Coffee House

On the campaign trail with Ukip in Newark

1 June 2014

8:28 PM

1 June 2014

8:28 PM

A battle cry has gone out for more troops, and the UKIP faithful have responded. Newark, packed with Tory spinners and regularly visited by David Cameron and assorted Tory grandees, has now attracted hundreds of purple campaigners for this week’s by-election. From all corners of the UK – from Scotland to Cornwall, the Eastern counties to Wales, the most fervent UKIP believers gathered yesterday for a public meeting near Newark, and a chance to see their chief protagonist, Nigel Farage.

‘After the European elections, we can smell blood,’ said a cheerful UKIP activist, Scott Cross, from Hampshire. Former Tory activist Steve Stanbury, who defected to UKIP a few years ago, felt ‘exhilarated and invigorated for the first time in ages.’ And this exuberance was given full vent when their saviour Farage appeared. Entering the packed 500-plus crowd in Newark’s genteel Kelham Hall, the ovation was standing and the roar was deafening. The grand Victorian hall is usually used for weddings, but marital celebrations had nothing on the enthusiastic applause from UKIP’s blue rinse brigade yesterday, still buzzing from their triumph in the EU elections a week earlier.

The typical Farage formula for a rousing speech was met with cheers, whistles and enthusiastic applause, as he railed against the political elites and the ‘commentariat”. But there was also bait for the Labour vote. The £55m spent on the EU could be better spent, said parliamentary candidate and UKIP MEP Roger Helmer, on ‘eliminating the need for foodbanks’ or on keeping the local A&E department – a key local issue in Newark. Helmer assured the crowd that there were no plans to charge for GP surgeries or privatise the NHS, nor scrap paid maternity leave.

[Alt-Text]


He also gave the obligatory digs towards the Conservative candidate, Robert Jenrick, who is ‘gilded youth’ and a ‘London property millionaire’ who has already bought a residence in Vincent Square, a convenient walk from the House of Commons. Helmer said he has worked in international trade for ‘slightly longer than Mr Jenrick’s lifetime’.

Helmer is, Farage said, the only candidate in the Newark elections who is not ‘lobby fodder’. ‘I will vote for what the people of Newark tell me and for what I think is right,’ he said to roars and cheers from the audience. ‘I will not be under the thumb of whips’. Well there will be no need for a whip with a parliamentary presence of one.

Farage continued to raise the crowd’s hopes with the example of Canada’s Reform Party, who came from nowhere to transform the country’s political agenda and shift it to the right. ‘They were called cranks, oddballs, weirdos… extremists and dangerous,’ Farage said. ‘In 1998 they averaged 4 per cent of the vote…. At the next general election they became the biggest party in parliament. Now Canada has the best budget deficit of the G8 countries.’

So, I asked a UKIP activist, is this kind of ebullient reception for Farage normal? ‘I saw a woman at the conference last year, with tears in her eyes,’ he says. ‘I asked her if she was OK, and she said Farage had just changed her life.’

These are the people who will be wearing out shoe leather this week, leafleting and canvassing for the hope of UKIP’s first parliamentary seat, in a battle against the well-oiled machine of the Conservatives. Should they succeed, the fervour can only increase.


More Spectator for less. Stay informed leading up to the EU referendum and in the aftermath. Subscribe and receive 15 issues delivered for just £15, with full web and app access. Join us.



Show comments
  • pajeroexceed

    Worry not, You wonderful Ukippers The mortal wounds given off by present day numbers of Immigration. ( seven thousand every seven days ). Has become UKIP’s best recruitment agent. Over the next few short years. The impact of this crass stupidity will drive millions into the arms of its only saviour, Let none of us lose sleep today as we will be rejoicing soon… The propellant is now irreversible and the lib/lab con is horrified as you can see by the Media rants….

  • Chris Hobson

    Conservatives should step aside!

  • evad666

    Interesting no mention of the Labour Party links to the organization running food banks.

  • Athelwulf
  • Kirk Dickenson

    Good luck Roger Helmer……….surely the good people of Newark deserve a change. They have just said goodbye to their old Tory representative, who, instead of looking out for the Newark electorate, was too busy lining his pockets with cash for questions. Now the Tories are fielding some 32 year old yuppie who never has never worked in the real world and lives 250 miles away. Come on Newark………..vote for the midlands lad….vote Helmer……vote UKIP!

  • Craig Sweaton

    I traveled down from Leeds on Saturday and the atmosphere was electric! Over 170 activists signed in at the shop but I don’t think that number included non-members. The response on the doorstep was amazing in the two areas that I visited, and speaking to other activists in Newark they felt the same.
    So the Cons had 30 there handing out balloons? If you say so – I saw about 15 who looked decidedly unhappy and embarrassed about handing out balloons to children, in the vain hope that it might encourage the parents to vote for them. I’d rather have genuine than generic – sorry about that, his name just sounds as generic as the con candidate looks.

    • pajeroexceed

      Its a joy to read your informative ‘ post ‘ Thanks from someone who could not make to Newark

  • Joy Sharman

    i was there and so proud to see how dedicated everyone was .Roger Helmer as always totally for the people .a dedicated man and an honour to help.Nigel Farage was amazing and spread himself about,happy to listen and answer anyone who wanted things explaining.,as we all were.people from off the streets came flooding in to help at the last count it was over 300.thats the peoples army .so very very proud

    • Rose Hush

      That sounds lovely Joy, I have goosebumps! I am so pleased that the people are getting together.
      I met Nigel Farage in Stannington on his commonsense tour
      last year. He talked for about an hour, he was articulate, passionate and
      you could tell he believed in what he was saying. I believed in what he
      was saying too and I never thought I would say that about ANY politician. I
      was very honoured to meet this man. Good Luck for Thursday Roger!

      • Joy Sharman

        hi rose.i felt very proud and the people were lovely.listening to the people share there concerns and totally understanding what they felt was comforting as you know your not on your own .i counted 7 people come to me saying were following the people this time .they cant all be wrong.and the dirty tricks tells us were doing the right thing.the people are very wise to this now and it just shows the true colours of the other partys.xx

        • Rose Hush

          I bet you did! Its a lovely feeling when like minded people come together.There is so much wrong in our country and all the other politicians don’t address it, they simply treat the public with comtempt and hope we will go away. The thing is Joy, I think they will ignore at their peril, as people are so angry and disillusioned everywhere I go. I hope that UKIP go from strength to strength and I wish Roger and them all good luck for Thursday and thank you for your input too. x

          • pajeroexceed

            They are going from strength to strength But will come under sustained attack from now on by the Media and its masters in the establishment… Don’t lose sight of the goal. keep strong, keep talking about UKIP everywhere you go, … UKIP .. all the way to outright power and victory…

            • Rose Hush

              Absolutely, our support for UKIP will never waver!!

    • pajeroexceed

      I bet you were proud. Keep strong The next five ( short ) years will be crucial and critical to UKIP, It will come under sustained attack from an Horrified Establishment and media… Drive the message home to the increasingly receptive Population, UKIP UKIP. all the way to victory…..

