU WANT TO BE SUCCESSFUL IN ANY THING YOU LAY YOUR HANDS ON

        IS YOUR SON OR DAUGHTER BEHAVING STRANGELY

        ARE YOU FACING WITCH CRAFT MANIPULATIONS

        DO YOU WANT TO CAST A STRONG LOVE SPELL ON YOUR GIRL OR BOY FRIEND

        DO YOU NEED MAGIC POWERS TO DO ANY THING YOU WANT

        ARE YOU FINDING IT DIFFICULT TO CHOOSE A LIFE PARTNER

        DO YOU WANT YOUR PARENTS TO BE PROUD OF YOU

        ARE YOU EXPERIENCING FAILURE AND DISAPPOINTMENT IN ANY THING YOU DO.(ETC)

        SO good people of the world i want you to help me in saying a big thank you to Dr.Brave for his intervention. This is one Dr i will seriously recommend for anyone with issues of such nature or any other problem. Simply contact him on his email via bravespellcaster@gmail.com,or kindly visit he website http://bravespellcaster.yolasite.com .

        • Archibald Heatherington

          Mods?!? Coo-ee! Over here!

          • http://www.military.com/spouse/military-deployment/reintegration/returning-to-home-life-after-deployment.html Jeffrey Dowling

            kindly visit the same website http://bravespellcaster.yolasite.com

  • http://www.military.com/spouse/military-deployment/reintegration/returning-to-home-life-after-deployment.html Jeffrey Dowling

    Thanks to Dr Brave for bringing back my wife,and brought great joy to my family?

    Hello to every one out here, am here to share the unexpected miracle that happened to me three days ago, My name is Jeffrey Dowling,i live in TEXAS,USA.and I`m happily married to a lovely and caring wife,with two kids A very big problem occurred in my family seven months ago,between me and my wife so terrible that she took the case to court for a divorce she said that she never wanted to stay with me again,and that she did not love me anymore So she packed out of my house and made me and my children passed through severe pain. I tried all my possible means to get her back,after much begging,but all to no avail and she confirmed it that she has made her decision,and she never wanted to see me again. So on one evening,as i was coming back from work,i met an old friend of mine who asked of my wife So i explained every thing to her,so she told me that the only way i can get my wife back,is to visit a spell caster,because it has really worked for her too So i never believed in spell,but i had no other choice,than to follow her advice. Then she gave me the email address of the spell caster whom she visited.(bravespellcaster@gmail.com}, So the next morning,i sent a mail to the address she gave to me,and the spell caster assured me that i will get my wife back the next day what an amazing statement!! I never believed,so he spoke with me,and told me everything that i need to do. Then the next morning, So surprisingly, my wife who did not call me for the past seven {7}months,gave me a call to inform me that she was coming back So Amazing!! So that was how she came back that same day,with lots of love and joy,and she apologized for her mistake,and for the pain she caused me and my children. Then from that day,our relationship was now stronger than how it were before,by the help of a spell caster . So, was now stronger than how it were before,by the help of a spell caster . So, i will advice you out there to kindly visit the same website http://bravespellcaster.yolasite.com,if you are in any condition like this,or you have any problem related to “bringing your ex back. So thanks to Dr Brave for bringing back my wife,and brought great joy to my family once again.{bravespellcaster@gmail.com} , Thanks.

    Are you passing through any of these problems,

    DO YOU NEED YOUR EX BACK VERY FAST

    DON YOU WANT YOUR LOVER TO LOVE YOU AS NEVER LIKE BEFORE

    ARE YOU SUFFERING FROM A LONG TIME SICKNESS

    ARE YOU FACING FINANCIAL PROBLEMS

    ARE YOU SEEKING FOR A GOOD JOB

    DO YOU WANT TO BECOME A HOUSE OWNER

    ARE YOU LOOKING FOR A FIRST CLASS GRADE

    DO YOU WANT TO COME OUT FIRST IN YOUR EXAMS

    ARE YOU A STAR AND YOU WANT TO BE SO POPULAR TO THE WHOLE WORLD

    DO YOU WANT TO BE RICH

    DO YOU WANT YOUR BUSINESS TO KEEP MOVING

    DO YOU HAVE A COMPANY OF ANY KIND AND YOU WANT IT TO EXPAND

    DO YOU WANT YOUR HUSBAND OR WIFE TO KEEP TO YOUR WORLD

    ARE YOU FACING ANY MARITAL PROBLEMS

    ARE YOU FINDING IT DIFFICULT TO GET PREGNANT FOR YOUR HUSBAND

    ARE YOU EXPERIENCING MISCARRIAGES ANY TIME YOU TAKE IN

    DO YOU WANT TO COMPETE IN ANY LOTTERY GAME

    ARE YOU FACING HARDSHIP

    HAVE YOU BEEN THREATENED BY SOMEONE

    DO YOU WANT TO BE SUCCESSFUL IN ANY THING YOU LAY YOUR HANDS ON

    IS YOUR SON OR DAUGHTER BEHAVING STRANGELY

    ARE YOU FACING WITCH CRAFT MANIPULATIONS

    DO YOU WANT TO CAST A STRONG LOVE SPELL ON YOUR GIRL OR BOY FRIEND

    DO YOU NEED MAGIC POWERS TO DO ANY THING YOU WANT

    ARE YOU FINDING IT DIFFICULT TO CHOOSE A LIFE PARTNER

    DO YOU WANT YOUR PARENTS TO BE PROUD OF YOU

    ARE YOU EXPERIENCING FAILURE AND DISAPPOINTMENT IN ANY THING YOU DO.(ETC)

    If you are facing any of these problems all you just need do is to contact him immediately email ( bravespellcaster@gmail.com )

  • Udi Mishan

    To all the True BRITS of the UK!
    Listen to the words of your No. 1 Soldier, Colonel Richard Kemp.

