Coffee House Specdata

Ukip on course to come first in the Euro elections

27 April 2014

27 April 2014

Despite a week of rather bruising media coverage, Ukip has moved into first place for next month’s European elections. For the second time this year, Nigel Farage’s party has overtaken Labour. According to poll by YouGov for the Sunday Times, just three points currently separate Labour and Ukip — still touching the margin of error:

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Although Labour and Ukip may continue to swap places over the next few weeks, today’s poll also suggests Ukip voters are more likely to turn out on polling day. When asked from 0 to 10 the likelihood of turning out on polling day, 48 per cent said they definitely would — 34 per cent turned out in 2009 — and eight per cent said stated there was no chance at all. Breaking this down by voting intention, 51 per cent of Labour voters said they will definitely turn out, compared to 68 per cent of Ukip voters. This chart compares the likelihood of voting between the two parties:

The question of whether Ukip are a racist party continues to be asked, particularly regarding their new billboard campaign. In today’s poll, two thirds say they do not find the posters are racist — notably including over three quarters of Conservative voters — and half believe Nigel Farage is not racist, including 63 per cent of Tories. However much Farage and co paint themselves as more than disgruntled ex-Conservatives, their views remain remarkably in line with the Tories.

Yet despite Ukip’s hopes for reconfiguring the political landscape, 57 per cent believe Ukip is still a ‘protest party for people who are unhappy with the main parties, they don’t have realistic policies for running the country’, compared to just 20 per cent who believe they are a ‘serious party with workable policies’. All this indicates Ukip is set to have its best ever election next month, and very possibly come first, but will have a significant challenge to maintain their current levels of popularity after that.


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Show comments
  • Nkaplan

    This just goes to show how spectacularly misjudged the attacks on UKIP are. The media classes really have no understanding of what is going on with UKIP – i.e. the fact that its rise is a product of the very narrow terms in which debate has been held in this country for far too long. The more the media attack UKIP for saying things the media think should be unsayable the more UKIP will benefit – a vote for UKIP is for most of its supporters a vote against our whole way of doing politics and the consistent vilification of UKIP plays into the hands of those intimating that the current political and media establishment is a conspiracy against the public.

  • Bill_der_Berg

    “A candidate in the European elections has been arrested after making a speech quoting from a book by Winston Churchill about Islam”. (ITV).

    It’s high time that that old monster Churchill was dug up and charged with hate speech.

  • Bill_der_Berg

    “Despite a week of rather bruising media coverage..”?

    It could be that some voters enjoy sticking up two figures at the media. It is not as if editors and journalists are held in high regard.

  • Lady Magdalene
  • Chris Kimberley

    its a bit of a funny one, ukip will do well at the euro elections precisely because no one really cares about them (the elections)
    but when it comes to the real election they dont have a hop and still they get huge media coverage

    • Denis_Cooper

      If nobody really cares about these elections why are they even held?

      Back in the day the EEC had an “Assembly” made up of representatives in the national parliaments, so why was that changed to direct elections to a “Parliament” when nobody really cares?

      The EU Parliament itself thinks that we should care:

      http://www.europarl.europa.eu/news/en/news-room/content/20140425STO45126/html/European-elections-choose-who%E2%80%99s-in-charge

      “European elections: choose who’s in charge”

      “Many tough decisions have been taken as a result of the economic crisis in Europe these last few years and many more still need to be taken. What direction should Europe take? How should future challenges be tackled? On 22-25 May you have the chance to have your say on how Europe should be run. Watch the official EP TV spot for the upcoming elections to find out more.

      In this election you will have more power than ever before as for the first time ever the new president of the European Commission will be selected based on the results of the European elections. So your choice at the ballot box will directly affect who runs the EU’s executive body.

      More than 90 TV channels in 21 member states have already agreed to show the TV spot for free in the run up to the elections. It will be shown in all of the EU’s official 24 languages as well as in Luxembourgish, Catalan, Basque, Galician, Welsh and Turkish.”

      So what are we to make of that?

      Do you think we should tell voters in this country that these elections are about choosing who is in charge?

    • Bill_der_Berg

      Are you suggesting that EU democracy is a farce?

      • you_kid

        Are you suggesting the EU Parliament held any actual power?
        What is it now – they do, they don’t, they do, they don’t?

        • the viceroy’s gin

          …they rubber-stamp your fascist intentions, don’t they?

          • you_kid

            You know nothing about anything – read Dennis’s responses and gather your thought(s), old boy.

            • the viceroy’s gin

              …you know, maybe you should have the goat post for you, it’d make more sense.

        • Denis_Cooper

          http://www.europarl.europa.eu/aboutparliament/en/00623fe732/How-plenary-works.html

          “For many years the Parliament was simply a forum for debate, a purely consultative body. But since its election by direct universal suffrage and thanks to the active work of its members, it has been able to secure greater powers and acquire the status of equal partner in codecision with the Council in areas covering three quarters of Community legislation.”

          • you_kid

            Yes of course Dennis, I know that.
            But UKIP, once elected, are not going to that party, are they?

            • Denis_Cooper

              If you know it, why are you pretending otherwise?

              • you_kid

                If I said it no one would listen. Now it has the backing of a respected blogger.

                • Denis_Cooper

                  No one will listen to you anyway, they will see you for what you are – a timewasting pro-EU troll, either a voluntary pro-EU troll or a paid pro-EU troll.

                  Maybe it’s time to get a new identity?

                • you_kid

                  Ah bless – the point was made, by you. I merely got you to make it. It now has the backing of a respected blogger.

                  If my technique of delivering the message does not appeal then perhaps I would suggest you play no further part in it. You either believe in what is right or you don’t. If you don’t then it is YOU who is the one who is wasting time with circular self-perpetuating doctrin.

                  Someone is pro-EU? OMG! Quelle horreur!

        • Bill_der_Berg

          There is much talk of a democratic deficit within the EU, so the more power our parliament surrenders to the EU, the less democratically we are governed. No doubt the eurogroupies are pleased about this.

    • Wessex Man

      you carry on believing that.

  • Denis_Cooper

    Oh, that stupid cartoon again, with a stupid caption:

    “Nigel Farage is set to disrupt Westminster by coming first in next month’s Euro elections.”

