Coffee House

Labour wants to stay in its NHS comfort zone and ignore immigration and the economy

2 July 2014

2:06 PM

2 July 2014

2:06 PM

PMQs taught us a number of things about Labour and the Conservatives. The first is that while Labour has a bumper economy week underway, it does not feel sufficiently confident to attack the Conservatives on this issue in an aggressive forum like PMQs. This is probably quite sensible, given the attack that Cameron launched towards the end of the session on Ed Balls. Looking very chipper indeed, the PM said:

‘What is my idea of fun? It is not hanging out with the Shadow Chancellor! That is my idea of fun! And so, I feel sorry for the leader of the Opposition because he has to hang out with him all of the time. What a miserable existence it must be to have sitting next to you the person who wrecked the British economy, and have to listen to them, day after day, day after day, as they say to the British people, we’re the people who crashed the car: give us the keys back!’

The Prime Minister had already ridiculed Miliband’s struggle with jobs figures, accusing him of talking down the economy and quoting party figures who worry Labour remains ‘anti-business’. But he seemed quite content to go along with the NHS stat attack that Ed Miliband launched as his preferred focus for this session. Cameron’s tactic was largely to answer Miliband’s questions using different figures which he claimed showed the NHS was improving, and to claim credit for the Commonwealth Fund rating the NHS the best healthcare system in the world. Andy Burnham later used a point of order to accuse him not just of answering the questions with unrelated statistics, but of getting the stats themselves wrong. But the Prime Minister didn’t just defend his government’s handling of the NHS, he also went on the offensive against Labour, pointing not just to his favourite case study of the NHS in Wales, but also to the Mid-Staffs scandal happening on Labour’s watch as a sign that you cannot trust Labour with the NHS.


Labour sources accused Cameron after the exchanges as being ‘a combination of wrong, misleading and downright deliberate obfuscation’. That as may be, but it remains significant that Cameron is happy not just to defend his party but to attack the opposition on an issue that Labour enjoys a significant poll lead on. And it is equally significant that Labour wants to stick to attacking the Tories on an issue they beat them on in the polls. The effect, if any, is simply to build the Labour NHS poll lead, not deal with areas of weakness that voters also say heavily influence what they do in the polling booth, such as the economy and immigration.

The party argues that it is unfair to say it is running scared of talking about business and the economy when it has so many speeches and announcements planned for this week. But the question is when will the party feel sufficiently confident to raise the subject in the Chamber? It was easy when the figures were bad and the IMF and ratings agencies were piling the misery on George Osborne. It’s trickier now, and these special themed weeks on the subject are designed to give Labour sufficient ammunition to be able to to talk about the economy and fight the Tories. But it is clearly not ready to do so. If the Tories are happy to scrap over one of their polling weak spots, the NHS, then Labour has even more cause to shore up its position for an attack on the economy in the Chamber, too. And time is running out for it to be able to do that.

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Show comments
  • expertwebworld

    Immigration relates to the movement of peoples from one country into another, for residential rather than visiting purpose.Unique Visa Services Ltd. is a leading UK immigration specialist based in the heart of the bustling city of Manchester, close to the busy Oxford Road and Piccadilly rail stations.Whether you are looking for honest, objective advice or a full UK visa application service the popular and growing Unique operation should be your first point of call.

  • Jackthesmilingblack

    Ed`s looking more Islamic everyday.
    There I go again, thinking the unthinkable and saying it.

  • Gwangi

    I don’t think Miliband will want to focus too much on the NHS in Wales – which is completely ignored on the UK national news, which still persists in assuming all ‘NHS changes’ apply to all the nations of the UK (they don’t!).

    Wales has not had a public inquiry into the NHS. On a few things it beats England (cancer diagnosis rates and shorter waiting times); on others it has fallen behind. One some things – care of the elderly – England, Wales and Scotland struggle (though Scotland pays more for care home fees from English subsidies…)

    Yesterday a report was released on how to reform the NHS complaints process for the Welsh NHS. Nothing at all on the national news about it, of course, but it could be the yet another step on the long steep road to a public inquiry on the Welsh NHS – the results of that would probably be acutely embarrassing for Labour, which is why Miliband is making the mistake of being blindly loyal to the Welsh Labour First Minister and not being loyal to the truth or what is best for the people of Wales. A shame, that.