  • revkevblue

    Slag off the UKIP army all you like, but we have a cause that we believe in passionately and we have a voice at long last, and it is getting louder by the day.

    • pajeroexceed

      Spot on, good sentiments spoken here. Good on you all….

  • Rose Hush

    Yes we are all in it together, not!
    Newark by election: Tory candidate Robert Jenrick says that just because he has 3 homes “it doesn’t mean I don’t know about life on the breadline” Presenting himself as a father, local man and small businessman. In fact he owns 2 x £2m homes and £1m country which he rents. Mr Jenrick rejects claims that he has covered up his and his wife’s £5 million property portfolio and £500,000-a-year joint earnings to try to win the Newark seat.

    • Hexhamgeezer

      No wonder he backs dave. Think of all those cheap cleaners he needs for those houses.

      • pajeroexceed

        Oh ! Not you again !!

    • Tom

      A young man worth millions oh yes I’m sure he understands what it means to count the pennies.

  • Fraser Bailey

    The Tory candidate seems to represent everything that is wrong about Britain and the Tories. I hope he loses.

  • Lady Magdalene

    There not a single example of blue rinse in that photograph: the writer is once again sneering at ordinary members of the public who believe in the cause they are fighting for.

    And that’s what The Establishment (including their tame hacks) can’t understand. We BELIEVE we are right. We both trust and like our Party Leader – not least because he and the rest of the Party Leadership don’t sneer, insult, ignore and denigrate their voters.

    We are fighting to restore our Sovereignty and Democracy. LibLabCON want our Sovereign birthright compromised by EU membership; so we have no control over our country, or borders, or even our legal system.

    Anyone with any sense of this country’s history of stubborn independence from continental domination should be out on the streets helping UKIP.

    • pajeroexceed

      The lib/ Lab con have a place in uk Politics, Its where I take my land fill every week… Time for serious change. UKIP is that breath of fresh air…

  • Denis_Cooper

    “He also gave the obligatory digs towards the Conservative candidate, Robert Jenrick, who is ‘gilded youth’ and a ‘London property millionaire’ who has
    already bought a residence in Vincent Square, a convenient walk from the
    House of Commons. Helmer said he has worked in international trade for
    ‘slightly longer than Mr Jenrick’s lifetime’.”

    That’s pretty weak stuff, given that everyone knows that the Tories tend to favour “gilded youth”, but most people aren’t driven by the politics of envy anyway.

    Surely there must be something else in his background that could be used against him, something he or somebody linked to him has said or done or possibly thought in the past to be dredged up and distorted and misrepresented to smear him?

    OK, so UKIP may not have the resources to do that kind of trawl for thousands of Tories, like the Tories did with over 2000 UKIP candidates – and found less than 1% of cases where a plausible smearing story could be fed to their friends in the media including, the Guardian – but this is just one Tory who needs to have mud slung at him so he is exposed to public opprobrium.

    I don’t know why UKIP is holding back, a misplaced sense of decency perhaps?

  • Grey Wolf

    UKIP has jolted British politics out of their complacency and corruption. But there is still a long way to go to 2015 general elections and there can be no let up in the momentum. What UKIP should aim for in 2015: absolute annihilation of Lib Dems, reduce their vote share to less than 4 or 5%; galvanise the white working class votes in all the (erstwhile) industrial towns; get as many upset Tories as they can, and there are hordes of them; force a hung parliament in 2015 and hold the trump card.

    • pajeroexceed

      UKIP will come under sustained attack from an Horrified Establishment and an equally menacing media. But watch the media come on side once UKIP is seen as the victor over the next few years,

  • David
  • John Clegg

    We also need to get the message out to Labour supporters in Newark that the best thing they could do is to vote tactically for UKIP and beat the Tories that way.

    This could be one of the biggest political upsets in years, that’s why the Tories are pouring into Newark, they are “wetting” themselves with fright.

    • Mynydd

      So right wing Mr Farage needs help from left wing Labour to beat the Conservatives in Newark. That’s logic that is.

      • Tom

        Labour left wing is a joke.
        Also UKIP are not looking to Labour Party but people who have voted for Labour in the past, that’s how politics works you take votes from other parties .
        Many people who vote Labour have the same aspirations as Conservative voters.
        Barking mad lefties are a small minority.

        • pajeroexceed

          well. yes indeed the old lefties of the 60s and 70s are now feeling the heat of their stupidity today..

      • John Clegg

        If I might say, you miss my point completely. I’ll say it slowly for you. Labour hate the tories much more than they hate UKIP, in fact some labour supporters are already voting for UKIP (especially in the North) because previously the LibLabCons were just not listening to the vast majority of the electorate. So it would be a very small step for them to vote tactically for UKIP. (there, I hope that’s clearer!)

        • pajeroexceed

          why did you wast your time

          • John Clegg

            “Mea culpa”, I didn’t realise he was a labour troll. I initially thought I could educate him and get him to join the human race. I do see now that was an impossibility.

            • pajeroexceed

              John, you cannot do anything for these ‘ losers ‘. Their time will come when they cannot escape their idiocy, These twerps think that they are going to evade the consequences of their own short sighted visions of what is coming…

    • pajeroexceed

      I think I saw ‘ David ‘ Cameron ‘ crapping himself behind a bush !!

  • global city

    If they achieve nothing else then UKIP will have served British democracy well by reinvigorating it and inspiring people who have lost interest in it for years.

    This reinvigoration will, in itself, help to bring about our dictatorship by the EU, as it has only been able to creep into our lives as millions became disengaged and uninterested in their birthright.

    In addition, of course, they have helped to put vital issues of national survival back into the ring for debate, something the establishment have succeeded in burying for 40 years.

    Well done UKIP. The rest of the political class should hang their heads in shame for what they have allowed to be ‘transferred’ to alien, undemocratic rule.

    • Mynydd

      You can only serve British democracy well by telling the voters what you stand for. So far UKIP have not done this, therefore logically they have not served British democracy well.

      • the viceroy’s gin

        You best go convince the massive numbers who are voting for them.

      • pajeroexceed

        keep watching

  • cargill55

    The old parties of the Liblabcon oligarchy are discredited through failure, cronyism , nepotism, parasitism and as purveyors of corporate fascism with their EU , big business, super rich and bureaucracy mates.
    UKIP is the antidote to this mix of liberal left extremism and corporate fascism which benefits everyone except the British people with t’s philosophy of a sovereign, democratic Britain putting British people first with common sense policies.
    There are five fundamental issues which Liblabcon will not fix.
    – EU membership.
    – Mass uncontrolled immigration.
    – A state which spends 50% of our GDP running itself badly with tax and spend not fit for purpose.
    – A broken political system giving away sovereignty and destroying democracy.
    – A foreign policy where we are a poodle of the USA , bow to the EU and where we do not respect our military.
    All our problems flow from that.
    Liblabcon are wholly unwilling to confront these issues, UKIP would, so no pact .

    • Ooh!MePurse!