    Would you rather take his words, or take the words of the angry, violent, Muslim mob that break and destroy London streets?!

    https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?v=10154338997685147&set=vb.602490146&type=2&theater

    True BRITS, Our friends!
    The Israeli people is in need of your help and support!
    We remember Winston Churchill, who was a true and dear friend to Israel and the Jewish people!
    Please don’t be diverted of this great man’s path!
    Let your voice be heard!

  • http://www.military.com/spouse/military-deployment/reintegration/returning-to-home-life-after-deployment.html Jeffrey Dowling

    Thanks to Dr Brave for bringing back my wife,and brought great joy to my family?

    Hello to every one out here, am here to share the unexpected miracle that happened to me three days ago, My name is Jeffrey Dowling,i live in TEXAS,USA.and I`m happily married to a lovely and caring wife,with two kids A very big problem occurred in my family seven months ago,between me and my wife so terrible that she took the case to court for a divorce she said that she never wanted to stay with me again,and that she did not love me anymore So she packed out of my house and made me and my children passed through severe pain. I tried all my possible means to get her back,after much begging,but all to no avail and she confirmed it that she has made her decision,and she never wanted to see me again. So on one evening,as i was coming back from work,i met an old friend of mine who asked of my wife So i explained every thing to her,so she told me that the only way i can get my wife back,is to visit a spell caster,because it has really worked for her too So i never believed in spell,but i had no other choice,than to follow her advice. Then she gave me the email address of the spell caster whom she visited.(bravespellcaster@gmail.com}, So the next morning,i sent a mail to the address she gave to me,and the spell caster assured me that i will get my wife back the next day what an amazing statement!! I never believed,so he spoke with me,and told me everything that i need to do. Then the next morning, So surprisingly, my wife who did not call me for the past seven {7}months,gave me a call to inform me that she was coming back So Amazing!! So that was how she came back that same day,with lots of love and joy,and she apologized for her mistake,and for the pain she caused me and my children. Then from that day,our relationship was now stronger than how it were before,by the help of a spell caster . So, was now stronger than how it were before,by the help of a spell caster . So, i will advice you out there to kindly visit the same website http://bravespellcaster.yolasite.com,if you are in any condition like this,or you have any problem related to “bringing your ex back. So thanks to Dr Brave for bringing back my wife,and brought great joy to my family once again.{bravespellcaster@gmail.com} , Thanks.

    Are you passing through any of these problems,

    DO YOU NEED YOUR EX BACK VERY FAST

    DON YOU WANT YOUR LOVER TO LOVE YOU AS NEVER LIKE BEFORE

    ARE YOU SUFFERING FROM A LONG TIME SICKNESS

    ARE YOU FACING FINANCIAL PROBLEMS

    ARE YOU SEEKING FOR A GOOD JOB

    DO YOU WANT TO BECOME A HOUSE OWNER

    ARE YOU LOOKING FOR A FIRST CLASS GRADE

    DO YOU WANT TO COME OUT FIRST IN YOUR EXAMS

    ARE YOU A STAR AND YOU WANT TO BE SO POPULAR TO THE WHOLE WORLD

    DO YOU WANT TO BE RICH

    DO YOU WANT YOUR BUSINESS TO KEEP MOVING

    DO YOU HAVE A COMPANY OF ANY KIND AND YOU WANT IT TO EXPAND

    DO YOU WANT YOUR HUSBAND OR WIFE TO KEEP TO YOUR WORLD

    ARE YOU FACING ANY MARITAL PROBLEMS

    ARE YOU FINDING IT DIFFICULT TO GET PREGNANT FOR YOUR HUSBAND

    ARE YOU EXPERIENCING MISCARRIAGES ANY TIME YOU TAKE IN

    DO YOU WANT TO COMPETE IN ANY LOTTERY GAME

    ARE YOU FACING HARDSHIP

    HAVE YOU BEEN THREATENED BY SOMEONE

    DO YOU WANT TO BE SUCCESSFUL IN ANY THING YOU LAY YOUR HANDS ON

    IS YOUR SON OR DAUGHTER BEHAVING STRANGELY

    ARE YOU FACING WITCH CRAFT MANIPULATIONS

    DO YOU WANT TO CAST A STRONG LOVE SPELL ON YOUR GIRL OR BOY FRIEND

    DO YOU NEED MAGIC POWERS TO DO ANY THING YOU WANT

    ARE YOU FINDING IT DIFFICULT TO CHOOSE A LIFE PARTNER

    DO YOU WANT YOUR PARENTS TO BE PROUD OF YOU

    ARE YOU EXPERIENCING FAILURE AND DISAPPOINTMENT IN ANY THING YOU DO.(ETC)

    IF you are in any condition like this,or you have any problem related to “bringing your ex back. So thanks to Dr Brave for bringing back my wife,and brought great joy to my family once again.{bravespellcaster@gmail.com} , Thanks…

  • swatnan

    I don’t think the rest of the World is prepared to put up with another 50 years of ‘disputation’ and all the collateral damage that comes from it. I’m certainly not, and the mood is shifting away from Israel. This Palestine problem is the root cause of the all increasiing insecurity in the modern world, and it all goes back to the creation of a ‘2 State solution’ to appease the zionists. It should never have been done. It should have been independence for ‘One Palestine’ with Jew and Arab living side by side, in Palestine as they did prior to 1948. Unless we, the world, unpicks that decision there is never going to be any peace or stability in that area at all.