    Exactly how would that work, then?

  • Lady Magdalene

    Breitbart has it right: “The REAL Racists: UKIP is the Only Party That Doesn’t Discriminate Against Non-Whites”

    http://www.breitbart.com/Breitbart-London/2014/04/28/Ironically-UKIP-s-immigration-policy-is-the-least-racist-of-all-four-parties

    • you_kid

      It’s all the GREENS fault.
      It’s pure totalitarian environwackoism.

      They stop us from fracking, dredging, building homes and power stations, make us recycleand eat greens that no one wants to eat and worst thing of all they make us FREEZE in winter.
      They ruined everything, yet they are not in power but I tell you it’s all the GREENS fault!

      • serialluncher

        Flippant comment. Many people can’t afford to turn on their heating. We are lucky we had a mild winter otherwise many more of the mainly elderly would have died. The high energy prices are significantly due to green politics. If the Greens ever made it to office I dread to think how many people would die – not that they’d care (population control you see).

        • you_kid

          That’s what I said.
          That is the environwacko position which the poster above linked to, and she is right about everything.

          • the viceroy’s gin

            …well, if she called you a socialist nutter, she is definitely right.

            • you_kid

              Again, old boy, you appear confused today.
              It’s da Greenies’ fault, d’oh.
              Your line. I embellish it to prove how right you are.

              • the viceroy’s gin

                …again, we need another of you socialist nutters to translate this nutter’s gibberish.

  • Lady Magdalene

    “Despite a week of rather bruising media coverage”
    Yes …. but the smear campaign hasn’t worked. The electorate knows what this is about; they understand the issues and they know that LibLabCON haven’t wanted to discuss them for decades and have closed down the debate by branding ordinary people (Mrs Duffy) racists and bigots for daring to say something which they disapprove of.
    The electorate is savvy enough to know an orchestrated smear campaign when it sees one. The MSM should be ashamed of cooperating so willingly with Lynton and chums. A free press, my ar$e: you all appear to be owned lock, stock and barrel by The British Establishment.

    • Bill_der_Berg

      Quite right. Those voters who want an EU referendum, and believe that only UKIP can deliver one, are not going to change their voting intentions because of the antics of the media.

      • Conway

        More to the point, people have woken up to Dave’s duplicity and know that his offer of a referendum is just that – an offer – and can be discarded like last night’s chip paper. The only party genuinely and consistently seeking a referendum is UKIP.

  • The Laughing Cavalier

    The shrill campaign against the kippers by the mainstream press is an illustration of the fear that the three main parties have of them.

  • Bonkim

    Regardless of poll success, UKIP’s influence in the EU Parliament will be limited. The British people by and large want to get out – and unlikely Cameron would be able to renegotiate EU treaties in any meaningful manner. The only way is out for Britain.

  • Maidmarrion

    Highly entertaining comments from those who denigrate Scots , Scotland ,the independence movement but who charge the media with vilification of Mr Farage and co , speak of the English being disrespected by Europe etc.etc. and cannot see the hypocrisy employed.
    Agrippina has the media down to a T.
    As for scraping the barrel of elderly ” tweets” Realpolitic , it’s a pity they weren’t so keen on investigating those of the Lib/Lab/Con eh?
    I’m sure they’d find plenty to chat about if it didn’t threaten their very comfortable livelihood.
    The Fourth Estate has let down Scotland and the Scots very badly DON’T let them do that to the rest of you – challenge them and continue to challenge them , they will bleat about nasty “cybernats” or whatever you get christened by those who fear your input but don’t give up .
    Change is needed in this country ,not just politically but an entire cosy cabal of the
    ” establishment”

    • Wessex Man

      What on earth has this thread got to do with the Scottish Referendum, are you so obsessed with the Scottish Referendum that you can think of nothing else to comment about?

  • the viceroy’s gin

    The real question here is this: If his simpering jackanapes can’t take any more than 20% of this vote, can Call Me Dave survive?

    • you_kid

      This is not an election of those who hold the power, it is an election of muppets. Respective PMs continue to hold that power.
      I thought you were aware of that, how could you forget?

      • Wessex Man

        Back to Playschool!

        • Denis_Cooper

          He’s obviously out of touch, or he would know that these elections are about who holds power, or as the EU Parliament puts it “choosing who’s in charge”:

          http://www.europarl.europa.eu/news/en/news-room/content/20140425STO45126/html/European-elections-choose-who%E2%80%99s-in-charge

          • Wessex Man

            If only that were true, the European Parliament is just a rubber stamping area to sign off all the unelected EU Commissioners rules, regulations, directions and Directives without a murmur, that’s why they so hate Nige when he gets up and takes the **** out of them.

            • Denis_Cooper

              You need to get up to speed with the effects of treaty changes.

              http://www.europarl.europa.eu/aboutparliament/en/00623fe732/How-plenary-works.html

              “For many years the Parliament was simply a forum for debate, a purely consultative body. But since its election by direct universal suffrage and thanks to the active work of its members, it has been able to secure greater powers and acquire the status of equal partner in codecision with the Council in areas covering three quarters of Community legislation.”

      • the viceroy’s gin

        Goodness, you socialist nutters are certainly terrified and frantic, over something that doesn’t matter.

  • serialluncher

    Of course the new posters weren’t racist. Why didn’t they ask whether any of them were xenophobic? One of them definitely is in my view.

    • Realpolitik

      Would you care to elaborate?

      • serialluncher

        Read Delingpole on the posters. I have pretty much the same view but without the blind eye.

    • Raw England

      Obviously they’re not racist. The fact its even been made a thing of shows we’ve utterly lost our nation to third world immigrants.

      But how are they xenophobic? You DO realise our capital cities, politics and media have been utterly colonised by foreigners, right? And you DO know that immigration and the EU combined cost us at LEAST £80 MILLION A DAY, right?

  • Jonathan Burns

    Lets be honest the average voter is just sick to death of the Three main political parties. Likewise if both the left wing and right wing press are after them they must be okay.
    The fact that the Spectator and Daily Mail are willing to support the CONservatives says it all.
    I want laws made by a Parliament that I can throw out every 5 year’s not unelected Euro Commissioners and judges. The Toties have been talking tough for over 20 years and what have they done NOTHING! The Labour Party are dominated by “Human Rights” lawyers or as I call the greedy left wing pigs and vultures. The LibDems just live on another planet. I want to see all three humiliated.