  • grumpy_old_ben

    The core problem is that neither main party are electable, because they offer nothing the electorate wants. All are committed to extreme ideologies, all tell lies (although the lies vary with the specific details of their actual agenda) and all are waiting for the other one to make a fatal mis-step first.

    Labour’s policy of unlimited third-world immigration is going very badly sour, as Islamist politics and electoral corruption become apparent in places like Tower Hamlets. The MSM whips itself into a frenzy about decades-old allegations against elderly white men which are nasty enough, but completely blanks out the rising tide of cases such as Operations Sanctuary, Brook, Bullfinch et al.

    The Conservatives don’t even seriously appear to care about making their lies consistent, far less credible. The LibDems have effectively collapsed, with Vince Cable acting as the Labour chuck-out he has long been, and Clegg and Alexander acting as part of the Team Cameroon Euro-Federal Tendency Clique.

    So, we approach an election in which the only logical option – None Of The Above – is not on offer because the FPTP system does not permit a null result. Democracy has been strangled by the mechanism of controlling candidate selection (Labour appear particularly nepotistic in this respect, while the Conservatives tend to concentrate on all-women selection lists but the result is much the same)

  • pobinr

    People who vote Labour;

    Guess what party these people vote for;

    (1) The regressed handed-down voting mentality, ‘Me-da voted Labour so I will’

    (2) Those who think ‘Labour will look after them’

    (3) The Workshy

    (4) Professional scroungers

    (5) Grateful immigrants who think the UK is one big free-for-all; maybe it is!?

    (6) The hyper-bloated public sector; Labour uses taxes to fuel loyalty.

    (7) The perpetual anti-Tory voters; ‘those f***ing Bankers, eh!?’

    (8) Postal voting fraud

    (9) Celebrities with little concept of the real world

    (10) TV Journalists

    (11) Union bullies

    (12) Socialist Workers ( A contradiction in terms)

    (13) The gullible

    (14] People who can’t forget the other lot used to send kids up Chimneys to sweep them

    [15] People who think Millions of Poles should be able to come here because 34 were in the RAF in WWII helping to make their country a fit & free place to live in so they could come & live here instead

    [16] People who think that to support their country all they need to is wave a flag while 11 massively over paid morons with England written on their T-shirts kick a ball around whilst at the same time
    the country they supposedly support is being given away by elected traitors to the emerging EU dictatorship!

    [17] People who think it’s racist to even question the merits of millions of people coming here where we have housing shortages, full schools, congested roads, NHS at breaking point etc

    [18] Brainwashed cloistered blinkered university over edumacated people who like being philanthropic with other people’s money

    [19] People who change the subject or who’s eyes glaze over when you tell them it was Gordon Brown who failed to regulate the banks & instead actually knighted two of the worst bankers

    [20] People who change the subject or who’s eyes glaze over when you tell them Gordon Brown flogged off 400 metric tons of our gold reserves & told the markets before hand so he got a low price for it

    [21] People who try and change the subject or who’s eyes glaze over when you tell them we now have the worst housing shortage since WWII because of Labour’s open door immigration policy

    [22] People who try & change the subject or who’s eyes glaze over when you tell them mass immigration of cheap labour drives down wages & takes jobs & homes whilst only benefitting slumlords & low wage employers and that this runs completely counter to their socialist beliefs!

    [23] People who’ve never had the stress & real world discipline of trying to set up & run a business

    [24] People that feel the need to go onto Question Time and earnestly-clap-the-loudest when someone makes some facile lefty comment.

    [25] People that don’t recognise that Labour nearly bankrupted the British economy on the previous time they were in office in 1979, and ACTUALLY bankrupted it on their last stint in office in 2010

    [26] The Polly Toynbees of this world who are multi-millionaires, who think that the rich should share more of their wealth with the poor, so long as that policy only applies to other rich people.

    [27] Those people that get increasingly upset that the UK economy is improving.