    • Alexsandr

      Rubbish. The Islamists want to destroy Israel. The religion of peace doesn’t like dissenters.

    • Damaris Tighe

      ‘Jew & Arab living side by side’: do you mean like Christian & Muslim living side by side in Syria, Lebanon, Sudan, Iraq, Nigeria, CAR, Kenya?

      • swatnan

        Perhaps, before the ‘Arab Spring’ and the East Africans were subject to these wretched islamists. But, these wretched islamists are the direct result of the Palestine problem; just trace the roots back to 1948.
        By sidebyside, I mean as in Northern Ireland Catholic and Protestant sharing power and responsibility. It can work, and it must be made to work, even at the expense of the Stae of Israel ceasing to exist.
        The Jews are going to have to make the biggest sacrifice of their lives in the interests of peace and harmony. TINA.

  • Peter Stroud

    There seems to be a disproportionate number of nasty people in the LibDems.

  • zanzamander

    But you can’t deny that David Ward speaks for a large proportion of our British Muslim citizens, who on the whole, far out number the Jewish population.

    So here’s the rub: For whom do our politicians, media, educators and law makers work/speak – for a rising population or a declining one, for the majority or a minority?

    Extrapolate this on the map of the world. It is plain to see that there are far more Islamic countries with bigger and increasing population. Now against this, how many Jewish countries and what is their population in comparison?

    The fact of the matter is that on demography, political influence and sheer religious temperament, Jews are on their own – and not for the first time in history.

    David Ward and many politicians of his ilk, media, educators etc. know which side their bread is buttered.

    • Alexsandr

      he should be in a police cell being charged with inciting racial hatred.

      • zanzamander

        What have I said that is so bad that it is “waiting to be approved”? All I have said is that David Ward is doing his job as a politician, speaking for a large portion of the electorate. What is wrong with that?

        I don’t understand the new moderation policy.

        • Shazza

          You told the truth.

          • Andy

            He is still a scumbag.

            • Shazza

              Agree regarding David Ward. Zanzamander got moderated for saying that moslem votes are more important than Jewish votes. Perfectly ok to be anti Semitic but ‘islamophobic’ is beyond the pale.
              Telling the truth is now ‘hate speech’ in our new upside down world.
              Watch this post disappear.

              • Andy

                Well in Bradford West the scumbag Ward has a bigger Muslim vote than he has a Jewish vote, so in that regard he was/is ‘playing to the gallery’. But I think it is disgusting how anti-Semitic so many on the left actually are. Usually you will hear them say ‘I am not anti-Semitic, I’m anti-Zionist’, but that is always a cop out and crap. The ‘Islamophobic’ bullshit so beloved of the left is exactly that: it is also disgusting how Christianophobic so many of their Islamic buddies are.

                • Shazza

                  Totally agree but what I really, really, really cannot understand is why so many Jewish people are Lefties.
                  I fear for the Jewish population in Europe, the videos and photos of the anti-Semitic marches/riots especially in France and Germany are very scary. Banners saying ‘Hitler was right’ are some of the mildest. Has the West gone mad?

                • Damaris Tighe

                  Yes.

                • Andy

                  Well many of those who formed ‘lefty thought’ were Jews, and many lefties were Jews, to-wit the Ralph ‘I Hate Britain’ Miliband. There was a strong ‘Socialist’ spirit in early Israel.

                  But like you I was saddened to see the riots in France and especially in Germany. And although I am a Tory I am very sad to see the left in general only too happy to jump into bed with Islamists. I suppose they do so because Islamists hate western society just as so many lefties do, but they will probably end up the first to be exterminated.

                  And in answer to you last remark, yes the West has gone quite mad.

                • Archibald Heatherington

                  Plenty of us know that the natural home of Jews is on the right. The left today are the ones who would have wanted to appease Hitler, who want to take away our right to practice our religion because we’re not Muslims (notice the outcry about circumcision and ritually slaughtered meats is always targeted at Jews, not Muslims?), and who see our largely successful integration and assimilation into British society as an insult to their multiculturalism, in contrast to Islamic importation of stone-age ‘diversity’, which of course they find oh so congenial.

                  I can see no good reason why Jews should not be right wing.

                • Shazza

                  Agree and FYI I am not Jewish, just a secular, Conservative who stands not only with Israel, but is a great admirer of Jewish people and their massive contribution to mankind in general.
                  I abhor anti Semitism in any form and am heartbroken at what is happening now to worldwide Jewry.
                  I being a baby boomer, never thought that in my lifetime I would live to see a rerun of the hatred that now permeates the ‘Liberal’ Left and their fellow bedmate islam that so blighted civilisation in Hitler’s Germany.

        • Damaris Tighe

          I don’t understand either.

  • HookesLaw

    Liberals are very liberal until they come across someone who does not agree with them. Or should I be relly criticising Liberal Democrats and not ‘liberals’?