    • you_kid

      I don’t understand where you are coming from, this is about Europe not national politics. Are the ‘LibLabCon’ relevant in Europe?
      All our problems are the fault of the GREENS!
      They call all the shots. even though they are not in power.

      They stop us from fracking, they stopped us dredging, they sell us windmills which they don’t even benefit from, they make us recycle, they make our kids learn all this boy boy and girl girl stuff, they make us eat all this real food and block brilliant GM which would otherwise bring world peace tomorrow. But the worst thing ever must be that they make us freeze in winter – it must be all the Green’s fault because … you see … all the energy nowadays is green.

      Greens call all the shots – it’s all their fault, even though they are not in power.

      • Jonathan Burns

        Oh so it isn’t their fault it is all the Greens boo hoo! Maybe the three should grow a spine?

        • you_kid

          The viceroy’s gin will happily explain to you what went wrong with your comment there.

  • Smithersjones2013

    Oh dear responding to (fisking) poor little Seb’s posts is like correcting an eight year old’s poor first attempts at factual writing.

    Despite a week of rather bruising media coverage, Ukip has moved into first place for next month’s European elections

    If Sebby thinks that the infantile attempts at smearing by the usual urban political freaks and prejudiced celebrities “is bruisin” he clearly hasn’t been out in the real world for far too long. To say that people are immune to the hackneyed and turgid squeals of ‘racist’ from the urban liberal elite every time the elite are unable to make even the sparsist defence of their derelict, damaging and absurd attitudes to our place in the world (pretty much all of the time) is a gross understatement. Reality is that journalists and the commentariat come close behind the political class in attracting the public’s contempt. Their disingenuous and purile ravings from inside their own orifices are treated are generally treated with derision if not a healthy contempt.

    However much Farage and co paint themselves as more than disgruntled
    ex-Conservatives, their views remain remarkably in line with the Tories.

    And indeed poor Sebby needs politics lessons too. Being conservative is no longer synonymous with being a Tory. On many political issues the Tories and UKIP are in opposing camps (even if UKIP are standing by the traditional conservative outlook). In fact you cannot currently insult a true conservative more than by suggesting he or she is one of those spineless self-serving duplicitous no mans lands dwelling single cell creatures of the Tory Party.

    Yet despite Ukip’s hopes for reconfiguring the political landscape, 57
    per cent believe Ukip is still a ‘protest party for people who are
    unhappy with the main parties

    More absurd thinking from Payne. The reality of the observation in no way leads to Sebby’s ridiculous conclusion. Putting aside that UKIP have branded themselves as the alternative to the establishment parties so its little surprise people think that, that UKIP are on target to end the Tories aspirations of becoming a majority government independently in the short to medium term future (when the Tories were previously the dominant party of government in the 20th Century) for a decade or longer would seem to me to be ‘reconfiguring the political landscape’.

    That it is entirely possible that in 2015 less than 50% of those voting will vote for the three establishment parties (the first time in electoral history) effectively ending the ‘post war’ consensus would seem to be ‘reconfiguring the political landscape.

    That UKIP are the first party, almost completely independent of the three major parties and Westminster in over 100 years to be on course to poll more than 10% of the vote share at a general election seems to me to be ‘reconfiguring the political landscape’.

    That said though when all Sebby’s superficial infantile prattling and faux hand-wringing is put aside he is right. UKIP’s fortunes are looking up!

    • Richard N

      I fully expect miles more than 10% at the General Election. I would put money on 20% or more.

      • Smithersjones2013

        That’s as maybe, the point is whether Payne likes it or not the political landscape is being reconfigured and there ain’t anything he or the rest of the rump of the Tory party remaining can do about it.

        The reality is of all the parties the Tories have the most tainted and trashed brand and nobody is really taking any notice of their bleating other than their own. They are powerless which is is pretty poor state of affairs for an organisation in the business of power……

  • Richard N

    When you speak to people on the street about UKIP, and when you read comments by UKIP supporters below the liblabcon’s media articles, you see PASSION – a passionate desire to throw out the liblabcon traitors, and to get a government which is for the British people – and Britain’s interests, instead of the nest of traitors, trough-feeders, and self-seeking crooks, liars and Quislings that govern us now.

    And anyone who thinks UKIP support is going to fall away after the EU elections is in for a BIG SURPRISE.

    I expect the exact opposite: I believe that support for UKIP is going to rise and rise, all the way through to the next General Elections. And a big win at the EU elections will help give UKIP the credibility to achieve that.

    And I expect UKIP to win a very good number of seats in the crooks, liars and traitors’ assembly they call the Commons.

    What UKIP needs to do from now on is to be a lot more professional, and to use some of their money to research a comprehensive set of very convincing, fact-based and well-researched policies for this country, to make them a convincing future government.

    • Colonel Mustard

      Actually I think their amateurish approach is in the finest tradition of being British.

      • Wessex Man

        Thank you Colonel, I take that as a compliment.

      • starfish

        Indeed. If being professional is being like liblabcon then long live amateurs!

      • Realpolitik/ fruitcake/ racist

        And the British love an underdog.

    • Realpolitik

      I’ve counted 7 UKIP placards outside houses on my daily drive to the railway station, I’m yet to see a single one from liblabcon. Either they have no support, or like-minded people have ripped them from the ground and burned them on the fire to keep warm with the EU engendered obscene energy bills.

      • you_kid

        DaveEdNick want UKIP to win in Europe not only because they deliver the best comedy value whilst holding no power at all (respective PMs still do), but also because Dave master’s have already sold Scotland to Frankfurt. All we require is democratic legitimacy, it will be delivered in September as the PM will be weak as never before.

        • Realpolitik

          You’ve made as crass statement then said “because” yet the reasons you give are “comedy” and “because” of some irrelevant suggestion that Scotland has been”sold Scotland to Frankfurt”.

          You should really learn to validate your statements properly, otherwise everybody will see you as an ill-considered spouter of nonsense; which you are.