      Pact? I certainly don’t want any pact with Ukip.

      Only the Conservative Party can deliver change in Europe. Already been instrumental in reducing the EU budget.

      Ukip have achieved precisely nothing, other than banking allowances, something that the founders of the party promised they would never do. I have no trust whatsoever in Farage; he’s in politics for the money and the self-promotion. He has no principles – the party says different things, makes different promises according to their main opponents, much in the style of the Liberal Democrats. I look forward to the publication of their manifesto, assuming that Farage won’t tear this one up, proof enough of the party’s lack of principle and credibility.

      • global city

        removes cap, tugs forelock and scrunches cap in hands!

        • Ooh!MePurse!

          Please don’t indulge in any forelock tugging on my account. It doesn’t sit easily with a comprehensive school educated man from Hull.

          • Wessex Man

            in that case you should have more sense!

          • global city

            There is nothing left in the Tory party for those who are not Liberal Progressives or the grandee establishment.

          • global city

            Touche!

      • Fergus Pickering

        Who cares about their manifesto. We know what they stand for. Manifestoes are all so much bumph anyway.

      • Kitty MLB

        Just a tempest in a teapot. Anyone can say what’s popular and throw
        stones at the ‘establishment’ when they have no actual responsibility.
        Nigel Farage has said himself that he will leave politics when we leave
        the EU. That’s his entire concern, he’s not interested in the not very
        exciting everyday life of running a country.
        But we’ll see. The peoples army say they wish to take the working
        class vote.

        • Brimstone52

          Some people are good at setting things up or when there is a battle to be fought.

          Other people are good at the day to day grind of running an organisation once peace has broken out.

          Unlike some, Farage recognises his limitations. His forte is leading a British revolution.

          • Kitty MLB

            Actually I quite like Nigel but its a revolution
            now is it. Or is Nigel the new Wellington
            and the next election his Waterloo.You’d
            you he would enjoy it.And the English
            people will be rioting in the streets.
            He would love that too as a revolutionary
            leader, battling against the elected establishment.

            • Wessex Man

              Well he’s certtainly no Heath or Major, I’ll give that and having been to my shame years ago a Tory member, he inspires more with one speech more than any other I can remember, bring on the revolution my dear and remember that next year it’s the 200 years since Waterloo. You can come and join us in our celebrations there if you are nice to us!

            • Brimstone52

              It’s a British revolution, to unseat an unrepresentative establishment.

              • pajeroexceed

                liked your post

            • Fergus Pickering

              Nothing like a good riot. Assuming it happens somewhere else. Say Liverpool. They are used to that sort of thing.

              • Kitty MLB

                Yes, the North. Those Dark Satanic Mills. Bring me thy bow
                of burning gold & arrows of desire. Problem is you need energy to revolt. And don’t they in Liverpool spend a lot of
                time eating junk food and sitting on sofa’s ?
                And they would need a clever chap like you to help write on the cardboard. And as long as there is no rioting down here.

        • Fergus Pickering

          There are plenty of chaps, and some chapesses, absolutely yearning to run the country. No shortage. Others of us have better things to do, don’t we, Kitty?

          • Kitty MLB

            Others of us most certainly do Fergus, dear.
            And thank goodness.

      • Rallan

        “Only the Conservative Party can deliver change in Europe. Already been instrumental in reducing the EU budget.”

        Smoke, mirrors and spin. Britain has actually ended up paying more than before.

        • Mynydd

          Any one can write a list, what matters is how you make it come about. Take:
          Lower tax and spend and balanced books. Which taxes will you cut, on what will you stop spending and how exactly will these insure the books are balanced. At present the monthly overspend is about £90bn. Cutting tax will increase this, however cutting spending will reduce this so tell me how you will cut over £90bn a month from government spending.

          • Rallan

            Not sure you intended to reply to me, but I do know that all policies in the forthcoming UKIP manifesto will have been independently assessed, fully costed and peer reviewed.

            No doubt there will be debate to be had, but the policies proposed will be at least as good as anything from the older parties.

            • Mynydd

              You are right I intended to reply to cargill55 and his list.

        • pajeroexceed

          that’s all very well. But why this is all taking place. The country is

      • Brimstone52

        The Tories have cetainly delivered great change in the UK’s relationship with other countries in Europe.

        It was the Tories who dragged us, unbidden, into the EEC, it was the Tories who signed us up to the Sigle European Act, again unasked for, and it was the Tories who who signed us up to the Maastrict Treaty and those who objected were labelled “bastards”.

        Without the Tories, UKIP would never have come about. I’m just disappointed that the Tories sold the country out so comprehensively that anyone thought there was a need for a party like UKIP.

        • pajeroexceed

          We should not be too harsh on Tony Blair. He has brought about the UKIP phenomena with his multicultural dream of enriching our lives. Still looking for someone who feels enriched ! Ah ! may have found a handful on these ‘ posts ‘

      • Wessex Man

        er, the EU has demanded and Dave will bow another £3.5 billion because it’s not going to meet it’s buget. Thanks to Call me Dave the CAP payments were slashed, unfortunately only HERE!

      • cargill55

        , Farage and UKIP just oppose the Liblabcon system.
        UKIP wants a sovereign and democratic Britain.
        Smaller v big state.
        Sovereign v Britain in a superstate.
        Lower tax and spend v higher tax and spend
        No political correctness or multiculturalism v political correctness and
        multicultural extremism.
        Defend Britain v illegal and unnecessary wars
        Functioning democracy v broken democracy
        Keep nation state v EU superstate
        Controlled v uncontrolled immigration
        Deal with illegal immigrants v let 1 million illegal immigrants stay
        Welfare as a short term basic emergency v welfare as a lifestyle
        Lower tax and spend and balanced books v higher tax and spend and soaring state debt
        Common sense Britain v cronyism, quangocracy, charitocracy, bureaucracy.
        Britain first v Britain last.
        No instant immigrant benefits v immediate immigrant benefits
        EU exit v EU
        Emergency humanitarian aid v £60 billion every 5 years.
        NHS with fewer managers and higher standards v NHS cronyism.
        Tough on Law & Order v Soft on Law & Order
        No unnecessary foreign wars v EU/US expansionism.

        • jaz

          Posting the same lists time after time after time doesn’t make it any truer. Even Helmer admitted he couldn’t say how UKIP would tackle the financial crisis because the policy wasn’t written.

          UKIP is a blank slate on which people project their wishes. We have already seen reality bust in on the dream as Farage has had to back away from his flat tax plan.

          I look forward to reading its manifesto. If it is anything like the last one it will be good for a laugh.

          It is clear that despite the angry blue rinse mob desperately wishing it not to be so, the Tories will hold Newark. UKIP is not going to win a single seat at the next general election.

          • pajeroexceed

            presumably from that little outburst ‘ You are relishing the future in store for people like you ?

            • jaz

              People like me? West Ham United supporters? We didn’t go down. For us that counts as a successful season so yes very much so.