  • Andy

    Ward is a well known scumbag. Typical LibDem.

  • monty61

    It matters not a jot what any Lib Dem says about anything. They are all toast come next May.

    • laurence

      We can but hope.

  • MirthaTidville

    I`ve said it before and I`ll say it again:…If the Arabs laid down their weapons tomorrow there would be no more war.If Israel laid down its weapons tomorrow there would be no more Israel.

    • Adrian Drummond

      Well, if the Arabs laid down their weapons they’d have no land left to defend.

      To illustrate the point, here is a map showing how Israel has turned Palestine into the biggest open-air prison on the planet:

      https://twitter.com/amazinmaps/status/490920899420246017/photo/1

      • Alexsandr

        Israel was founded in 1948. then the Arabs attacked. WTF do you expect? The Israelis are fighting for survival. The islamists are fighting to eradicate Israel. Dont take it from me, read your Koran and the Hamas Charter.

        • Adrian Drummond

          Please try and address the salient point:

          The Arabs have very little land left to defend.

          • girondas2

            “The Arabs have very little land left to defend.”
            Careful, irony doesn’t always go down well.

          • http://biasedbbc.proboards.com/index.cgi Teddy Bear

            The Arabs have very little land left to defend.
            Your ignorance is astounding, or have you been relying on the BBC to inform you?
            Israel takes up 0.01% of total Arab land.
            Ignoring facts makes it easier for idiots to maintain the view that they believe will make them popular.

            • Adrian Drummond

              Ah, yes, ignoring Israeli facts, how stupid of me.

              • Alexsandr

                well done. show us your anti-semitism. Your hatred of Jews is colouring your judgement.

                • Adrian Drummond

                  see below

              • http://biasedbbc.proboards.com/index.cgi Teddy Bear

                I know you’re stupid.
                While geography and demographics have nothing to do with ‘Israeli facts’, I wish you’d boycott Israel. Start by throwing out your computer and mobile phone – they’re just Israeli facts.

              • global city

                you desperately wanted to write ‘Jew facts’

          • Damaris Tighe

            Oh good lord ….

            • Adrian Drummond

              That’s just what i thought…

        • Patriccia Shaw

          Fighting for survival cannot equate to being seen to try to obliterate Gaza.

          You use emotive tones to ridicule any attempt to criticise the military actions of Israel.

          Just like Emma Barnett(DT):

          “Anti-Semitism is on the rise in Germany, too. In Essen, 14 people have just been arrested, accused of plotting an attack on a synagogue. Protesters at a rally in Berlin turned on two Israeli tourists (identifiable by the man’s skull-cap) so viciously that they had to be protected by the police. The city’s authorities have also had to ban pro-Gaza protesters from chanting anti-Semitic slogans and are investigating a sermon last week by Abu Bilal Ismail calling on worshippers at Berlin’s Al-Nur mosque to murder Jews. Jews, not Israelis.”

          She clearly wants to emote anti-Semitism to prevent criticism of the rogue military state of Israel.

          • Kitty MLB

            Oh do give it a rest.

          • girondas2

            As Kitty said – give it a rest, many of are sick to death of fanatical anti-semites trying to hide their racial prejudice behind critcism of the supposedly wicked state of Israel. You know as well as I do that if the israelis dropped the resolute defense of their country they would be killed faster than the christians in Mosul, who are, I daresay, also guilty of “stealing arab land”

            • Damaris Tighe

              Great post. The latest news is that Hamas have used their cement to build a tunnel rigged with bombs under an Israeli kindergarten. Cement that could have been used for building homes & facilities. This is why Israel prevents cement from being brought into Gaza.

              • Alexsandr

                ‘Cement that could have been used for building homes & facilities.’ … or air raid shelters.

          • Tom M

            Good afternoon Patriccia. I’m glad you’ve dropped the “occupation” claims this time.
            However, see my post to Alexsandr above.
            If you are looking for rougue military states just take a look at the activities of these nice people in Iraq and Syria and tell me whether you would be better off in Israel or Syria? Who would you prefer to negotiate with?
            Never forget in the middle east we are commenting upon an ongoing war. In wartime the rules change. Britain’s bombing of German cities during WW2 for example. Do I condone that? I would like to but I wasn’t there and, it was a war. People get killed in wars. The clever part is not to have them.
            The arabs don’t understand that and the current alternative, the UN, is powerless to do anything constructive other than offer more talks with someone who wants to kill you.

          • global city

            ‘Rogue military State’ You forgot to add apartheid state…amongst other idiocies.

            Do you not realise that you are being duped by evil Marxists and religious nuts?

        • Tom M

          Quite so Alexsandr. When comparisons are drawn between the Israelis and the militants in Gaza (and all the other armed groups around Israel) it never seems to be appreciated that these are exactly the same people who are running amok in Iraq and Syria at the moment and dream of doing so in Israel.

          • Alexsandr

            …dream of doing so in Israel. -and Europe.

      • Adam

        …and which of those maps would you prefer we reverted back
        to?

        Be under no illusion, even the 1946 image has too many
        speckles of white for Hamas & Co. to tolerate.

        • Adrian Drummond

          Again, you are not addressing my point:

          The Palestinain Arabs have very little land left to defend.

          • Adam

            I did. But I’ll try again…

            Based on the maps you uploaded, which one (if any) will result in them no longer feeling the need to “defend” themselves?

            If you’re still confused, I’ll pop to the shop and buy some crayons for my next attempt.