          • you_kid

            Not once have my predictions not rung true. UKIP are designed and conceived to do the dirty work abroad. That’s why they will be elected. Cameron or any other PM has no time for that.

            Bookmark this comment now and revisit it in a year’s time, stick a reminder into your outlook calendar, it’s not difficult.
            In one year’s time all will become clear to you.
            That is another prediction.

            • Realpolitik

              So you’re predicting UKIP won’t gain a majority of seats in the house of commons? And you want me to bookmark this comment?

              You do realise there’s a fair chance they won’t get a single seat in the commons next year?

              I think you’re very ignorant on politics and should steer clear of something of which you know so little.

              • you_kid

                Do I realise the UKIP will only be elected to the House of Muppets but not to the House of Commons?

                ARE YOU FOR REAL?
                Of course they won’t.
                That’s how *British* democracy works.

                And yes, Scotland was sold. Everything must go.

                • Realpolitik/ fruitcake/ racist

                  What exactly were you predicting?

                • the viceroy’s gin

                  …is the goat going too, lad?

                • you_kid

                  your ‘in’ jokes appear to attract huge crowds, keep going old boy.

                • the viceroy’s gin

                  …the goat will likely draw auction action, unlike you and the rest of the socialist nutters.

            • Wessex Man

              Is that the best you can do? is this the thoughts of Play School? Bookmark this dribble do get a life.

    • an ex-tory voter

      Amen to all of that.

  • Greenslime

    People are determined to send a message to the politicians and UKIP is the way to send it. It is blatantly clear from the newsflow that the ‘establishment’ is determined to to put UKIP down. This is evidenced by snide remarks from just about every commentator who is allowed to speak.

    I’m not a UKIP voter but I am almost tempted to vote for them just to tell the politicians, the BBC and other snide soft lefties that people who worry about uncontrolled immigration should be able to say so. That is something that anyone should be able to do without fear. If something is not true, explain the truth and debate the subject with them. Don’t smudge the figures and then start chanting racist at the person who expressed the worry.

    If 100,000 migrants come into the country, and it doesn’t matter where they come from, that is housing, jobs, schooling and healthcare that we have to find for them. This causes shortages and squeezes for everyone, everywhere. The people who suffer most are the low paid and unemployed. UKIP appears to be the only party which is prepared to stand up and say the truth.

    • Realpolitik

      For England’s sake become a UKIP voter. We are not racist, we are passionate about democracy, our heritage and our sovereignty.

  • saffrin

    LibLabCon rent a blogger jobs. (Temparary until end of May)
    http://www.w4mpjobs.org/JobDetails.aspx?jobid=45223

    • Realpolitik

      Yes brother, you couldn’t make it up brother.

      1984

  • an ex-tory voter

    The only people suggesting that the UKIP poster campaign is racist are UKIP’s political enemies and the journalists who support those enemies.

    • Realpolitik

      Change “UKIP’s” to England’s!

    • Richard N

      Well, that means pretty much all journalists. They’re all dependent on liblabcon, one way or the other – and so they will continue to spread their lies and smears against UKIP.

  • The_Missing_Think

    My intial, immediate, instant reaction was:

    “Additionally, the fact, that no-one has been arrested for inciting immigration hatred – via race hate laws – proves there has been no crime of incitement to racial hatred.”

    It got a got a few recommends, but the emotionally heated rebukes soared overhead.

    Five cooler days later, and the the same exact point is now the number one comment.

    What can we learn for the future, from this?

    That racial politics is best discussed with cold, calm, Clint-like logic, rather than force 10 emotions… perhaps?

    • Lady Magdalene

      Quite right. But the media will not print a logical argument when they have embarked on a smear campaign. It would be an admission that their trumped up stories have no basis.

  • Tom

    Three parties towing the EU line and one lone voice against,
    The media and establishment are determined to silence this dissent against the EU.
    For freedom and democracy vote UKIP.

  • an ex-tory voter

    Yet another UKIP attack line!

    “their views remain remarkably in line with the Tories” and the unspoken suggestion therefore, “why not just vote Tory”

    Complete nonsense, there is little common ground with Cameron’s Tories and less still with David Cameron himself.
    Today it is rumoured that Cameron has privately declared that even if his party takes a massive hit in the forthcoming EU elections he will not move an inch towards his eu sceptic backbenchers.

    To suggest UKIP is at all “in line” with Cameron’s Tories is to distort the truth

    • Realpolitik

      The Tories are like a fake Rolex, thick people buy them, they’re nowhere near as good as the real thing and it won’t keep the time like you were promised.

  • Chingford Man

    So then, all that mud the Speccie and the Torygraph have been throwing at UKIP – and what have you kids achieved? A 3 point lead for UKIP!

  • Kitty MLB

    Quite honestly slaves didn’t ask for their chains to be loosened
    but removed. The EU has takes our money , makes our laws,
    damages our sovereignty and we need to leave.But in the meantime we need politicians who speak for us.
    Of course UKIP will come first. What concerns me is the Pro EU
    party Labour coming second, they more then any other party
    gave away our country, and they could not even speak
    about the EU in their little EU election message…
    Why do they still get support.

    • Alexsandr

      I got their election leaflet last night. Council took it this morning with the rest of the recycling -unread. Cant see the limp dem or tory stuff getting read either.

      • Conway

        We haven’t had any literature other than UKIP’s. The leaflet was read, marked and inwardly digested – and the poster will be going in a window.

  • In2minds

    And they do say UKIP is anti HS2!

  • Richard N

    “However much Farage and co paint themselves as more than disgruntled
    ex-Conservatives, their views remain remarkably in line with the Tories.”

    Tory MPs are 99% pro-EU, while pretending – as they have for the last 40 years – to be eurosceptic. Their leader is a 100% EU puppet, who would never let Britain leave the control of his EU masters.

    UKIP is 100% eurosceptic – and their leader wants Britain to leave the EU.

    Does that sound like the two parties’ views remain remarkably in line” to you?

    • Kitty MLB

      That is not true, the majority of the Tory party are not
      pro EU. Maybe you are a little confused with Labour and
      the Lib Dems. The reason why Cameron was forced into
      This future referendum was because of his backbenchers.
      Also, UKIP but not them alone…

      • Kitty MLB

        OK, maybe it was rather a lot of UKIP and his
        own backbenchers put him on the spot.