    [28] Those people that agreed with Ed Balls that current economic policy would lead to a triple dip recession and a million more unemployed, and who are now too stupid or stubborn to recognise that he was astoundingly wrong on both counts, and that he is completely clueless when it comes to economics.

    [29] Those people that criticise the fact that government debt has increased under this government, and who don’t understand what the defecit actually is and who was responsible for creating it.

    [30] People who don’t seem able to comprehend the fact that the freedom & nationstate democracy established 800 years ago as defined in the Magna Carta, that we fought to preserve for in two world wars & a cold war is increasingly coming under the centralised control of the creeping emerging EU dictatorship

    • Daidragon

      Their eyes are glazing over because you’re a boring loon.

  • pobinr

    Email to Iain McNicol Labour MP

    Here’s why I’ll be voting UKIP

    Labour have betrayed the working class people of this country.


    Labour – Anti referendum, pro EU and pro immigration.
    Result = Mass immigration of cheap labour driving down wages, taking jobs, taking homes, making more traffic congestion and making slumlords & low wage payers richer.
    But that’s the opposite of Socialism isn’t it?
    Labour the party for people that don’t believe in Labour principles!

    I can only assume the people that think mass immigration is wonderful are fortunate enough to live in areas that haven’t been flooded in the last 5 years with East Europeans. I live in Shirley, Southampton.

    Last week I rang to make a doctors appointment. I got ‘Sorry not possible today.’
    Never used to be like that. I resent this kind of thing.
    And why shouldn’t I be able to resent such things without being called a racist?
    I resent housing shortages. I resent the social housing queue now being 8+ years in Southampton. I resent more traffic congestion, More noise, more pollution.

    Even immigrants are tired of immigration
    Asians no longer send their children to the local school St Marks in Southampton, because they want their children to learn English rather than Polish, Romanian, Hungarian etc!
    They have classes where only 4 children are English!
    My friend wouldn’t send his child there. He paid for her to go to St Winifreds private school instead and he’s half Polish!
    His father came here from Poland in the 60’s!

    Every other name on Southampton Maternity unit cots is East European.
    Locals can’t get their kids into their nearest school.
    Even if they can it’s full of kids that can’t speak English properly.
    The General hospital has had to ask for more funding for the hepatobiliary liver service due to Vodka usage by our friends from the East.

    I was speaking to Pole the other day at 11am.
    I asked him how come you’re not at work?
    He replied he ‘Couldn’t get any more chef work here’
    I said will you be going back to Poland then?
    He replied ‘No I steel beetar off here’ !
    On the dole !

    Under EU dictat XYZ retired East Europeans that have been here a year are entitled to their £120 a month pension topped up to around £500 a month UK pension paid for by us. We pay NI for 40 years to get a UK pension. They pay for 0 years!

    My mother ln law’s in a rest home. Some staff are East European. She’s hard of hearing & can’t understand their poor English.

    I was chatting to a Hungarian girl recently who served me in Pizzaexpress. A charming girl. I asked her what has the EU done for her and her country?
    She replied – ‘It’s given her the opportunity to leave’
    I said would she ever go back to Hungary. She replied ‘No’
    So countries less densely populated than here to start with are losing their youth & people of working age.
    Their demographic screwed & ours!

    I bought a 2 flat that had had 6 Lithuanians living in.
    The new working class living like this with almost no overheads so undercutting wages for locals & driving down living standards for people with mortgages to pay & making slumlords & min wage employers richer.
    EU = Capitalist’s wet dream brought to you courtesy of the left.

    Because these people are squashed into flats with no gardens in numbers the flats weren’t designed to take, Southampton Common becomes their garden in summer. Drunken Poles on Lidls Vodka having BBQ’s burning the grass. Feeling like I’m not in England any more in the common I grew up playing in. It makes me sick.
    People I know have anti social unemployed Poles next to them. So whilst many Poles might be hard working, we’re also importing a lot of dross, as if we don’t already have enough of our own!

