Coffee House

David Cameron has let the extremism row go on – and Labour go on the attack

9 June 2014

9 June 2014

Yvette Cooper has been granted an urgent question on the extremism row at 2.30 today in the Commons, focusing on the conduct of ministers within government. The Shadow Home Secretary is doing her job, making ministers uncomfortable by summoning them to the Commons to answer a question on whether they have broken the ministerial code. But it’s impressive that the row was left to spin out for long enough for Cooper to manage to make an intervention at all.

The dispute between Gove and May made Wednesday’s front pages, but it wasn’t until Saturday that Labour decided to launch its two-pronged attack from Cooper and Tristram Hunt. Cooper argued that morning that the row showed a ‘more serious failure by David Cameron’s Government to develop a joint plan to prevent extremism’, but as with many of her interventions, she’d waited to see how the row went before deciding to capitalise on it. Labour has a relatively long lead time on certain issues, including Home Affairs (this is one of the reasons some of Cooper’s colleagues are frustrated with her performance shadowing Theresa May, which is not just a tribute to the efficacy of the Home Secretary). If the tensions had been shut down earlier, Downing Street could have deprived Cooper of the opportunity to develop her line of attack.


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  • Tony_E

    If the government are smart, they will just bat this away and see if the BBC try to make it more than it is. There’s no point in wasting too much energy in defending something that doesn’t need much defending, no need to give it more credence than it deserves.

  • Swiss Bob

    Why is it that I can’t remember the Tories summoning Labour Govt ministers all the time from 1997 – 2010.

    Gove can always point out that Labour imported 10-15 million immigrants to the UK during their time in office “to rub the right’s face in diversity”.

    Edit: Supermarket estimates are around 77-80 million so that’s around 20 million immigrants.

    • HookesLaw

      Ah so we are relying on tescos to validate your prejudices. This is tescos that sells all that food to obese customers and that leads the rest of us to throw vast quantities away that we do not eat.

      • Tony_E

        Actually, that’s probably not a bad idea – better that the government figures no doubt. I remember in the early years of the last decade there were more new applications for NI numbers than there was either 16 year olds or legal immigrants…

        • HookesLaw

          I’ve read where figures show that for an example Australians throw $8 billion of good food away. Actually the argument is it may be more. Based on that you want to work out the population based on the food we buy?

          Nah, pull the other one.

          • Colonel Mustard

            Come off it. Labour and their civil service and local government fellow travellers were handing out NI numbers, benefits and council houses to anyone who turned up. I saw them in droves at the bus stations every day in the noughties, African families newly arrived with their suitcases and bundles and not a word of English.

            The evidence was/is empirical to anyone other than a half wit.

            • Mynydd

              Forget bus loads, I have seen news reels where they were coming by the boat load with their suitcases and bundles, with Churchill giving them a warm welcome.

              • Colonel Mustard

                I didn’t actually say “bus loads” and I don’t see any relevance at all in immigration pre-1997 to what New Labour unleashed. They presided over the greatest wave of mass immigration this country has ever experienced and all for malevolent party political ends.

          • Swiss Bob

            You really are thick.

            Sales of all sorts of items can be used to gauge a local population.

            Loo roll, tampax, shampoo, it’s not just food.

            And then there are the estimates by the water treatment plants, gas and electric utilities etc etc ad nauseum.

      • Swiss Bob

        You loon, what imagined prejudices are on display?

        Those numbers have been validated by other organisations like water treatment companies.

        And people should note that it was the current Govt that gave up on a proper census through cowardice so the only figures that are available are the estimates, which are based on, you know, companies that have to deliver services and goods to people.

      • allymax bruce

        Anyone who ‘shops’ at tesco’s is more likely to be obtuse, than obese.

    • Shazza

      Just have to walk around the cities and towns. I lived in a large Midlands City and saw the transformation myself. In 1997 headscarves let alone burkas were a rare sight. By 2010 the change was radical. Hordes of headscarves and burka babes, all pushing prams with at least two toddlers in tow and a veritable Tower of Babel sounds emanating from them. Frightening to see how quickly a first world city can be transformed in such a short time.

    • Mynydd

      What’s right pick a figure out of the air.

      • Swiss Bob

        Your comment doesn’t make much sense but let me introduce you to some basic mathematics

        Pop UK circa 1990s 56 million
        Departing Brits to current date approx 6-7 million
        Current UK population between 70 & 80 million.

        You can check the numbers on the Internet and get back to me.

  • Liberty

    This can only turn out bad for Labour. They are in the front line defending barbarism in Birmingham schools, created the circumstances for its taking root and facilitated its growth.

    • Grey Wolf

      Labour should never be forgiven for leading the country into useless wars overseas BUT surrendering at home to all sorts of Islamic obscurantists and extremists. It also altered the country demographically forever.