        • Realpolitik

          The Tories are majority pro EU, the ones who aren’t are seen as “extremist”. Bernard Jenkin is a family friend.

          • Kitty MLB

            Well if true the little deluded toads will soon
            learn the error of their ways. There are an awful
            lot of ‘ extremists’ then.A friend of Bernard Jenkins are you. Send him my regards,
            a nice chap.

            • Realpolitik

              Jenkin has been the spearhead of the anti-EU movement in the Tories and has a lot of supporters, but they are certainly a minority.

              It is however, true that almost all want change, but most are too weak to be outspoken enough to commit to anything which might be considered not to be “towing the line”. Behind closed doors I’d say the majority want out, but to come out of the closet and admit it publicly is another thing all together.

              If we had some senior Tories such as Jenkin in UKIP the Tories would be a fringe party before the ink’s dried.

              I went to the same school as his son and we’ve lived in his constituency for many years.

              • Kitty MLB

                ‘ The Tories would be a fringe party’
                Are you speaking of the party of Thatcher, the party with a legitimate political message, with experienced and capable
                ministers on the backbenches who despite everything work hard for their electorate. The people who believe there party
                is bigger then its current leader who will be gone at some point.
                Or are you speaking of the Camservative Party- there is a difference. Also Nigel Farage is after the working class old-
                Labour voter, those without a party and they will not appreciate
                ex Tory MP’s- its not possible to please everyone and Conservative voters as well as Labour voters are very different,
                despite their leadership.

                • Wessex Man

                  Kitty, I hate to disagree with you but UKip is now recruiting members from Labour as well as the Tories and Lib/Dums!

                  Come join us!

            • Raddiy

              KItty,

              You only have to look at their voting record on EU matters, with the honourable exception of Peter Bone, Philip Hollobone and a few others, the average Conservative MP has voted far more often for pro EU legislation than the average Labour MP.

              http://www.brugesgroup.com/mpwatch/index.live

              What of course they are doing is voting according to the whipping, which in a sense makes it far worse, because despite their claims that they understand our concerns, when push comes to shove they always put party before country.
              Perhaps this was best illustrated by the fake eurosceptic-in-chief Bill Cash campaigning against Maastrict like a rat in a sack, but when it came to the vote he meekly accepted the party line and voted for Maastricht, hence the demolition of him by NIgel Farage at the fringe debate at last years Conservative conference If you haven’t seeni it, here is.the link, the whole debate is interesting, but the fireworks start from about 1 hour in.
              http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4sAGgZPolIY

              • Conway

                My “EU sceptic” MP has voted against affirming the sovereignty of Parliament, against reducing the EU budget, against giving us a referendum (in 2011) and for increasing EU payments. Actions speak louder than words.

      • saffrin

        If the majority of the Tory party weren’t pro-EU they wouldn’t have picked Cameron as leader.
        LibLabCon branding is here to stay.
        They are All in it Together as Call me Dave says.

      • Richard N

        Difficult to believe that people are still suckered by the Tories’ 40 years of lying that they are the ‘eurosceptic party’.

        In reality, there are almost no eurosceptic Tory MPs at all. But there are still quite a lot of the pretend eurosceptics amongst them. And it is thanks to those fake-eurosceptics that the Tories have been able to get eurosceptic votes all these decades, despite in reality being just as much EU puppets and Quislings as the other two liblabcon EU puppet parties.

        And people still believe that the Tory party is eurosceptic!

        Incredible!

        Even though Tory MPs voted unanimously last year against an EU referendum to be this year?!

        Even though the Tory party has signed every EU Treaty put in front of them for 40 years?!

        There is absolutely NOTHING eurosceptic about the Parliamentary Tory party.

        Their job, for 40 years or more, has been to pretend to be eurosceptic, to get the eurosceptic votes – and to betray their supporters at the back door by signing every EU treaty, and by electing pro-EU leaders (puppets of the EU) every time.

        THEY ARE TRAITORS – JUST LIKE LABOUR, AND THE LIB-DEMS.

        • Realpolitik

          Although there are some very fine men and brilliant leaders within that party, it is the mostly bad apples that ruined the barrel.

      • Conway

        If the majority of the Tory Party (in Westminster) aren’t pro-EU, why do they vote en masse for more EU?

  • Realpolitik

    Vote UKIP on the basis that your vote cancels out Telemarxist’s vote!

    If that odious little creep won’t encourage you to vote in opposition; I don’t know what will.

  • Raddiy

    ” All this indicates Ukip is set to have its best ever election next
    month, and very possibly come first, but will have a significant
    challenge to maintain their current levels of popularity after that.”

    Sebastian,

    I wish I had a fiver for every journalist who has trawled out this old chesnut over the years, yet you never admit you were wrong when events contradict your crystal ball gazing.

    There are only two defining things you need to remember.

    1. We don’t play your game, we don’t care what you think, we don’t care what you think might happen, or what you think might happen that will burst the bubble of UKIP, we really don’t care what the collective MSM think or do at all,. You are just our useful idiots whose role is to run our weekly informal membership recruitment campaigns free of charge.

    2. We are resilient, dogged, bloody minded and on a mission, and we will pound away at the establishment until they surrender, or we grind them into the dirt. Time is on our side, we are going nowhere, we have now reached a critical mass, however the future turns out, be in no doubt it will have a purple glow to it.

    • Agrippina

      Because unlike the media, we can see the effects of uncontrolled immigration all around us.

      • saffrin

        Because unlike the media, we are not paid to turn a blind eye either.

        • Agrippina

          Amusing to watch them trying to turn the voters towards their masters and struggling, because all the arguments deployed to date have failed to dent UKIP momentum.

        • Raw England

          The far-Left/foreign London-dominated media should be mindful that they’re very close to Nuremberg territory in that the native people, when they snap, will demand accountability for their vicious betrayals.

          • saffrin

            We live in hope.

            • Raw England

              Ah, such a weary, battle-worn tone my friend :)

          • Kitty MLB

            What are native people, we have been a mixture
            of all sorts for centuries. You may need to
            Go back to our friendly cavemen to find a
            native.

            • saffrin

              You’ll be supporting gay marriage next?