            • Adrian Drummond

              Sorry, you tried but have still failed to address the very simple point:

              The Palestinian Arabs have very little land left to defend.

              • Alexsandr

                Maybe the israelis fear this could happen to them.

                http://www.manilatimes.net/kidnapped-filipino-worker-beheaded-in-libya/113235/

                Bit off topic for which I dont apologise. Picking out people to execute is what we fought the Nazis for.

              • Alexsandr

                The palestinians don’t want the israelis there full stop. If you had stopped before ranting on and read the Hamas Charter you would know this. They have the authority of the Koran to slay Jews and Hamas have sworn to eradicate Israel.
                Anyway, Israel has not taken any Gaza land. Why is Hamas, which is the Gaza government, fighting on this pretext? No rockets from Fatah on the west bank. Anyone with half a brain will realise that they are fighting an anti israel propganda war, Lots of dead bodies for the TV news. And your comments show they are winning.
                If Hams really cared about the Gaza people they would have built air raid shelters etc. Thats why they have failed to kill Israelis. they have a decent civil defence system. or better still not fire rockets indiscriminately at civilian targets.

                • Adrian Drummond

                  Thank you for your considered reply to the point I raised.

                  The only part that seemed relevent was your comment :

                  “Anyway, Israel has not taken any Gaza land.”

                  Quite; this is the point exactly; it’s all they have left.

                • Alexsandr

                  think there is a fair bit of west bank. Geography not your strong point?

                • Adrian Drummond

                  “A fair bit”… ? Unfortunately, with so many new settlements are being built on Palestinian land, the map makers can’t keep.

                • Alexsandr

                  if its so bad, why not go to another country? Loads of people do migrate so it cant be all bad, can it?
                  life is what you make if it, and you only get one go.

                  there is always Israel. there are Muslims there doing OK I hear.

                • Adrian Drummond

                  Sorry, I have no idea how this relates to my original point:

                  The Palestinian Arabs have very little land left to defend.

                • Alexsandr

                  so go somewhere else. what is hard to understand? No-one makes anyone stay in Gaza.
                  read wiki entry on Gaza. looks like the Gaza government has made things a whole lot worse with daft policies. Not least with regards diesel.

                • Adrian Drummond

                  Ok .they can go, as you suggest, or stay and fight ….and if they choose to fight, don’t complain here about it, … hence my original point. They have every right to resist those that have taken their land by force.

                  I really can’t fathom why it seems so hard for your to grasp such a basic and obvious point.

                  Anyway, let’s end on some good news:

                  http://mondoweiss.net/2014/07/israel-alienating-mainstream.html

                • Damaris Tighe

                  The Israelis evacuated Gaza nine years ago. There are no Israelis there. None. Despite the fact that some of the most ancient Jewish communities in the world were once in Gaza.

                • Adrian Drummond

                  And your point is?

                • Alexsandr

                  If there are no Israelis in Hamas controlled Gaza then what is the beef? Conflating the 2 separate entities of Gaza and West Bank isnt helpful. Fatah dont send rockets to Israel and they are the w bank government.
                  What part of ‘Hamas dont care about land. they want a PR war to embarrass Israel as part of their declared aim to destroy Israel and the Jews’ dont you understand?

                • Adrian Drummond

                  Look, I’m happy to discuss my original point but either you do not understand it or you’re echoosing to deflect it to something different. My knowledge of the area is predicated on T. E. Lawrences’ ‘Seven Pillars of Wisdom.’ I do not attach much value on the history that comes much after that.

                • Alexsandr

                  ‘Their land’ not sure whose land it is. It all belonged to the Ottoman empire before WW1. I think you need to check out how the land ownership worked through the years through the British Mandate up to present. I understand the land passed to Israel in 1948 as the legal state sanctioned by the UN. Perhaps you have documentary evidence that the Palestinians have any legal right to the land.

                  Without this then your whole argument falls down.
                  beware there are some spurious maps that claim to show Israeli land grab, but they compare apples and oranges and so should be ignored.
                  Under Ottoman land tenure was complicated so be careful.

                • Damaris Tighe

                  After the British hived eastern Palestine off & created an Arab state called Trans-Jordan, the UN partitioned the remaining land west of the River Jordan between Jews & Arabs. The Jews accepted the partition, the Arabs didn’t. The rest is history.

                • Alexsandr

                  so thArabs invaded on the first day of Israel in 1948. Sort of set the scene really, didnt it?

                • Adrian Drummond

                  yea, I remember reading about the Irgun gang in 1946; Israeli terrorist group under Begin. Bombed the King David Hotel and killed innocent British soldiers. No wonder we caved in to their pressure . Absolute scum…

                • Damaris Tighe

                  Ah, so that’s why you don’t like Israel.

                • Adrian Drummond

                  No, although i’ve worked throughout the middle east and been in the presence of the great Yitzhak Rabin, a much younger Netanyahu, Arafat and others, i’ve been disgusted by Israeli brutalty, regardless of the provocation. Much of the sympathy the Jews rightly deserved after WWII gradually seems to seep away as the years go by… it is a monumental human tragedy.

                • Damaris Tighe

                  Yes.

                • Adrian Drummond

                  It simply makes no difference what interpretation of history you choose to believe or make up; if the Palestinian arabs are gradually push into a tiny slither of land they will fight back – it is that simple, If you can’t accept that basic reality you’ll be permanently lost.