    Unsurprisingly immigrants on low wages contribute less into the system than they are entitled to receive from it >

    So why do Labour support open borders?
    Becuase they are funded by big business like JML who donated £1.6M in shares to Labour to keep the flow of cheap labour coming in!

    How the EU is destroying our democracy >

    Yours sincerely

  • Liberty

    You are not comparing like with like. Labour has an appalling record on the NHS with nothing to say and its poll lead is a paradox whilst the Tories are good on the NHS and have lots to say. Tories are really good on the economy, have lots to say whilst Labour has an appalling record on the economy with nothing to say. That is why DC can talk about the NHS and be confident that the polls will turn in his favour whilst Labour has no such confidence in economics and are afraid that if they talk about it people will be reminded and they will do even worse in the polls. Labour should shut up about the NHS before people twig how dreadful they really are.

    • GraveDave

      whilst the Tories are good on the NHS and have lots to say.
      Is this parody?

  • saffrin

    I fail to see how Labour can profit from a campaign based on the NHS with their recent history.
    Liverpool Pathway, Staffordshire Hospital Trust scandal, Labour’s too posh to work degree nurses, their imported for the purpose, can’t speak the lingo Doctors, the filth, the unnecessary deaths, the unpaid for PFI scam, their bureaucratic, micro managed, run for the benefit of the staff NHS and the fact they still have Andy Burnham as Minister for Health…
    Can’t see it myself.

    • Andy

      Ah yes. The NHS. Labour’s great murder machine.

    • Mynydd

      People who are waiting for an operation, transplant, or are on a A&E trolley will blame the NHS of today as run by the present government, Mr Cameron/Hunt. They wont be saying it all the last governments fault.

      • Inverted Meniscus

        As if Mid Staffs didn’t happen. No doubt that was Thatcher’s fault as well.

      • saffrin

        People who are waiting today know it’s the remnants of the wreckage Labour left behind and the LibLabCon party’s policy of letting anyone in the World use it for free.
        People can’t get an appointment at their local GP’s for nothing.
        It’s the millions of immigrants they’ve let in without for a moment considering the impact their arrival would have on our infrastructure.
        Too busy fiddling their expenses to even see it let alone think it through.

        • GraveDave

          Yeah, yeah, yeah – and from the wreckage the Tories left behind before that. How far back do we go.

          • saffrin

            Pre Thatcher i’d say.

      • GraveDave

        Thank f–k for that.

    • GraveDave

      If the Tories had been in at the time they would have done exactly the same thing and made exactly the same mistakes, albeit at a slower pace.The Tories did much to run down the NHS and Education. They also presided over a recession or two. Crime and violence was also way up under the Tories. No I think we had enough of hearing it when New Labour was in – ‘It’s all the fault of Tories. It’s all the fault of Tories…’ So do we really have to keep hearing it all over again from the ineffectual Tories about ineffectual Labour.

      • saffrin

        I don’t know why you would think Labour had reduced crime when the only statistic available on the subject is the reporting of it.

  • Amir

    Check this article out about Miliband’s last chance:

  • swatnan

    Listen Listen Listen.
    ‘Can you hear the People sing ….?.’

  • DWWolds

    If Labour wants to ignore immigration and talk about the NHS someone should pin them down on the effect the former has had on the latter How on earth can anyone expect to increase the population to the extent that happened under Labour’s open door immigration policy without that impacting on not just the NHS but also school places, welfare spend and a good deal more besides?

    • Conway

      Don’t forget the housing shortage, which has a particular impact on just about everybody, even if they are well and don’t have children.

    • 2trueblue

      Liebore refuse to accept responsibility for the lack of proper/any attention to our total infrastructure which is impacted massively when you grow the population so dramatically in such a short space of time. They are not interested in the facts.

      They made no provision for it, and during their tenure child poverty grew in the UK.

    • Mynydd

      When the Conservative Prime Minister Mr Edward Heath signed the Treaty of Rome he agreed to an open door immigration policy, free movement of labour. This was then reinforced by the Conservative Prime Minister Margaret Thatcher when she signed up to the Single Market. Unfortunately Labour could not undo the treaties these Conservatives Prime Ministers signed.