      Look at Labour. These are all the New Labour faces who caused the problems in the first place. Turning to Tories, they are being run by the ‘Heir to Blair” so why do we expect different results?

      • Liberty

        People should be held to account for every past silly outburst. It is actions that count, not words.

        • Grey Wolf

          Your comment seems like a perfect ”silly outburst”.

    • Holly

      I also agree that this will turn out bad for Labour. The public know that Labour turned a blind eye to hate preaching, spinning it as some sort of moral ‘freedom of speech’ rubbish. while those out in the sticks are coming to understand that in the not too distant future they too will be forced to see more and more houses built around them. They too may be forced to accept what those in other towns and cities have been forced to accept for years, with no consent asked, or given, by the people living there.
      We all will be expected to accept others wearing head to toe clothing, and those unable to afford elite schools will be forced to send their children to schools which also include children who’s first language is not English.
      Sounds far fetched and somewhat scaremonger-ish, but it has been happening, is happening, and will continue to happen unless our politicians do something now… I am now going to watch our politicians in action.

      • allymax bruce

        Well said, Holly, and how right you are.
        Now Rod Liddle can comfortably wear his gorilla suit, and fit just right in!

    • allymax bruce

      Correct; opening-up another ‘front’ to ‘blaming-it-on-Labour’; I’m surprised at Eyvette Cooper, (Labour grandees), falling straight into that one. Bliar would be proud of this ‘stitch-up’.

  • Rhoda Klapp8

    Again, only the bubble squabble counts. It’s all just ammunition in the tribal bickering. And that’s how Isabel presents it. Shallow. So shallow. Can’t you rise above it, for once?

    • Grey Wolf

      I cannot visualise her do that.

  • Blindsideflanker

    Labour can only contemplate this bare faced cheek because they are faced with the Cameron Conservative party who are too lazy and idle to bother getting in the trenches to fight Labour.

    • HookesLaw

      They are in government… that’s what surprisingly takes a bit of time.

      • Kitty MLB

        Indeed Hooky, not quite a comrade, yet I agree with you. Anyone can throw stones from the irrelevance
        of having no responsibility.Even those with big
        socialist feet who caused our rocky country wrecking
        Avalanche.

        • HookesLaw

          It is arguable that the govt should be more propagandistic and attack the opposition more. The view taken I suspect is that the electorate would consider it unedifying. Its a moot point but they are probably right.
          I think the conservatives have always been bad at, well ‘politics’ . Labour have to be reasonably good as they have such a bad product to sell.

          • the viceroy’s gin

            No, we conservatives can be quite good at politics, lad. But you socialist Camerluvvies can’t possibly be good at it, because you’re merely aping your LibLab soumates.

      • southerner

        Apart from when they are bussing Ministers and backbenchers up to the Midlands.

    • Mynydd

      Mr Cameron is not lazy, when he lost the fight with his wife over the TV remote, he got up and walked to the TV to change channels.

  • Hello

    This doesn’t really reflect well on Osborne either if he can’t keep his dog on it’s leash.

  • toco10

    Having overseen and encouraged millions of immigrants to the UK in a cynical ploy to buy votes Labour is most certainly not in a position to raise any criticisms whatsoever.Red Ed and Yvette Cooper together with the last disgraced Labour administration helped create the problem in the first place by allowing immigration on a vast scale never previously experienced.

    • southerner

      Of course. But that doesn’t mean the useless un-conservatives should be let off the hook.

      • Hello

        What’s an “un-conservative”?

        • Blindsideflanker

          A Cameron Conservative who doesn’t seek to conserve anything.

          • Hello

            But surely if you want to stop extremism you have to change something? Are you in favour of conserving extremism?

            • the viceroy’s gin

              Apparently, your boy Dave thinks so, in Libya and Syria and elsewhere.

              • Hello

                I suspect you’re something of a conservative yourself, conserving rare genes. Aren’t you, you fu*king neanderthal?

                • the viceroy’s gin

                  …and speaking of conserving rare genes, your inbred Camerloon poshboys appear to be doing a good job of that, lad .

                • Hello

                  You have to keep the lower classes out of power somehow.

                • the viceroy’s gin

                  …yes, the Camerloons’ eccentricity, lumpen form and misshapen heads make that a mission accomplished.

                • Hexhamgeezer

                  Don’t forget his shiny shiny face. Amazing what genes can throw up.

                • Grey Wolf

                  Easy, boy! You are among grown ups.

                • HookesLaw

                  Don’t make me laugh

                • Grey Wolf

                  Can you laugh?

                • Kitty MLB

                  Can you howl at a full moon..and do you
                  bite.Hooky might need protecting and I am
                  awfully good at that despite his and my political
                  differences.