                • Damaris Tighe

                  If they stopped being obsessed with the existence of a tiny Jewish state the size of Wales, everyone in the area could live in peace & harmony & trade.

                • Alexsandr

                  Israel is about 8000 sq miles. There are loads of massive Arab countries surrounding Israel. The Arabs have most of the mid east, but they want that little bit more.

                • mohdanga

                  And yet no Arab countries will provide refuge for their ‘Palestinian brothers’.

                • uberwest

                  Aren’t the Jordanians also Palestinian Arabs, and isn’t Jordan much bigger than Israel, and isn’t Israel much smaller than it was originally intended to be?

                • mohdanga

                  Two solutions to this: 1) stop all UN and Western aid to the tune of billions a year so that these poor, oppressed Palestinians will actually work to create a prosperous society instead of spending aid money on weapons;
                  2) stop breeding like flies!!

                • newname

                  see above.

              • newname
              • The Masked Marvel

                Eh? They didn’t exist before 1964 when Arafat created the term. Before 1967, so-called Palestinian land was Jordan and Egypt. In reality, they have more land now then ever before, because Israel has given it to them, rather than to Jordan or Egypt.

                • Damaris Tighe

                  Jordan repudiated the West Bank after 1967 because it was too much trouble. Pity because Jordan now has a peace agreement with Israel & Jordan is really eastern Palestine.

                • The Masked Marvel

                  Yes, it was a tragic mistake, but it was probably impossible to work out at the time. I just tire of having the same argument we used to have with Israel-hating Jews 25 years ago about this.

              • Tom M

                I don’t understand your point either. Bearing in mind that the original “division” gave away Jordan to the Palestinians in order to placate the arabs in Syria who had fallen out with the French. Jordan was supposed to be part of the region the jews were to negotiate on.
                As for what’s left there is no Palestinian land as yet defined. The Palestinians have steadfastly refused to agree anything faintly resembling borders before and since UN181 in 1947.
                The area is in dispute and they aren’t defending anything they are attempting to eradicate the state of Israel.

                • Damaris Tighe

                  Jordan was formerly the eastern half of Palestine. 50-80 percent of Jordanians identify as Palestinians. The Two State Solution (which I support) is really the Two Palestinian State solution.

                • Adrian Drummond

                  My point was long since lost because it couldn’t be directly addressed; As a consequence, it goes into a history lesson based on whose version you want to believe and where your starting point is; It’s all rather futile as it currently makes not a jots worth of difference. Anyhow, i’m more a ‘curse on both your houses’ sort of guy; it’s a tragedy in slow motion…

                • Tom M

                  Let me try to help. In my view anything that happened before the 1947 UN resolution is just interesting history. Why? Because a territorial dispute existed between the jews and the arabs that could not be solved by negotiation by the mandated power (Britain). The two parites to the dispute had legitimate claims to the territory but could not find a negotiated way to live peacefully together.
                  As in any unresolved territorial dispute you go to arbitration. In this case the highest arbitrtion in the world, the UN. The debate was held and all countries at the UN had a vote (please note this is the only way to resolve these things other than by war). The vote went for the partition of the region. The jews agreed (although it was less than they had hoped for). The arabs didn’t and have pressed their claim by starting at least three genocidal wars to further this. That is not acceptable.
                  As to the Israelis conduct in these years I do not think they are without fault. They have been without question guilty of quite a few unacceptable practices over the years. This, and the Palestinian’s own unacceptable practices, are what happens in a war. I would like someone to point me to a war of survival where very bad things do not happen. Continually pointing this out will not resolve the situation.
                  I honestly believe I could negotiate with the Israelis I do not believe I could negotiate with the arabs (for comparisons with the sort of people we are talking about look at what is happening in Iraq and Syria).
                  là où le bât blesse.

          • newname

            I’ve just answered your maps argument – you can find the details here – if you really care, although I think you just want to score points. http://elderofziyon.blogspot.co.uk/2011/03/map-that-lies-and-one-that-doesnt.html#.U8-6Lr-KA2w

            • Adrian Drummond

              Well to keep you happpy i had a look. But come on? Who in their right mind is going to believe anything that comes from an Israeli supporting site such as that? And you think I’m trying to score points….. unbelievable…

              • Alexsandr

                why do you say we are an israeli supporting site. I think we are trying to find the truth. The fact you chose to ignore much of the truth, notably the desire of Islamists to eradicate Israel, just shows your views to be facile, or just plain wrong.

                • Adrian Drummond

                  I’m afraid it only takes ten seconds to find out. But while we’re on the subject of truth, and your eagerness to discover it, (and assuming you haven’t done so already), why not read T E Lawrences’ ‘Seven Pillars of Wisdom’ … it’s a good book.

        • Makroon

          Any young fighting-cock forced to live in the Gaza camp would contemplate violence – young Israeli fighting-cocks probably more than most.

      • lookout

        You mean Jordan and Egypt

      • newname

        Those maps are utter distortions. For a start, the white areas in the first one show land legally owned by Jews, while the rest is just assumed to be “Palestinian” – on what basis? The second one shows the 1947 partition plan that was never accepted so was never a reality. The third shows the situation until 1967, when Gaza was part of Egypt and the West Bank was part of Jordan – nobody called it Palestinian land then. Details here: http://elderofziyon.blogspot.co.uk/2011/03/map-that-lies-and-one-that-doesnt.html#.U8-6Lr-KA2w

      • Gergiev

        Indeed. I can never understand why when Jordan illegally occupied the West Bank from 1948 to 1967 a Palestinian State was not created then. The same applies to Egypt’s illegal occupation of Gaza during the same period.