              • Kitty MLB

                Yes I do support gay marriage. Good God,
                and I a Catholic, as well as right wing Tory.
                Clearly I should be burned at the stake
                for being a heretic…

                • Wessex Man

                  I still love you Kitty!

                • Kitty MLB

                  And so does Ally despite me being English, but there is a condition linking me and Alex Salmond. Oh and I am glad
                  you still do, I would be devastated otherwise 😉

                • Wessex Man

                  Not of the sordid sort I take it?

                • Kitty MLB

                  No certainly not. Different souls bumping in to each other
                  during this brief moment in time we all share.

                • Kitty MLB

                  Oh sorry I misread you, I thought you were speaking of Ally.
                  Oh no, all very respectable and above board with Alex Salmond but he needs to play ball.

                • saffrin

                  Yes you should, along with all the other disassembles.

                • Kitty MLB

                  But then I shall rise like a phoenix from the flames.
                  What do you suppose God has a main issue with those
                  same gender people who with to marry, quietly get on with their lives not hurting anyone. Or those who marry and abuse
                  their wives and children. Also those extremists who blow people up hiding beneath the shroud of God.

                • saffrin

                  God has nothing to do with it.
                  You are just twisted.

                • Kitty MLB

                  If God has nothing to do with it, then why get married,
                  and why have issues with it ?

                • saffrin

                  I don’t have issues with it, you do.
                  Why would you support child adoption to such perverts?
                  Why do these perverts insist they are normal yet need to subvert the minds of children as young as six years old?
                  If their perversion were normal, surely these six year old children would turn into perverts in their own time.

            • Tom

              I guess when we use that term”native” we mean people who have been here for centuries.
              We have been invaded a few times in the past but the last time was 1066.

              • MichtyMe

                Whatabout 1688 ? The Dutch invaded and put a cloggie on the throne.

                • Colonel Mustard

                  We are still the English and have been since 1027. It is a self identity not for others to determine.

                  Those who are English know who they are and who is not.

                • MichtyMe

                  I was doubting the no invasion since 1066. Five hundred ships and 40,000 men seems like an invasion.

                • Realpolitik

                  1027 or 1066. It makes no odds, that’s one generation, you’re spiting hairs.

                • Wessex Man

                  He is correct colonel but it depends on whether you consider William’s arrival as divine intervention or invasion.

                • Raw England

                  ↑ This ↑

                • Realpolitik

                  So by that same notion why not say we’re all German? Do you really think the heritage of our royal family has any bearing on our identity?

                • Michele Keighley

                  He was invited; as the husband of the heir to the throne he was invited to become joint rule with Mary – It was hardly an invasion and he certainly had no influence on the English who kept him rather quiet all things considered.

                • Fergus Pickering

                  No they did not. The English booted out the Scotch King. William ruled with his daughter, Mary. Got it?

                • Lungfish66

                  I’d rather have a cloggie than a Cleggie.

                • Tom

                  William of Orange AND HIS ENGLISH WIFE were INVITED to take the English crown.
                  Not unlike the british government of today are inviting the EU to take over the country.

                • Conway

                  Were they not invited in 1688? That is hardly an invasion, is it?

              • Shorne

                Farage’s father was called Guy Justus Oscar Farage. He was descended from Georgius Ferauge, who lived in the Ardennes, which is less than hour’s drive from Brussels where Ed Miliband’s father was was born.

            • Michele Keighley

              How long does it take for inhabitants to become native?

              We allow Germany’s and Italy’s inhabitants to claim native status in nations that did not exist until quite recently, but you deny the English that right!

              England was recognised in the 8th century as a nation – the Norman invasion did not turn the country French, it turned the French English. We adopted and adapted as we always do and we still exist. Waves of immigrants were welcomed and indeed absorbed becoming English in their turn.

              It took a self-hatred of outstanding proportions to inflict upon the nation of England [for England has been the main focus of this policy] the level of immigration which cannot be absorbed. And it was done willfully, knowingly and deliberately – and they question our right to claim to be English. Tosh Kitty, utter balderdash and tosh!!!

          • The_Missing_Think

            This why I’m trying to get people to grasp the incredible ramifications of these six words from Tony, Gordon, Harriet, The Eds, Evette, Nick, Danny, Vince, Lyn, Ming, David, George, Theresa, Grant, + all other MPs, and the Lords:
            _____

            “This can be black or white”

            http://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2010/15/notes/division/3/2/1/6/3

            Section 9. Explanatory notes. (2010 Equalities Act).
            _____

            Focus calmly people, ignore the messenger… study deeply, what do you see?

            A tacit apology… a tiny, buried, 180º u-turn… perhaps?

    • Tom

      Brilliant Raddy.

    • the viceroy’s gin

      “…we really don’t care what the collective MSM think or do at all,. You
      are just our useful idiots whose role is to run our weekly informal
      membership recruitment campaigns free of charge.”

      .

      Absolutely brilliant.

      And over time, this particular Speccie teenager has been a most useful idiot.

      • Lady Magdalene

        But not quite as effective as the Tory and Labour scribblers over at the DT, Brogan, Martin, Hodges, Archer.

  • starfish

    “57 per cent believe Ukip is still a ‘protest party for people who are unhappy with the main parties, they don’t have realistic policies for running the country’, compared to just 20 per cent who believe they are a ‘serious party with workable policies’. ”
    Yes, but does anyone believe the mainstream parties have ‘workable policies’ – did you ask that question?

    • Raw England

      Remember: In regards to native English people, UKIP is supported by a majority.

      Plus, 70% of the public (80% if you exclude immigrants) demand a total end to all immigration, and for actual British people to be put first.

      The people want radical, dramatic action taken.

    • Blindsideflanker

      Indeed, Cameron and Osborne were still saying they would ‘share the proceeds of growth’, when the economy had disappeared down the sewer.

      And as for Cameron claiming he can renegotiate the EU treaties , well whose living in Lala land?

      • Agrippina

        Dave the boy who told us pre 2010, he would control immigration to the tens of thousands. Either he was lying then, or he did not know that EU immigrants cannot be stopped!

        • Blindsideflanker

          Very true, was it Grant Shapps last Friday on Any Question who claimed that they can’t be said to be not fulfilling their promise to cut immigration down to the tens of thousands because they still have a year to go to achieve it?