                • Grey Wolf

                  Dear Kitty, you and Hooky are both progressive lefties. In fact, the Tory party is yours now and so are the broadcast media. You are the establishment.

                  No, I don’t howl at the full moon or bite, not yet at least. But I must find a spot where I can at least look at the gods above (as I stare at the moon) and practise howling. I think most right-minded people in this country may have to start with that soon.

                • HookesLaw

                  The notion that I am a leftie is absurd. But equally I am not an extremist right wing nutter.
                  I am proud to be a conservative and have so voted for neatly 50 years. I vote that way to keep out idiot labour and nasty thick extreme rightwing nutjobs like you

                • Grey Wolf

                  So that confirms my point. You vote tribally, rather than patriotically. You would rather see the nation hurt than the Tories suffer in election.

                • southerner

                  All the Camerloons are not in the slightest bit interested about the nation. Power for powers sake. Nothing more or less.

                • southerner

                  “The notion that I am a leftie is absurd.”
                  It is not. It is patently obvious in every one of your posts.

                • Kitty MLB

                  Dear Grey Wolf, Hooky would hate to be associated with me. This is what I once thought of Cameron.
                  Cold blooded, smoothed faced, placid miscreant.And thus for wider carnage taught
                  to pant.Transferred to gorge thy sister shore
                  ( the EU) The vulgarest tool that tyranny
                  could want.Just enough talent but no more,
                  and offer poison ready mixed.
                  That was before I saw the light.
                  Glad you appreciate the Gods in heaven
                  above, especially Zeus.
                  And I trust if you bite it shall not be me.

                • Grey Wolf

                  Wonderful. That’s a neat little composition. You must post more like that. The gods and goddesses of Europe (Zeus, Odin, Tvasta, Freya et al) stare down from the heavens above and are probably sad at the spectacle they see and what’s come over their children. I hope at some point they will intervene.

                • Kitty MLB

                  I have done so in the past, but now must refrain. As this solitary, furry creature awaits divine intervention from the heavens
                  watching Helios riding his chariot across the sky. I hope
                  he calls upon that invincible warrior goddess of ancient Britain the beautiful and invincible goddess Andraste.
                  I wouldn’t trust any other god or goddess from Europe if I were you. Gods and Goddesses from ancient Greece are
                  far more reliable and there just happens to be a full moon
                  tonight just for you.

                • Grey Wolf

                  Indeed, all English people should seek divine intervention now, given the sheer scale of villainy they face. The gods will answer, of that I am sure.

                  Its so pleasant to hear our very own goddess’s name being invoked in the pages of Speccie – Andraste / Andrasta. On a more serious note, there is a higher level ‘spiritual unity’ amongst the Indo-European (if you haven’t heard the term please google it, you will be pleasantly surprised / its a term used in context of archaic history, linguistics and pre-Christian European religion) gods and goddesses. A chariot-riding supreme goddess, protector of her people, of their fertility and survival, is there in all the I-E cultures. There is not much difference b/w Freya, Cybele and Andraste on a higher spiritual elevation.

                • Kitty MLB

                  I am sure you are right, solitary creature. The Gods will
                  will intervene, especially to those unconventional types who appreciate the mysticism of life. Thank you I have always
                  been interested in archaic history and the pre- Christian
                  Gods and Goddesses are so fascinating and such wonderful
                  tales. I am minded of Ovid’s Metamorphoses, as you will
                  know he wrote in a similar way to the Alexandrian poets.
                  I just remember Cybele being mentioned in one of those books.. I shall wander off and start reading about a chariot
                  riding supreme goddess when I find her and more besides.

                • LadyDingDong

                  And what would the noble Lord Byron make of today’s milksop Conservatives my dear Kitty? Would he party with them, box their ears or swim the Hellespont to get away from them? The latter I think. Shorn of Gove, May, Pickles, IDS and Hunt we are left with nothing but a NuLabtard copy and as sure as Burnham is a lying toe rag, our leader Cameron is more Social Democrat than a carrier of the great Lady’s flame.

                • HookesLaw

                  At you, all the time

                • Grey Wolf

                  Good. I knew you were an insane progressive Tory tribalist.

            • Colonel Mustard

              If things had been properly conserved here those advocating extremism would be someone else’s problem somewhere else. Don’t confuse the need for a cure with the reason for the infection.

              • Hello

                I didn’t. But thank you for the terse lecture.

                • Grey Wolf

                  You needed one. You will need more in future. So keep your seat in the upright position.

                • Colonel Mustard

                  Yes you did.

                  “But surely if you want to stop extremism you have to change something?”

                  You stop it by preventing it coming here in the first place. And you do that by valuing the treasures of your own country in preference to sharing them with the whole world so that eventually they are destroyed by the influx. The changes wrought so far are why we have the problem. Mr Powell was trying to tell the idiots that in 1968.