      • mightymark

        Actually if they had accepted the partition proposed in the late 1940s instead of using their weapons to destroy a designated Jewish state much smaller even than pre 1967 Israel, they would today have the larger part of mandate Palestine.

      • uberwest

        The west bank borders with Jordan and Gaza borders with Egypt. Both muslim countries. Surely they share responsibility?

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    • dado_trunking

      Has it occured to you that splitting Arab nations into ever-smaller units will work wonders? What works in Europe will work elsewhere.

      A Free Palestine would be such a state.

      • Alexsandr

        yes. then they can have a rebel rabble join them together like ISIS is joining Syria and Iraq.

    • http://google.co.eu Sentinel

      Well, we can but dream :-)

  • Patriccia Shaw

    This is the caged lion question
    Instead of sanctimony each and every one of you need to ask yourselves what you would do if herded into a tiny pen of land in deprivation with a powerful rich aggressive neighbour next door and with tanks surrounding you

    • Andy

      I wouldn’t be firing f*cking rockets into another country, inviting them to retaliate. Every death is the responsibility of Hamas.

      • Kitty MLB

        Very true.

    • Fergus Pickering

      I would definitely set up rocket sites in ordinary people’s back gardens. I would build a mountain of our own dead women and children. There are plenty more of the, after all A woman’s role is to breed and shut up. That would show the world!

      • Andy

        You are in a very liberal mood this morning.

        • Fergus Pickering

          Well, it’s a sunny day

          • Andy

            That’s no excuse.

    • alabenn

      Instead of sanctimony each and every one of you need to ask yourselves what you would do if herded into a tiny pen of land in deprivation.

      Stop breeding, would seem to be a good start.

      • Alexsandr

        Why stay in Gaza? there is nothing there. Why not go somewhere where you can make something of your life?

        • alabenn

          Money from oil states combined with money and food from the West sustains these people, there are 4.4 million who call themselves Palestinians there were 2 million in 1990, there is plenty of places in the West where they want to go, but very few Muslim places where they can, except to work for slave wages.
          Most Palestinians with any get up and go are gone.

      • RobertC

        Go back to where you forefathers lived?

        • GnosticBrian

          Why not tell that to the Israelis – twice now they have entered Palestine and ejected the indigenous people.

          • RobertC

            Have you heard of the Promised Land, promised by Yahweh to the Jews?

            It’s not a fairy tale, it actually happened, well before 1000 BC! It has been their homeland for generations, except when they were driven out by their enemies.

            • GnosticBrian

              Evidence? Of gthe hundreds of thousands of years of human occupancy of Palestine, for how many was it the exclusive “homeland” of the Jews?

              I personally don’t believe in the sky fairy myth and I don’t see it as any justification whatsoever for Israeli war mongering.

          • Damaris Tighe

            Many Palestinians are descendants of families who moved from surrounding countries. You can tell from their family names: Al Masri (Egypt); Al Hindi (India). Yasser Arafat’s family was Egyptian. They’re no more ‘indigenous’ than the Jews – maybe less so.

            • GnosticBrian

              And what? How many of the Jews presently living in Israel have European or American family roots? Whatever; it doesn’t make it right to deliberately target young boys playing football on a beech.

              • Damaris Tighe

                Of course they didn’t target them. The boys were unintended casualties of a war Israel didn’t start. Every Israeli military action is monitored by a lawyer. The last thing Israel wants is the bad publicity that civilian deaths cause.

                • GnosticBrian

                  I do not believe you – what target were they firing at on the beach? When the children tried to run away, why did the Israelis shift their point of aim to continue firing at them?

                  Israel is murdering a Palestinian child every hour. You should hang your head in shame for supporting such a despicable regime. Founded by terrorists (Stern Gang and Irgun) and acting ike terrorists throughput their existence. Hamas and Israel deserve each other the former is a product of the bahaviour of the latter.

                  You side step saying how many Israeli Jews have American and European antecedents.

                • Damaris Tighe

                  A tiny percentage of Israeli Jews have American & European antecedents. Over half of Jewish Israelis come from families who previously lived in Arab countries – before they were thrown out.

                • GnosticBrian

                  Strange that so many of those that appear on television have American accents. Is having been “thrown out” of Arab countries where the Zionists got the inspiration to throw so many Palestinians out of Israel?

                • Damaris Tighe

                  The ones that appear on our TV are native English speakers so they can speak to us numpty! Doesn’t mean that Israel’s full of them. They’re a tiny minority.

                • GnosticBrian

                  Resorting to ad hominem attacks is a clear indicator of the weakness of your argument.

                • Damaris Tighe

                  I answered your point -. what more do you want?

                • GnosticBrian

                  An absence of personal insults.

                • Damaris Tighe

                  Perhaps you could tell me why Hamas built a tunnel loaded with explosives under an Israeli kindergarten?

                • GnosticBrian

                  Presumably to blow up children.

                  As with so many Zionist apologists you equate any critisism of Israel as support for Hamas. For the record, I don’t support Hamas or any terrorist organisation.