              • pajeroexceed

                yes west Ham supporter eh. Good for you I lived for 30 years in a house that backed onto the stadium near the Upton park stadium. Went there recently on a nostalgic visit !

                can’t say I recognised the area

                • jaz

                  I always think supporting West Ham is a great way to prepare you for life. We are masters of snatching defeat from the jaws of victory, so it teaches you to savour the little successes. How boring life must be as Man U supporter.

                • pajeroexceed

                  I get your drift. But I think you may have absconded onto the wrong ‘ thread ‘. But good luck with your support for West Ham. Oh those lovely days back in the 60s eh ! Never to return.

        • pajeroexceed

          Not to mention too loudly, Femail genital mutilation, school kids having their thoughts perverted by alien relegion, fake exam passes, grooming children for sexual exploitation etc etc etc etc etc, oh and 15000 of ethnic origin in our prisons at £ 400 a pop per day ! ( time to get your calculators out ). No. It’s time for UKIP alright….

      • pajeroexceed

        Are you on something chum ? Principals !! ? Credibility ? You should have your alarm clock repaired …

  • cargill55

    UKIP.
    Lower taxes, lower business costs and consumer prices, higher trade through the reinstatement of common sense sovereign democracy where the state does what it should and not what benefits big government and big business.
    Kick out the Liblabcon oligarchy to make Britain prosperous again.

    • dalai guevara

      excluded from TED bidding – no big deal, hey big boy?

      • Michele Keighley

        It may have escaped your notice, dg that there is a great big world out there which consumes about 80% of UK’s exports – only blinkered people with a small agenda would see the EU as the be-all and end-all for the UK

        • Mynydd

          It may have escaped your notice we already trade with the big world out there. So please tell me what country the EU stops us trading with. Answers on a post card to Mr Farage c/o the EU Parliament Building, Brussels.

        • dalai guevara

          We cannot trade with the US?
          The EU is stopping us??
          Jeez, what are all these crispy creme walmart starbucks amazon apple people doing here???

          Send them home!

  • Colonel Mustard

    Heather Tomlinson writes for the Guardian…

    • David

      You could just ‘feel’ her trying to stop herself from making a patronising, condescending comment, couldn’t you?

    • Jabez Foodbotham

      UKIP’s blue rinse brigade

      Does she write their hairdressing column?

  • Rose Hush

    I hope with all my heart that the good people of Newark vote for UKIP, I believe they are what this country needs. The 3 EU puppet parties don’t give a damn about Britain or its people. They are only concerned about power, money and their own self importance. They have all been rendered politically impotent taking their orders from the hierarchy in Brussels.
    The most important issue is to free ourselves from this expensive, undemocratic, corrupt, fraudulent dictatorship the EU and hand power back to the people. We need to put our £50m a DAY EU contribution into our OWN hospitals, schools, jobs, prisons, elderly care, manufacturing and everything else that is wrong with this country.
    Its not racist to want to control immigration, its commonsense, UKIP want to
    allow immigrants who will benefit our country from all over the WORLD unlike
    the others only wanting it from Europe, who happen to be white.
    Lets shake off the arrogance of ConLabLib who think we are ‘thick’
    ‘peasants’ and we are not to be trusted with important decisions, lets show
    them this is not a protest vote and that the people of Newark mean business.
    Vote UKIP.(4.3million UK citizens did for the European Elections)

    UKIP will return pride to the UK and the power back to the people; they have passion for this country and its future. I hope the good people of Newark vote UKIP for the people’s army, there are many throughout the country pinning their hopes on you. x

    • Neil

      I am from North West Leicestershire and I went to Newark on Saturday to help ukip, although I am not a member. I also hope with all my heart that ukip can do it. I will be proud if one day my kids can say that we were there when it all changed. I teach my kids that if you want change then you go out and make it happen…..

      • Rose Hush

        Well done and well said Neil . If Newark vote for UKIP, they will go down in history as the town who started the change, to taking back our once great country.

        • Mynydd

          When the Green party won its first seat in parliament did that start a change.

          • Tom

            I think sovereignty is more important than wind farms don’t you.

          • the viceroy’s gin

            …you’re comparing socialist nutters to conservatives. That would be a mistake.

    • Ooh!MePurse!

      I hope with all my heart that the good people of Newark vote Conservative.

      I’m interested in your view that the Conservative Party thinks that people are ‘thick’ and ‘peasants’. What is it that leads you to that view?

      • Rose Hush

        Boris Johnston has described Ukip voters as peasants in revolt after Eurosceptic parties swept to victory across the union. The clue was right there!

        • Ooh!MePurse!

          I think if you read what he wrote you’ll see that he was referring to the ‘ peasant’s revolt’ as something that can’t be ignored. He isn’t saying that Ukip or any other voters are actually peasants, he’s drawing an historical parallel and suggesting that the pro-federalist ‘leaders’ of Europe regard anyone expressing opposition to be peasants, to be dismissed. He doesn’t agree with that view of voters, he states that the election results are ‘ an expression of revulsion and discontent’.

          • Neil

            I think Boris would do well to bless us with his opinion as to where he stands on this instead of stating the stupidly obvious.

            • Ooh!MePurse!

              Perhaps but I was responding to Rose’s claim that Conservative politicians think that voters are ‘thick’ and ‘peasants’. I’ve not yet had any proof of that claim.

              • Neil

                Sorry..wasn’t having a go…I didn’t really take to kindly to that particular comment made by boris although you are correct.

              • Fergus Pickering

                Cameron must think we are thick or he wouldn’t spout the crp he does. Hang him high, fellows. Boris would do as Tory leader. I thnk we could do a deal with that man.

                • Kitty MLB

                  ‘Hang him high’ Oh why don’t the peoples army go the whole hog. A plethora of medieval methods of torture such as the
                  Rack or the Breaking Wheel. Everyone will find it most artistic
                  and its what the evil ‘establishment’ deserve .
                  And the next Tory leader will be a woman clearly Ladies make
                  the best leaders as the Tory party know and fellows need a rest, clearly and not just politicians.
                  Boris is a golden retriever, a mop head and Byron without
                  the talent…and we are not dealing with him.

                • Wessex Man

                  Agree entirely, Boris as leader of the Tory Party would be a gift to UKip and labour!

                  Vote Boris!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

                • Kitty MLB

                  You have replied to the wrong comment
                  again !

                • Wessex Man

                  no my dear I was replying to you both, it is allowed you know.

                • Fergus Pickering

                  A poetic exaggeration. He may retire to his estates. And Boris will succeed him.I know I have my crystal ball though it does not tell me who will win in Newark. Who do you fancy, Kitty?

                • Kitty MLB

                  A poetic exaggeration, he says whilst frowning.
                  Boris has the likeness of Byron’s talents I
                  never mentoned poetry which is a gift sent
                  from the heavens my dear fellow.
                  This crystal ball of yours, did you buy it at
                  a local fair, from a lady in a tent wearing a
                  purple dress.You should of drank from the
                  fountain of knowledge, as you normally do
                  instead of these newfangled balls.
                  It will never be Boris, ever.It will be Theresa
                  May and I have feminine intuition…you don’t
                  so there !
                  Newark, its between the grizzily old fellow
                  and the boy who looks too young to shave.
                  What a choice…But I am a Tory.