                  And if you do want to stop it you should show that you mean it, not do a silly juggling act by pretending it doesn’t exist for fear of giving offence whilst at the same time incrementally stealing the liberties of the indigenous population.

                  Launching wars against sovereign countries doesn’t help much either.

                • Hello

                  You really want to have a stupid argument about semantics?

                  That quote does not mean that I “confuse the need for a cure with the reason for the infection”.

                  Who is pretending that it doesn’t exist? Why are you so anxious to find some reason to dislike Cameron’s government? It’s silly. They’re actually tackling these things that you care so much about.

                • Colonel Mustard

                  Ad hominem again – tiresome. It is not semantics. You are talking about stopping something that already exists and is getting worse by making changes, ipso facto after the event. In other words cure the symptoms not prevent the infection.

                  I already have plenty of reasons to dislike Cameron’s government without having to try to find them. They absolutely suck. As do Labour and the Lib Dems.

                  Or did you think you should be able to roll out your Labour-lite progressive agenda and have everyone applaud? I stopped liking politicians in 1997 although I was never very keen on Major. Cameron gave me a glimmer of hope but then reinforced my dislike by breaking most of his promises.

                  Don’t blame me pal. It’s not me in No.10 or pontificating in the Commons about the fate of a nation they no longer represent.

                • Hello

                  There was nothing ad hominem there, I’m afraid.

                  No, that’s not what I’m talking about. I’m talking about making changes to prevent the infection from happening again.

                  Those are not reasons, they’re just statements.

                  Cameron didn’t break most of his promises, something quite remarkable for a politician. Though, he didn’t get a majority, so he would have been excused for breaking some anyway.

                  I know it’s not you in No. 10 or the Commons, you’re just sniping from the sidelines.

                • Colonel Mustard

                  Er, ‘stupid’, ‘silly’, not ad hominem?

                  The infection exists. It is here. And it is getting worse.

                  I read the Coalition agreement and can see very little substantial progress in implementing any of it. We have, however, had many other things not promised.

                  Sniping from the sidelines? So what are you doing then?

                • Hello

                  “…a stupid argument…”, “It’s silly” — those?

                • Mynydd

                  You must learn that the good Colonel is always right even when he is wrong.

                • Colonel Mustard

                  Go and stalk someone else for a change.

                • Colonel Mustard

                  They are ad hominem. Their position relative to the belt is immaterial.

                • allymax bruce

                  “You stop it by preventing it coming here in the first place.”
                  Correct, Colonel Mustard. I would have thought more political anoraks would have ‘cottoned-on’ to the thesis / antithesis principle. You know, if a Political Party wants to change ‘direction’, but doesn’t want to cause uproar by seeming racist, by making ‘seemingly’ racist policies, then ‘contrive’ a stooshie that pits two protagonists together. In writing genre, it’s called Dramatica Theory.
                  I back Theresa May; she’s head and shoulders above anyone in Politics; and of her very high calibre.

                • Mynydd

                  Just ask her spad about her high calibre. You must go to save me.

        • Grey Wolf

          You.

      • Kitty MLB

        Yes well they have been busy with our economy
        which was on its knees and now the fastest growing
        economy. As well as education, welfare, etc.
        This issue is one that Labour created by introducing
        extremism to our country and doing so in 13 years.
        And all this in schools that came to light would
        have not done so under a Labour government,
        and they have the audacity to point fingers.
        So yes, both excellent ministers despite their
        little dusagreement can be let off the hook.

    • Hexhamgeezer

      Agreed, Cooper is the arsonist complaining about the competence of the firecrew that turn up.

      • Grey Wolf

        Very well said.

      • Kitty MLB

        And they want us to give them back the matches
        next year.

      • Inverted Meniscus

        Well said Geezer the thought of that shrivelled little hypocrite asking questions on any subject turns my stomach.

  • dado_trunking

    Yvette Cooper is of course deeply insincere to highlight the sacking of yet another aid. She ought to be absolutely clear with regards to how she would have reacted if she was in a similar position.

    • Barakzai

      I’m sure she knows full well she’d act differently in office, but neither she nor any of Miliband’s front bench will pass up any posturing opportunity for cod moral rectitude; it’s what Labour’s always done, but most shamelessly since 1997.

    • allymax bruce

      I think Fiona ‘walked’; due to ‘intricacies’ of ‘there must be a sacrifice’. Theresa May has come out of this victorious.
      Gove has only put his ‘streetcar-of-desire’, into reverse. What’s going on with his Education brief? Nobody can work it out; the teachers hate it.

    • Mynydd

      That’s right yet another aide sacked to save a minister. When the Conservative civil war blew up Mrs May must have phone Hunt the expert in aide sacking

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