                • Damaris Tighe

                  No, I’m clear about the difference but in expecting Israel to do nothing about Hamas’s rockets & tunnels because they use civilians as shields you’re in effect supporting them.

                • GnosticBrian

                  And the only alternative to “doing nothing” is murdering innocent children?

                  Given that Israel has expelled the Palestinians from their own land and forced more than 4 million to live in a tiny slither of land that is Gaza – where do you expect them to store such few weapons as they have?

                  Incidentally, was the Kindergarten that you mentioned above built on land owned by Jews in 1947 or on land stolen from Palestinians subsequently?

                • Damaris Tighe

                  Unintended civilian deaths are not ‘murder’ & all people with common sense & an understanding of the horrors of war understand this.

                • GnosticBrian

                  But the deliberate targetting of civilians is poor bloody murder. Shooting small boys playing football on a beach is a war crime.

                  I notice that you do not answer the question as to who owned the property in 1947.

                  The land stolen in 1967 is covered by the UN Security Resolution number 242.

                • Damaris Tighe

                  The kindergarten was on PRE-1967 land, ie, within the armistice lines of 1947-8. When countries invade their neighbours they should expect to forfeit land if they lose.

                  You continue to parrot about the ‘deliberate targeting of boys’.

                • GnosticBrian

                  So built on stolen land. International Law does not support your personal philosophy.

                  The true does not tarnish by repetition.

                • Damaris Tighe

                  I see. You want Israel to disappear.

                • GnosticBrian

                  Where have I said any such thing? Advancing your argument by lies doers not reflect well on you.

                • Alexsandr

                  oh this stolen land argument again. Please check out the history since ottoman before spouting this line.
                  No-one is forced to live in Gaza. 20% of israelis are arab. Or they could move to Jordan or other states in the mid east. In fact many have. They just like playing the victim.

                • GnosticBrian

                  The land was stolen post WW2 long after the demise of the Ottoman Empire.

                  Using your logic, all of those Zionists and their descendents who flooded into Palestine post WW2 are not forced to live on the land stolen from Palestinians, they could return from whence they came.

                • Alexsandr

                  umm. i think you have missed out a big chunk between 1918 and 1948

                • GnosticBrian

                  Yes, but the majority of land theft and Zionist invasion took place post WW2.

                • RobertC

                  Hardly! Many have fled from Egypt, Iraq, Iran, in fact from most muslim countries where they had been for generations, some even before islam started!

                  Haven’t you seen the recent news about Mosul, with the islam friendly president acting to form:
                  “Christians in Mosul have been offered three choices by ISIS:

                  1. Convert to Islam.
                  2. Pay the ‘jizya’ tax that renders them dhimmis – i.e., second-class citizens granted limited protection if they hand over half an ounce of pure gold.
                  3. Death by the sword.

                  They had until noon today to make up their minds.

                  Bit of a no-brainer, really. Mosul’s Christians – Catholics and Orthodox who until this month had celebrated Mass in the city every Sunday for 1,600 years – are fleeing for safety.”
                  http://blogs.spectator.co.uk/coffeehouse/2014/07/as-christians-are-massacred-in-iraq-obama-maintains-his-silence/

                  Yes, 1600 years of Christianity coming to an end.

                • RobertC

                  This quote, from the same article, reminds us that Christian girls have been kidnapped, (and Christian boys murdered) in Nigeria by people from the same mob!

                  “So, over to you, Michelle. If your husband is too busy on the golf course, perhaps you could hold up a placard with a groovy hashtag on it…”

                • GnosticBrian

                  Fled or left of their own volition to enjoy the fruits of stolen land and massive American support?

                  I don’t see the horror that has recently fallen on Mosul as justifying Zionist land grabs. We can thank B Liar and George W Bush for the mess that is happening in what was Iraq (a British concoction in the first instance).

                  It all goes to show what misery follows from belief in sky fairies.

    • girondas2

      “What you would do if herded into a tiny pen of land in deprivation with a
      powerful rich aggressive neighbour next door and with tanks surrounding
      you”

      What would I do?
      I would stop firing rockets and running around screaming for the death of all those infidels who do not follow the teaching of “little mo”
      That’s what I would do, but then I’m sane.

      • Andy

        ‘but then I’m sane’
        Jury out. We need evidence of that please.

        • girondas2

          “We need evidence of that please.”

          Evidence?
          I don’t fire rockets and I don’t run around screaming for the death of
          all those infidels who do not follow the teaching of “little mo”

      • Kitty MLB

        Are you aware that ‘ Patriccia Shaw’ is another of those wretched telemachus clones..they seem to
        be everywhere.

        The point is, although Israel must defend her right of
        existence, when all around her wish to send Jews and
        Christians to oblivion, start an Islamic state and come
        after the West. Israel shows great restraint in the fact
        that she has the military capacity to send them all
        to oblivion and yet does’nt. A small civilized country
        surrounded by so much savagery.

        • Patriccia Shaw

          But that small ‘civilised’ country could help the cause of Peace by stopping building illegal settlements in Palestinian territory.

          • Alexsandr

            Israael has built no settlements in Gaza. Hamas is the Gaza government. Fatah in the west bank, where there are jewish settlements, have not fired any rockets. So your argument is 100% false.
            Hamas just want to destroy Israel. Its in their charter if you could be bothered to read it. And in the Koran. They are fighting a propaganda war using dead Gaza people to show the TV news people. And you have fallen for it hook line and sinker.

    • lookout

      Change my government

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