      • DWWolds

        Even if what you say is true the number of countries in the EEC and the EU was far less then than it was when Labour allowed the former Eastern bloc countries into this country immediately they joined. Other countries such a Germany made them wait for several years. It was Labour who predicted the number coming in from those countries would be 13,000 when the actual number was far, far greater than that.

        • GraveDave

          Doesn’t matter – how far back do you really want to go in the blame game?

          • DWWolds

            It was Mynydd who started going back. However, the real point is that since we joined the EEC/EU we have almost always drawn the short straw.

            • GraveDave

              It was the Tories who started banning free speech on immigration. Though I’d say Labour created the whole climate of political correctness about it.

      • GraveDave

        Well said Myn.

        • DWWolds

          So it is ok if Mynydd goes back but not if anyone else does.

          • GraveDave

            Is he Welsh?

    • GraveDave

      By doing what the right wing press does – getting the safest scapegoats.
      And it wont be the immigrants.

  • @PhilKean1

    I have always worried that the NHS would collapse under the weight –

    – of an expectation to provide ever-more non-essential services, and from unlimited EU immigration.

    Well, speaking as someone who recently had to use the services of the NHS, and with a wife who was told she had to go private because new guidelines specified that only urgent (we thought hers was) cases can now be referred to specialists – I can say that my fears were well founded.

    The reorganisation we were told was never going to happen has been a disaster. Yes, we needed a radical reorganisation; but we needed one that was going to return the NHS to its core purpose in order to free up resources for saving lives and keeping people healthy.

    And as for Miliband?

    * It was LABOUR’s disastrous decision to pay doctors so much that many of them could afford to work part time and retire early.
    * It was LABOUR who ended the requirement that doctors should have to provide an out-of-hours service.
    * It was Labour who threw open the immigration flood gates. Cameron is just keeping them open.
    * And it was LABOUR who encouraged NHS trusts to get themselves into financial trouble by signing penalising PFI contracts.

    And Miliband has the effrontery to try to score political points out of the NHS funding and A and E crises?

    • HookesLaw

      GPs have effectively not had a payrise for 10 years.
      The problem with GPs is not that they have retired early it is that fewer would want to be one anymore.
      There is no evidence that PFI contracts are penalising and they are not forced to sign them, they negotiate them and they need to be approved. Its a long business.Whether some of the projects should have been initialised no matter how they were procured is a different issue. PFI included management maintenance and repair which when things are tough can be the first to be neglected.
      My 88 year old mother in law has had no problems seeking treatment or her tumour. At 88 you would not think she was ‘urgent’.
      There are always guidelines for urgent referals. I imagine they exist all over the world.
      eg – ‘Alfred Health’ in Australia says
      ‘The referral is triaged by thespecialist unit according to clinical urgency.
      This determines how long the patient will wait for anappointment.Patients with urgent conditions are scheduled to be seen within 30 days.
      Patients with routine conditions are given the next available appointment according to clinical need. Both the GP and patient are notified.’

      • the viceroy’s gin

        …spoken like the true socialist that you are, lad.

        Always defend the great socialist project. Always. It is what you types do.

    • Mynydd

      What you and your wife have experienced is the NHS under a Conservative government, and as you say their top down reorganisation is not working, and you along with millions of others are paying the price. With respect to your comments about Labour/Miliband, Mr Cameron/Hunt have been in power for over four years, but have not changed any of the points you raised., why not.

      • @PhilKean1

        Yes, it has happened under Liberals posing as Tories.

        As a minimum, they could have –

        * Forbidden all non-essential procedures and treatment.
        * Been honest and accepted that the NHS budget would need to keep pace with unlimited EU immigration running at about 300,000 per annum.
        * Compelled ALL visitors to the UK to have health insurance.

        They haven’t done any of it. What have done is to institute a de-facto cut to the budget.

        Again, it is life-long, hard-working taxpayers who always end up paying the price of the incompetence and maladministration inflicted by Britain’s Liberal-left, professional politicians.

  • Smithersjones2013

    Of course there is plenty to criticise the government over regarding the economy (public spending) and immigration (Cameron’s policy on immigration is in tatters) but of course Labour are just as much if not more on the wrong side of those issues than the Tories.