                • Fergus Pickering

                  So am I. When there is a proper Tory party to vote for, and not Cameron’s crypto-socialist gang, then I will vote for it.

                • Kitty MLB

                  Indeed you are. Not a kipper on a bicycle. So Tory blue there
                  must have been Royalty amongst you ancestors. Glad you never said Lib/Lab/Con, I would have fallen off my seat ! So my fellow Conservative, has placed himself in exile. A hermit waiting wandering the political wasteland waiting for the promised leader. I was there once wailing about the arch- deceiver before giving him another chance..
                  This new leader after Cameron will turn up wearing kitten heels
                  and be full of grace and charm. That all wandering Tories will
                  return. And she will hit Fergus with the shoes.

                • Mynydd

                  You could also say, Farage must think we are thick or he wouldn’t spout crp he does. I must say, all those who think that the EU is at the root of all our problems, are indeed thick.

                • the viceroy’s gin

                  …no, the albino poshboy is a clone of the Camerloons.

              • Kitty MLB

                There is no proof.Just another inflammatory
                remark that helps other parties.

                • Wessex Man

                  Kitty, the words fall out of their own mouths no matter what people like OohMePurse spout.

          • Michele Keighley

            Well that is a good response, and I read it all the way through and then thought how nice it is to have someone who knows exactly how Boris thinks and feels and can put words into his mouth to explain away what he did say by claiming he actually meant something entirely different. Thank you .. I am totally unconvinced.

          • Blindsideflanker

            Well, the Cameron Conservatives felt that the 1922 Committee would be better if they ran it. The local activists they felt weren’t capable of selecting their own candidates and had A listers foisted on them. The membership had pretty much all participatory powers removed from them. They are now only expected to turn up at stage managed events, previously known as party conferences, and applaud the leaders speech at the appropriate time , and I believe the Cameron Conservatives sought to confiscate local party funds.

            Hardly showing any respect, and this was to their own.

            Then look at what has come out of their mouths ,’ Sour faced little Englanders’, ‘Tory Taliban’ , ‘Fruit cases’, loonies, and closet racists’ .

        • Fergus Pickering

          I think the good Boris was joking.

      • Tom

        Have you forgot pleb gate already.

        • Kitty MLB

          Oh yes that Leftie little plot to get a Tory. We all know that now
          so move on. That one is somewhat ancient…Yawn!
          Maybe you could also make a little class war.If you need to
          play games.

          • Tom

            You seem a touch irritable this morning, remember your comment about having a S O H.
            By the way how was it a plot?.

            • Kitty MLB

              Clearly I got my S O H out and forgot where I
              put it…..I ‘m sure I’ll find it around somewhere.

      • Wessex Man

        er the way they/you behave down here in the west country, win a County election, two days later make 2,000 redundant, cut social services, award themselves allowance increase of 100%.

        Yes the Tories certainly know how to make friends!

    • Mynydd

      How come you believe UKIP are what this country needs, when even UKIP it self doesn’t know what it stands for. Take income tax, they had in its 2010 manifesto a flat rate tax of 32%, which means the low paid more income tax, while the well off, like Mr Farage, on the EU gravy train, would have a tax cut.

      • Rose Hush

        I know that the ConLabLib is NOT want this country needs or deserves!! You are spouting from an old manifesto, their new one comes out in September. Even so, what you are failing to include is that UKIP would not tax anyone on the minimum wage which is currently £13,000 (£3,000 above Libdems) nor would they pay NIC, which means a couple could earn £26,000 before paying any tax at all, sounds good to me!

        The most important issue for our country is to free ourselves from this expensive, undemocratic, corrupt, fraudulent dictatorship the EU and hand power back to the people and maybe then we will be free to do what is right for OUR country and the nation.

        Nigel Farage receives an allowance, as do 72 other British Mep’s, he uses his to fight against the EU dictatorship, thay are not too happy about that, but it is within the rules. He has the balls to take on the EU, 3 EU puppet parties, the BBC and the Media. He doesn’t need this job, he is doing it because he has a passion for this country and its people. He would be happy to be sacked when we leave the EU, as his job would be done!!

        • Mynydd

          It is not an old manifesto it is their present one and what we must look to for UKIP’s policies. It is within the rules, so were duck houses.

          • Rose Hush

            Just like a politician, never absorb information or respond to issues, completely blinkered.

            Like ALL parties their manifesto for GE 2015 is NOT out yet. (You even said it was 2010 manifesto.) But lets say it flat rate of tax exists now , you completely ignore how good it would be, Clegg was ecstatic at nearly reaching £10,000 personal allowance, here we are in a heatbeat at £13.000, but hey you be flip as you want to.
            Please dont be stupid, ‘a duck house’ is hardly the same as a party who is fighting tooth and and nail to get our country back from a German dominated dictatorship and you talk about duck houses. You wave your little white flag if you want to and surrender to foreign powers but I will never do so and thank god we have a party like UKIP.who feels the same.

  • BarkingAtTreehuggers

    There can be no doubt that UKIP want this seat.
    There can also be no doubt that this by-election is in the bag.
    Why anyone would still bother is beyond me.

    • the viceroy’s gin

      …you mean, all your sockpuppets are voting there?

  • Streben80

    I speak to so many people who have been in politics with other parties that simply cannot believe the passion of both activists and voters of UKIP.
    The other parties simply have no answer to the emotional connection UKIP makes with people, people who for so long have been treated like they simply dont matter – well guess what, they matter to UKIP.
    The Tories have to demand activists turn up for a by-election, UKIP just tell em where to meet and they flood in from everywhere. At first I wasnt sure about the People’s Army slogan but having seen it myself I actually think it may be spot on.

    • Neil

      I was in Newark on Saturday and you are absolutely right, there were ukip members who had travelled many miles just to volunteer in any way they could. I was stood outside the campaign office and never in my life have a seen a queue going out of the door of people wanting to join and pay there and then…truly amazing stuff. People were openly laughing at the stall that labour had laid out and around the Conservative stall there was no one but a lonely lady sat on her own. As for the Liberal, well bus pass elvis got more attention.

      • telemachus

        Only one nice Tory Lady because they will romp it and burst the Ukip bubble

        • Neil

          Ha ha did you know that optimism is a fine line between brave and being a fool…I think we should have a survey on how much you fall into the latter..

        • Jono

          You were up at circa 4am writing this tripe.

      • mark

        like a bunch of used car salesmen acting like born again christians

        • Neil

          Ah the politics of envy….Always a sure sign of desperation.

      • Ad Pikett

        I don’t know what Newark you visited? Newark New Jersey? The Conservatives had a stall [and a campaign shop] with at least 30 people there giving out balloons, leaflets, answering questions etc, and that was just in the market square – oh and William Hague helped out.