          Who does he think he is kidding if after 4 years they have cut immigration by 30k , but in the final year of their Government they are going to cut four times that.

          • Agrippina

            You are right, they mostly delude themselves. We had more than 532,000 migrate here to Sept 2013 up again on the previous quarter!

          • Hexhamgeezer

            Exactly – He’s a Liar Liar Liar, Liar Liar Liar Liar.

            Did I mention he’s a fking Liar? Liar Liar Liar.

            Shapps, you know what you are? A Grade A, died in the wool Liar.

  • starfish

    So are you beginning to concede what has been obvious for months, albeit with just a little uncertainty for the unknowable future?
    Is this what passes for political analysis these days?

  • Agrippina

    Hopefully the EU will be shaken to the core, as all across the EU, parties that no longer wish to be in the EU, are elected and the apparatus can be dismantled from within.

    Vote UKIP for freedom.

    • swatnan

      Vote PIKU to step back into the past.

      • Tim Reed

        Into the past…when immigration was sensibly controlled (in the region of tens of thousands per year), and we as a nation had barely any concept of Islamism – before Blair and his New Labourites opened the flood gates and then decided it would be a good idea to stir that particular hornets nest at the expense of our military and general public at large?

        …yes please.

      • Tom

        It is you who is living in the past,the EU was formed after the war and is now way past its sell by date.
        Like anything no longer useful it should be binned.

      • Realpolitik

        How so? What bad things can possibly come of leaving. Give ONE example of how we’d be disadvantaged in leaving.

        Just ONE.

        • Des Demona

          Take your pick

          1. Free trade

          As part of the single market, the EU has free trade between all its member states. This is great for UK businesses, who don’t have to worry about quotas or import taxes. As such, almost 50% of our exports go to the EU. (The EU also has an iron tariff wall against non-members, which we don’t want to be on the wrong side of.)

          2. The EU encourages investment in Britain

          The EU has attracted millions of pounds in foreign investment. Large manufacturers and commercial service providers invest in the UK because it is a bridge to the single market. If the UK walked away, it would become a bridge to nowhere. If you’re a multinational company, with a choice between building a factory in cast-adrift Britain or single-market France, the right business decision is obvious.

          3. Influence within Europe

          If we want the EU to work in Britain’s interests, then we need to be involved in EU decision-making. France and Germany will have no incentive to listen to Britain if we’re not playing on the same team. If Britain leaves the EU, there will be no one to stand up for British interests when decisions are made that affect us, such as changes to trade or investment laws.

          4. Influence outside Europe

          Strength in numbers is more than just a saying. At the global negotiating table, the UK could be an insignificant little country with an insignificant loner economy. Or, it could be the leading partner in the biggest combined economy in the world (with a GDP of just under €17 trillion). Which is the more influential position to be in? If the UK is competing in the ‘global race’, as David Cameron claims, then we’re better off on the relay team.

          5. Immigration- good for Britain

          Immigration generally has been very good for Britain, and we shouldn’t be afraid to say it. The EU’s immigration policy makes it easier for tourists to come and spend money, and it makes it easier to attract highly skilled workers like doctors or engineers when we suffer from skill shortages.

          6. Emigration- good for the British

          The other side of the immigration coin is emigration: British people are free to live, work and go on holiday wherever they want in the EU, without having to get an expensive visa or go through time-consuming bureaucracy.

          7. Market fairness.

          Through its extensive competition law, the EU ensures that capitalism actually works. For example, when a government department contracts out a service, it has to ‘put it to tender’ i.e. ensure that several companies bid competitively for the contract. The contract can’t simply be handed over to the company that took the Minister out for a nice dinner; and that’s because of EU competition law.

          8. The EU safeguards workers’ rights.

          This might just be the most important reason to stay in the EU. Four weeks paid holiday a year, the 48 hour working week, anti-discrimination law, guaranteed rights for agency workers, guaranteed worker consultation- all of these protections exist because of the EU. .

          • Wessex Man

            oh dear Demona!

            • Des Demona

              Always seems to me the ukippers here have a great deal of xenophobic rhetoric and name calling but not a lot of facts. Well, apart from the ‘facts’ they make up of course and disturbingly actually seem to believe.

              • the viceroy’s gin

                You’re making assertions, lad. Don’t debase the language by calling them “facts”.

                • Des Demona

                  Looking through your posts you wouldn’t know a fact if it jumped out of your soup, sonny boy.

                • the viceroy’s gin

                  Those bereft of argument often repeat what the opposition has just said. You socialists are particularly prone to this, as you demonstrate .

                • Realpolitik/ fruitcake/ racist

                  Now that I know that, to you, England means nothing, you’ve told me all I need to know.

                  We’re not trying to persuade you. Do you think we care whether you agree with us? No. we’re telling you why we disagree with you. That I do care about.

                  I have no further interest in any of your opinions. There’s nothing you wouldn’t make an excuse for.

          • Realpolitik/ fruitcake/ racist

            Just quickly then.

            1. We would still be able to trade with the EU if we left, they can’t afford not to.

            2. We would be a bridge to all our additional trading nations as well as the EU, negotiating better terms.

            3. They don’t listen to us currently. If they did we wouldn’t be having this conversation.

            4. As said, if Iceland can negotiate a trade deal with China; as can we.

            5. Mass Immigration is bad for the people of Britain. Being outside of the EU we gain control of our borders. Immigration is not good for the people of Britain. EU membership makes no difference to tourism, that’s laughable, perhaps healthcare tourists. At least we’d be an individual country retaining our own culture, I’m sure when tourists come to see England they want to see ENGLAND. We are not opposed to good and NEEDED immigration.

            6. of the 1.6 million jobs advertised in the EU THIS MONTH 900,000 were British, they do far better out of us than we do from them.

            7. “the EU ensures that capitalism actually works” HAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAAHA Please warn me when you next decide to make a Lenny Bruce gag. Fine, we retain this law, it’s not worth 57 million a day that we could be spending on training our own vast unemployed labour-force.

            8. Again entrench these laws into our system of laws. no worth 57 million a day.

            See above.