    Will Labour expose their dirt laundry in public? Of course not!

  • LadyDingDong

    My dear Isabel, I am just around the corner from your office and if you like I will come and give you and your other youthful colleagues a short lecture on politics in the real world. The reason Milliband went on the NHS is because Labtard hope there will be a summer breakdown in A&E and then they can finally be right about something. You may recall they tried the same last winter to zero effect. I doubt it will happen his time also. By the way, I believe Cameoron is only 4 points behind Millliband on the NHS so the difference ain’t so great. Keep trying dear.

    • HookesLaw

      A summer breakdown to follow the non-appearance of the winter breakdown.
      Lets remember it was the Labour manifesto which promised a £20 billion efficiency drive in the NHS. You have to ask just what ae they criticising? Are they repudiating Brown’s £20 billion of cuts? What diffrent efficiencies would labour bring in? Can they name the hospitals they would close? And if they are going to re-re-organise the NHS how much would that cost.

      • the viceroy’s gin

        …one thing’s for certain… you socialist Camerluvvies and your “ring fenced” nonsense certainly have no answer to any of that, laddie.

    • Jackthesmilingblack

      Do try and spell Miliband correctly. Only one `ell. Not two or even three.

  • BarkingAtTreehuggers

    RPI hyperinflation ≠ growth

    Drop me a line if you need help with that.

    • the viceroy’s gin

      …by “you” do you mean any of your army of sockpuppets, lad?

      • Inverted Meniscus

        That would be an awful lot of ‘lines’.

  • Colonel Mustard

    Oh, I don’t think the close and present danger that is Labour want to “ignore” immigration. It is too useful a political weapon for them to do that, both by importing hundreds of thousands of new Labour voters and to suppress dissent by creating new categories of “offendees” to justify bogus accusations of “racism” and “xenophobia” against any “enrichment deniers”

    If they manage to slither into power again we shall be further “enriched”, probably terminally.

    • BarkingAtTreehuggers

      Importing hundreds of thousands of new Liebour voters (really? Are they all Liebour voters? How daft must one be to believe it?) is easily offset by “a million new (self employed) jobs created”.
      There, fixed it for you, again.

      • Inverted Meniscus

        You’ll need to ask some of your other sock puppets for an answer on that one laddie. But then they are all socialist nutters like you.

      • Colonel Mustard

        Er, don’t think I mentioned Pakistanis. Estimates vary but at least 4,000,000 immigrants have arrived since 1997. They can’t vote?

        Those classified as “resident in the UK” from these countries can vote:-

        Antigua and Barbuda


        The Bahamas





        Brunei Darussalam





        Fiji Islands

        The Gambia

















        New Zealand



        Papua New Guinea


        St Kitts & Nevis

        St Lucia

        St Vincent & The Grenadines



        Sierra Leone


        Solomon Islands

        South Africa

        Sri Lanka



        Trinidad & Tobago



        United Kingdom

        United Republic of Tanzania




        British Overseas Territories



        British Antarctic Territory

        British Indian Ocean Territory

        British Virgin Islands

        Cayman Islands

        Falkland Islands



        Pitcairn Island

        St Helena and dependencies (Ascension Island and Tristan da Cunha)

        South Georgia and the South Sandwich Islands

        Sovereign base areas on Cyprus

        Turks and Caicos Islands

        Those “resident in the UK” from these countries can vote in European and local elections in the UK, elections to the Scottish Parliament and Welsh and Northern Ireland Assemblies (if they live in those areas) and some referendums:-






        Czech Republic






















        As for voting Labour:-

        A recent poll has shown that there is a great resistance among visible ethnic minority voters to voting for the Conservative Party. Only 16% of black and Asian voters, according to the poll, vote for the Conservatives whereas about 66% are supporters of the Labour Party.

        • HookesLaw

          Commomwealth citizens and Irish can vote in UK general elections. Many ‘immigrants’ in the figures are students who leave. EU citizens cannot vote.
          Many ‘immigrants’ in the figures are students who leave. This govt has closed the bogus students loop holes.