        You are right that UKIP had lots of travelling supporters. That’s because they have no local campaigners so they just bused a load of opportunist carpetbaggers in. Bit of waste of time though as they won’t win.

        • Neil

          Nah im sure I was at the right Newark, I went up the a46 from leicester, but hey, dont shoot the messenger I was only commenting on what I saw. My daughter got a blue balloon but I think it might not look well come thursday. Look im a life long tory who has just had enough and I just want better for me and my children. I spoke to both Labour and Tory activists and I politely said with respect that I do not agree with them and why, so stop the name calling and come up with something worth while.
          I didnt see hague sweating but i saw the guy saying stop the banks making money which made my 12 yr old daughter laugh and I saw a young socialist worker who told me he was a marxist but he had an iphone, and my 6 yr old had her picture taken with bus pass elvis.

          • Ad Pikett

            Oh, well, we were definitely there – I set the stall up at 9am! Maybe had gone to pub for lunch for 10 or 12 pints.

            I think you mean the Patriotic Socialist Party candidate, just the name is an oxymoron! Dave from Bus Pass Elvis Party went to the pub with us.

            • Neil

              Yes I have to admit that I didnt get there till half 12 so maybe I just missed most of it…

        • Cyril Sneer

          Someone is bitter and a trifle ruffled me thinks.

        • Joy Sharman

          THE PEOPLE DONT WANT A BALLOON ,THEY WANT A PARTY WHO CARES .SHEEEEEEEEEEEESH WHAT PART DONT YOU GET

          • Ad Pikett

            I don’t understand, balloons are key to victory in any election, don’t you know anything about campaigning???

            • Joy Sharman

              you guys are so out of touch with the people its unreal .your gonna lose

    • Ricky Strong

      It is and always has been evident, that people have a voracious appetite for democracy and it is certainly apparent that at this moment in time they are parched.

      • global city

        Who knows…. perhaps even one day the flaperati may wake up to the fact that it is as much THEIR birthright, freedom and democracy that has been ceded to the High Authority of the EU….. to never be influenced by their flapping gums ever again?

        Imagine, Polly Toynbee going on and on, knowing that her ranting is utterly, completely futile, and yet she noisily campaigns for a system that would leave her impotent, so therefore probably unemployed!

        • Ricky Strong

          I do often wonder, where and when did it all go so terribly wrong? Perhaps the answer can be found around about 1972.

          • Tim Reed

            …and 1997.

    • global city

      WWII was not won on some economic rationale, it was won by tapping of some fundamental principles of right and wrong.

    • Ooh!MePurse!

      The only thing that matters to Ukip are their allowances. Their MEPs have achieved precisely nothing on behalf of their voters.

      • David

        They’ve crowbarred a referendum out of Cameron, for a start. That’s probably the most significant thing that will have happened to our country in 40 years…

        • Kitty MLB

          You may find that was due to Cameron’s own party.Also good of you to admit we are actually
          going to have a referendum.Its usually
          denied by others. And will not happen with any
          other party.

          • telemachus

            Think it was Baron
            Not Farage

          • JabbaTheCat

            Credit where credit due, it was Nikki Sinclaire that got that one rolling with her petitions, which triggered the HOC debate with the attendant backbencher revolt…

          • Rose Hush

            THE REAL REASON CAMERON WANTS TO HOLD A
            REFERENDUM IN 2017.

            Between 1st November 2014 and 31st March 2017 the Lisbon
            treaty and the others will be fully in operation and the right of Parliament to legislate over us in 43 areas (the important ones) will be removed and be made subject to approval, by a majority vote of the lying undemocratic and unelected
            EU. One of these 43 areas is the withdrawal of a member state. Basically after March 31st 2017, even if we did vote to leave the EU in a referendum, the EU would still have to vote in favour of it, like that’s going to happen. Cameron will say it’s not his fault.!! No more lies!

      • Fergus Pickering

        And the other MEPs have achieved…?

        • Mynydd

          Two wrongs don’t make a right. Why have UKIP not stopped anti-UK directives.

          • Streben80

            The UK MEPs as a whole cant stop anti-UK directives, we dont have a majority in the Parliament so the idea that any party can block anything there is absurd.

            • Tom

              Our total representation amounts to 8%, the whole thing is a front for those at the top to press ahead with their federalisation.

          • Ben

            Because it is not possible. Which is why we must leave.

      • Wessex Man

        oh hark at it, how many of their MEPs have ben put away for fiddling cpmpared to the Westminster rabble?

      • revkevblue

        They have reduced the unemployment figure also, by making the PM create an anti UKIP propaganda department.

    • Fergus Pickering

      I was a Tory but now I am UKIP at least until we leave the bloodsucking EU.or until it collapses entirely..

      • Mynydd

        I was UKIP but now I am Labour. I don’t want the NHS privatised.

        • Streben80

          Nice try troll. Labour privatised the NHS, not very bright are you?

        • Tom

          You think Labour will be any different then you’re deluded.

          • Kitty MLB

            Labour are the horsemen of the apocalypse. Doom follows
            their every step. Those who say the 3 main parties are the same. should heed my oracular warning.

        • Colonel Mustard

          You are Welsh Labour and always have been.

        • Joy Sharman

          thats a labour lie and you know it

        • Tim Reed

          Read the article next time….

          “Helmer assured the crowd that there were no plans to charge for GP surgeries or privatise the NHS, nor scrap paid maternity leave.”

    • Kitty MLB

      Well if UKIP do win the electorate will see how they handle
      actual responsibility.
      And it would be a big leap from council seats ( not full
      council control) to MP.
      Joining the establishment on those green benches and
      doing more then throwing stones from the sidelines
      well good.

      • telemachus

        Fortunately the good people of Newark have more sense
        *
        Besides there is no race issue there

        • Kitty MLB

          A early morning buzzathon, little wasp!
          By the way, we are not members of the same party.
          I am a Conservative,little wasp. And only Labour make race
          an issue. And have done so deliberately.

          • telemachus

            Swifts and swallows

            • Kitty MLB

              You keep saying this. Have not a clue what you’re rattling about.

              • Wessex Man

                don’t beat yourself up thinking about it, he doesn’t know either.

                • Colonel Mustard

                  He’s alluding to the belief that Labour and the Tories are becoming one party. We already know that and detest it (q.v. Spoonface and Soubrey) but he gloats over it and boasts because it plays to his warped mischief making and he thinks it will spell the end of UKIP.

                  It will spell the exact opposite.

                • Mynydd

                  The end of UKIP will be when they publish their manifesto for the 2015 general election. Make no bones about it, the other party’s will pull it apart, word by word, phase by phase, sentence by sentence, paragraph by paragraph, policy by policy.

                • Streben80

                  Yeah because trying to pull UKIP apart worked last time. Do carry on.

                • Colonel Mustard

                  Yes they will but it won’t make a bit of difference. Because UKIP represent an insurgency. And as long as there are people like you there will be people like them.

                  You best get used to it.

                • Mynydd

                  So now we have an British spring, next we’ll have UKIP putting up barricades in Parliament Square with Mr Farage in the nearest pub pint in hand.

                • Colonel Mustard

                  We need one thanks to people like you.

                • Ben

                  You tell yourself that if it gives you comfort.

                  The opposite will infact be the case.

              • telemachus

                Look up Ladybird predators

          • Ben

            I watched Anna Soubry on the Andrerw Marr Show last sunday. I honestly would not have known if she represented Labour, Conservatives or Lib Dems had it not been stated to whom she belongs.

            For once telemachus has a point of view that is valid.

            • Airey Belvoir

              She has an angry demeanor and a scowl like a bulldog licking piss off a nettle. A most unattractive woman, who surely will lose her seat at the GE.

              • Ben

                Hopefully. Dishonest self server. Hilariously at one point she argued that immigration should not be curtailed and to think it should was racist. 5 minutes later she was bragging that the government was reducing immigration unlike Labour.

                What a liar!

            • Kitty MLB

              As he, good heavens. The little wasp is making valid points,
              whatever next.

              • Ben

                I’m sure it was just one of those ‘laws of probability’ events…..Sooner or later he had to SOMETHING that wasn’t utter nonsense… 😉

      • Rallan

        When UKIP enters Westminster it will be to destabilise establishment, not to join it.

        I think we’ll handle ourselves at least as well as the incompetent, self centered parasites who currently infest the place. I also hope that we’ll prove ourselves to people like you, and maybe even win you over. Stranger things have happened.

        • Kitty MLB

          Oh, people like me? pray tell me sir, who am I ? It’ll be
          so useful to know which party to belong to. Quite like rabble-rousers myself. Westminster can be awfully dull.
          Just find a few places on the floor for all those purple cushions,
          which you’ll need until you remove all that is Red, Blue, Yellow
          and Green. Purple is clearly the new rainbow coalition.
          Brown, would like that.

          • Rallan

            I wasn’t being insulting. You’ve said (elsewhere) that you’re a Conservative, and I base my opinion of your beliefs on your other comments. If I’ve offended you then I apologise.

            • Kitty MLB

              You have’nt offended me, little creature.
              Just being humourous, clearly I have failed..
              Ouch!

              • Wessex Man

                Ouch indeed, you have to have a sense of humour to be humourous.

        • Mynydd

          How can one UKIP MP out of 350 destabilise Westminster? Do you not realise that there are already a number of small parties in the House of Common who find it difficult to get their voice heard. Now we have it, the Greens, SNP, Plaid, Independents, and Northern Ireland MP’s are all incompetent, self centred parasites. This tell you what UKIP are really like under the spin.

          • Colonel Mustard

            Those parties are not under scrutiny like UKIP because they are no threat to the main parties who can afford to ignore them. The more scrutiny and attack that UKIP comes under the more their insurgency will grow.

            • Mynydd

              In Scotland the SNP has been under scrutiny from all the main parties since it was formed because they have actually won seats, so much so they now are in power, whereas UKIP are in power nowhere, they run no councils and have no MPs.
              In Wales Plaid even under scrutiny by all the main parties, have over come it, and unlike UKIP have MPs.

              • Colonel Mustard

                Watch this space. You have no idea where this is going, only where you would like it to go.

          • Rallan

            UKIP is already destabilizing Westminster with zero MPs. Or haven’t you noticed?

            UKIP has a lot more potential, and a lot more public support, than any of those small parties you mention. The first UKIP MP will be the beginning of the end for the status quo, and the establishment parties know it.

            But hey, since you think UKIP is insignificant then you should just relax and laugh it off. Go ahead.

            • Mynydd

              No you are not destabilizing Westminster, just riding on the back of media spin.

              • Rallan

                Really? Well then, you can relax and laugh it off. Underneath it all the British people are actually quite content with the status quo and will soon forget this UKIP silliness. Everything will return to normal and go on as before.

                In denial, much?

      • Tom

        To do what you say will need more than one MP, Labour at the moment are just throwing stones.

    • Tom

      People who support UKIP are passionate, the bottom line is they love their country and see it slipping into foreign rule led by people who care nothing for its people.

      • Mynydd

        we cannot be slipping into foreign rule, Mr Farage has been voted into the EU parliament to stop it happening. There again it could be that he is all mouth.

        • Craig Sweaton

          Every time Farage votes against more powers being granted to the EU parliament, people like you whine that he’s not doing anything to help Britain. It could be that he’s not the one that’s all mouth, considering he’s the one that’s unafraid to stand up to public scrutiny and actually answer questions.

    • Mynydd

      I wonder how many are on benefits?

  • Chingford Man

    I’m glad your photographer didn’t catch me nearly dozing off. My excuse is many hours without food and a vigorous canvass earlier in the day.

    The by-election is going to turn on whether Labour supporters vote tactically to stop the Tories winning. There is a decent Labour presence in Newark, and UKIP is making progress in winning them over. That is my impression from an encouraging canvass in a Labour ward.

    I was surprised not to see more Tories on the ground in Newark town centre. We’ve heard talk about the steamroller in the tame MSM press but UKIP had the centre to itself for most of Saturday. Dozens and dozens of Kippers about.

    The Tories are probably still ahead, assuming that the one poll so far is accurate, which seems open to question.

    http://www.breitbart.com/Breitbart-London/2014/06/01/newark-neck-and-neck

    Anyhow, I have taken a day’s leave to go to Newark tomorrow so perhaps things will be clearer then.

    • global city

      If it gets desperate, just encourage Labour supporters to vote UKIP in order to create havoc amongst the tory party!

      • Tom

        Tactical voting will play a major part in the GE where there is a 3 party split.

    • Ooh!MePurse!

      I’ve seen quite a few references to this website. Have a look at its record, a very unreliable source.

      • Rallan

        Really? Can you back that up? Breitbart London is very new and doesn’t really have a record to speak of.

        • Wessex Man

          I’m a UKip member and don’t bother to ‘use’ it, it is as accurate as Wings over Scotland.

          • Rallan

            I think you’ve replied to the wrong comment?

      • Rallan

        Really? Can you back that up? Breitbart London is very new and doesn’t really have a record to speak of.

  • Tom

    I hope all the effort and exuberance of these Ukippers as the end product they have all worked for UKIP’s first MP , a tall order but who knows times are changing.

    • Alexsandr

      if it scares the st1t out of liblabcon then its worth it.

      • glurk

        As long as its remembered that its all it probably will do, make a few waves. It sounds very much to me as if UKIP supporters are believing their own hype and that everyone else is too. Just how are you expecting modern politics to be deconstructed without an invasion and I dont think the purple lot will do that. Very much a case of ‘Even if you do beat ’em, join ’em’!

    • Fergus Pickering

      Indeed they are. Perhaps Mr Helmer eh?

    • Simon Smalley

      Looks like it’s possible now.

  • telemachus

    No references there to the now accepted moral degeneracy being peddled bu Ukip

    • Lucy Sky Diamonds

      No references because there isnt one. Stick to London issues theres a good girl.