          • saffrin

            Student loophole?
            Big deal. Call me Dave still hit the record for the highest number of immigrants last year and seeing as he’s done nothing to combat illegal immigration or the removal thereof, Cameron is just another lying plank in the LibLabCon party.

        • Mynydd

          Supporters and votes are not the same 16% of black and Asian voters, vote Conservative, even though 66% support Labour, it could be that 0% actually vote Labour.

          • Colonel Mustard

            Tripe. And get orf my comments!

            • Inverted Meniscus

              Yeah he is like some kind of Telemachus trainee and just as facile and stupid.

        • BarkingAtTreehuggers

          No doubt you will now accuse me (again) of moving on/ not reiterating my first point/ contradicting myself or whathaveyou when I assert that you perhaps had grounds for sorting out your voting system.
          I mean, former colonies are *former* colonies, right? Do former colonialists still run those places or what, do these colonies still have the Monarch as their Head of State? I mean, what a complete mess this entire thing quite evidently turns out to be.

          • Colonel Mustard

            A simple admission that you were wrong and did not actually fix it for me, again, would do.

            UK immigration a complete mess? Yep. Went wrong from about 1968. Successive political cowards more interested in polishing their right on credentials than protecting the people, culture and homogeny of this country England.

            • BarkingAtTreehuggers

              There is nothing to admit, Colonel – I assure you.
              You wish to rid yourself of all knowledge of your history, you wish to rid yourself now, when you are yourself in deep excrement, from all your *colonial* history. That is what my posts were designed to expose, that is what they exposed.

              I do not want to rid myself of my colonial history. You do.
              The cultural and socio-political influence of former colonies on Mainland Britain is undeniable. Now, I believe that can be a positive thing and everywhere I look when I go about my business it is.
              Curious how you appear to hate your own people (!)

              • Colonel Mustard

                “There is nothing to admit”

                Yes there is. You implied that immigrants could not vote. You were wrong. You challenged whether all immigrants were Labour voters (an assertion I never made) and I responded that polling suggests a majority of them are.

                Then we got the usual moving of goal posts, straw man argument and sly ad hominem all designed to showcase how clever you think you are. A well-established modus operandi on your part.

                PS Your assurance is about as credible as the rest of your act.

                • BarkingAtTreehuggers

                  I knew you would do that, I predicted it did I not?
                  My point was made clear – I threw out the blinker and managed to get you to bite. Now nothing but weasel words of denial.
                  Colonial history is British history. Why do you hate your own history and people so much?

                • Colonel Mustard

                  I don’t hate my own history or my own people. I have not denied anything, let alone with weasel words.

                  But you have admitted that you are just a click-bait troll.

      • Conway

        You have not been reading about Tower Hamlets, obviously. Council meetings not being held in English, loads of postal votes turning up in the boot of a car and the mayor obstructing any investigation. Admittedly, Bangladesh is no longer called East Pakistan, but that’s mere semantics.

        • BarkingAtTreehuggers

          Tower Hamlets is not my concern.

          Either we need to call for UN electoral monitoring or we do not. Will you sort that out, please? I mean what is this, a Banana Monarchy?

    • HookesLaw

      EU migrants cannot vote in general elections.
      Labour’s vote fell from 10.7 million in 2001 to 9.5 million in 2005 to 8.6 million in 2010.

      Where are the extra votes coming from?

      • Inverted Meniscus

        Via the post office I suspect.

        • Mynydd

          You can suspect all you like, but the total number of votes cast, include postal votes. There again one doesn’t expect an extreme right winger to understand such things as numbers..

          • Inverted Meniscus

            Well no surprise that a socialist nutter is in favour of postal votes.

      • Colonel Mustard

        See below. You think voting in Euro elections, local elections and referendums has no impact on politics? Bearing in mind that you are supposedly a conservative you ought to be worried that a recent poll indicated 66% of ethnic minority immigrants vote Labour.

        • Mynydd

          As already been said immigrants cannot vote.

          • Colonel Mustard

            Oh yes they can. Read my other comment.

      • saffrin