    • JoshuaCzajkowski

      You’re a Labour supporting socialist. I concede to your superior knowledge on all things related to “moral degeneracy”.

      • Alexsandr

        labour know all about moral degeneracy. they have paedophile apologists in their ranks.

        • Wilsonic

          Oh my goodness me, listen, I was watching Harriet Harman on Andrew Marr a few week’s back, banging my head off the wall shouting “WHY ARE YOU ON MY TV!!!!!” I mean, has it just been forgotten? She is a filthy disgusting rodent.

        • Hexhamgeezer

          Including Tele.

          • Alexsandr

            no. he has worse peccadilloes. He think FGM is OK and wants a police state like the DDR

            • Hexhamgeezer

              Indeed – our very own in-house Chekist.

    • Chingford Man

      It’s fairly morally degenerate to put out leaflets in Newark in UKIP colours telling lies about UKIP. Isn’t it?

    • Fergus Pickering

      Dig that moral degeneracy, folks!

    • tastemylogos

      yaaaaawn

  • Lucy Sky Diamonds

    Much prefer, to see a Grammar school, in every town. Rather than a
    Mosque, in every town.

    • telemachus

      Who on earth raised that as any kind of alternative
      *
      Sounds like a compound comment from Gove and Tommy Robinson

      • Lucy Sky Diamonds

        It is called a sense of humour (you know, that much loved human trait that makes life worth living?). I know your lot tend not to have one…..

        • dalai guevara

          haha-ha. The design of the structure pictured above was inspired by both the Hagia Sophia and Baltic Brick Gothic elements. This is no joke.

          • global city

            er….remembering that when the Hagia Sophia was designed it was to Christian aesthetic of the time. 😉

            • dalai guevara

              Indeed. What an impression that must have left on the infidels.

              • global city

                Quite a good one it seems, as they’ve left most of it intact and merely decorated it a bit with some Arab shields and stuff!

                • dalai guevara

                  Exactly, whereas our religion of peace nothing but love bombed the Middle East whilst cruising thru’ back then.

                • Colonel Mustard

                  The Crusades were launched to protect Christians in the Middle East, at the time a majority in the coastal states of Egypt, Palestine and Syria, from successive waves of persecution which were both dynastic and religious in origin. This came not from a single cultural entity or religion but from a sequence of dynastic Arab, Turkish, Kurdish and Mongol invasions, all bringing horrors that make the Crusaders transgressions pale by comparison. The culture of war and conquest was universal but the Crusading kingdoms did not persecute the muslim religion within their realms. Your comment is revisionist tripe and a better perspective can be had just by reading pages 34-35 in this week’s Spectator.

                  Even Islamic writers of the time acknowledged that the Frankish (Crusader) realms were preferred by ordinary muslim farmers and merchants for their tolerance, land husbandry and wealth creation.

                  The recent TV programme on Istanbul was a travesty of revisionism noteworthy more for its outrageous omissions and subjective post-modern slant than any historical veracity, most of which was accidental.

                • dalai guevara

                  Colonel, we thank you for juxtaposing 😉 my post today, something only teleman would usually do.

                  What I cared to point out was the respect for and inclusion of ‘enemy’ culture into one’s own as soon as it becomes apparent how relevant it is – other examples (the other way round) include the Alhambra irrigation system in Granada or the Turkish spas such as Rudas fürdő in Budapest, which both survive today.

                • Colonel Mustard

                  Don’t confuse “juxtaposting” for correcting errors. Or culture for politics and war.

                • dalai guevara

                  “Frankish (Crusader) realms were preferred by ordinary muslim farmers”
                  You sounded just like Eddie there, back in the good old days when curious numbers of ‘postal’ voters endorsed such and other fatuous tripe.

                • Colonel Mustard

                  “Frankish (Crusader) realms were preferred by ordinary muslim farmers”

                  You think that is fatuous tripe eh? Well try reading the chronicle of the Travels of Ibn Jubayr, 1184, and liberate yourself from your own self hatred and bigotry. He wrote:-

                  “We left Tibnin (Toron, within the Kingdom of Jerusalem) by a road running past farms where Muslims live who do very well under the Franks – may Allah preserve us from such temptation! The Muslims own their own houses and rule themselves in their own way. Many Muslims are sorely tempted to settle here when they see the far from comfortable conditions in which their brethren live in the districts under Muslim rule. Unfortunately for the Muslims they have always reason for complaint against the injustices of their chiefs in the lands governed by their coreligionists, whereas they can having nothing but praise for the conduct of the Franks, whose justice they can always rely on.”

                • dalai guevara

                  Hahaha, of course!
                  And the Fourth Crusade, a selfless pilgramage of frantic believers, only hastened the split of Eastern and Western Christian churches as a minor side issue. It all didn’t really happen Colonel, did it?

                • Colonel Mustard

                  So, instead of just acknowledging that your ad hominem dismissal was misplaced you perform your usual sidestep and attribute to me another statement I never actually wrote in order to dismiss it. I refer you back to my original comment and remind you that the passage of all mediaeval armies, regardless of origin or religion, was precarious to those en route but a quite separate matter from the settled governance of Frankish (Crusader) kingdoms in Palestine.

                  Why is it that you lefties can never seem to construct an argument without having to re-invent the opposing viewpoint in order to make your point about it?

                  PS Constantinople was not in Palestine…

                • dalai guevara

                  No, but the Hagia Sophia is which is part of my original comment (!)

                  One wonders at this point whether the Colonel is still fully with it or whether he has decided once again to step with futile wonderment into his black and white, left and right world of the past past.

                  PS Constantinople was and still is (yet renamed) in the Middle East …

                • Colonel Mustard

                  Notwithstanding your ad hominem lets stick to the facts. This was your original comment that I “juxtaposed”:-

                  “Exactly, whereas our own religion of peace nothing but love bombed the Middle East whilst cruisin’ thru’ for a bruisin’ back then.”

                  Oh, look. Nothing about Hagia Sophia there. Just a sweeping generalisation about the MIddle East during what could only be the Crusades. So, no sidestep from me after all.

                  And it was I who was presenting an equivocal view in “juxtaposition” to your black and white one.

                  You can have the last word. I know its important to your little mind/word games and I have better things to do today.

                • dalai guevara

                  Colonel – it all falls perfectly into place: the Hagia Sophia architecture, the Fourth Crusade never making it to ‘your’ Palestine but Constantinople instead, the repeat-raiding of the latter demonstrating the nature of these ‘pilgramages’, as a side issue splitting the Eastern and Western Church. I will now let it go and grant you … the last word.

        • Alexsandr

          its a truism. when they put the socialist gene in, they take the sense of humour one out.

        • Bert3000

          It bears no resemblance to a sense of humour whatsoever.

        • Kitty MLB

          Socialists have no humour and the same goes for any
          extreme party. Its removed with sense and reason.
          Although the buzzing little wasp has humour.

      • Fergus Pickering

        Oh but it is.

      • tastemylogos

        yaaaawn

Close
Can't find your Web ID? Click here