            So basically you are against training our own unemployed (youth unemployment just doubled) You are against providing higher wages for the less desirable jobs which would be beneficial to the UK as not only would these people not be taking from the system they’d be paying into it. You don’t believe in the strength of your nation on a world stage without hiding behind Europe. And you think that it’s worth paying 57 million a day for a few laws, and paying the price of handing your sovereignty over to the EU.

            Public school normally fixes defective snivelling little girls like you. Start believing in this country again. Thatcher said how when she left politics she’d open up a spine shop, perhaps you should have visited/

            • Des Demona

              Are you sure you’re not a secret anti-ukip mole? Your gross distortions, lack of economic logic and downright nastiness would play right into the hands of those who believe you are a bunch of racist nutters.

              • Realpolitik/ fruitcake/ racist

                I studied economics at Oxford, give one example of where it is lacking. I have no reason to be polite to you, you’re an enemy of reason and rational thought.

                Your arguments are pathetic, this is just the pros of the EU, they’re laughable even without the negatives of the EU.

                https://scontent-a-lhr.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-frc3/t1.0-9/10301537_853286564686429_7034090809159182965_n.jpg

                • Des Demona

                  Yeah and my dad’s the pope. Let’s have a look at your ”economics”
                  You lie about the fact that the UK pays 16.7 billion into the CAP.
                  You lie about the fact that the EU budget loses 132 billion a year through their corruption.
                  You believe most EU immigrants are poor and live in squalid conditions.
                  You claim without any evidence that on it’s own the UK would be able to negotiate better trade deals with the rest of the world (laughably citing the fact that Iceland was able to negotiate a trade deal with China, as has pretty much every country in the world,but having no evidence whatsoever it was a better deal than the EU negotiated and is currently negotiating with the US)
                  Your only policies seem to be ‘I don’t like foreigners and I don’t like the EU” How is that an economic argument?

                • Realpolitik/ fruitcake/ racist

                  This was all discussed previously, you’ve lost this argument so have gone back to one from 3 days ago!

                  I didn’t lie about that, I provided my source, but you wanted me to provide a source that agreed with you.

                  Here’s that source for any 3rd party

                  http://www.google.co.uk/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=2&ved=0CDkQFjAB&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.ukipmeps.org%2Fuploads%2Ffile%2FCost_of_the_EU_25_5_11.pdf&ei=REleU8kHzt49u7KA-A8&usg=AFQjCNEiwqLRNh49xlJo-Q9WXlOUsOxqZw&sig2=01T0S7CKvzlnv3v-m7a58w&bvm=bv.65397613,d.ZWU

                  It’s 162 billion a year, this isn’t a lie this is THEIR own figure!

                  here’s the source, just google it there are plenty of others:

                  http://time.com/3554/report-corruption-costs-e-u-over-162-billion-a-year/

                  It’s pretty well known that the majority of them are impoverished, hence coming all of the way here to find work, lots of them do live in what we would regard as squalid conditions of shared accommodation….. for 3rd parties, he was suggesting they were wealthy and had money to spend in order to buy homes, All I was saying was the majority don’t, but out of context it does look as though I was picking on them…… but this is the only way he can win the argument.

                  I don;t know what the negotiations are as they are still “currently negotiating” What do you want from me? To go into the future and compare the outcome of these negotiations with those of China and Iceland?

                  I do like foreigners, my girlfriend happens to be French. You’re right, I don’t like the EU at all. But I LOVE Europe. I love everything about it. Just not the EU. The EU is not a race.

                  That isn’t an economic argument, but that is not an example of my arguments. That is a straw man argument made by you, because YOU are the one without economic/rational/ logical arguments.

                  Did you take the job in the end?

                  http://www.w4mpjobs.org/JobDetails.aspx?jobid=45223

                  I can tell you work for the government, from your lack of passion and general hatred of your country, democracy, free though, free speech, heritage, etc Take the occupation from your head, grow a spine and start believing in this country!!!! We can do great things, we don’t need the EU ruling over us costing us billions deciding our laws.

                • Des Demona

                  You are beyond parody. Is your girlfriend poor and living in squalor?
                  How are made up figures by UKIP independent? You stated we pay 16.7 billion a year into the CAP, that is a lie.
                  As for corruption, this was a report by the EU on corruption in it’s member states, nothing to do with EU governance or budget. Btw some of the major companies who have been fined or are under investigation for corruption are British, like BAE and Glaxo. So your point is?

                • Realpolitik/ fruitcake/ racist

                  No, she lives with me, but otherwise would be part of the minority who can afford to rent/ buy their own home without needing to share it.

                  The problem is, you had to say that they weren’t receiving housing benefit, so then suggested they could afford their own place, but we know the places they can afford are generally shared and squalid, shed in gardens springs to mind.

                  How are your figures independent? Your CAP figure is a lie! You’re extremely petulant.

                  The EU has created a huge amount of corruption as so much power is in the hands of so few. You accused me of lying, now you’re getting into semantics, the EU is a corrupt organisation. The EU governance is VAST everything goes through them.

                • Des Demona

                  If you think that ”EU immigrant” and shed in garden are in any way indicative of the real situation then frankly you are delusional.

                • Realpolitik/ fruitcake/ racist

                  http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2362393/Inside-migrant-Shed-City-Immigrants-living-cramped-illegally-built-garden-sheds.html

                  What is a real situation, all joining hands from the west country to Albania singing coombia?

                  Are you not at all concerned about our huge unemployment statistics in britain? And the mass unemployment across Europe? the fact that 2/3rds of the jobs advertised in the EU are British jobs? Why are you so against helping our own people to get those jobs? ANd don’t tell me its better for the economy to keep those people on benefits we both know that’s a lie, How about some answers? You ran away from these questions last time.

                  Let’s see if you’ve grown a spine since then!

                • Des Demona

                  You debate like a 12 year old. But then again that’s not surprising.
                  We have some of the lowest unemployment stats in Europe which rather flies in the face that all these immigrants are taking our jobs. Even before any free movement in Europe we still had millions unemployed. You have shown no correlation between immigration and unemployment. The fact that most immigrants are better educated than our workforce – 32% having degrees against our average of 21% – means they are largely not competing in the same job market.
                  You harp on about the amount of UK jobs advertised on a website as if it was indicative of the true situation – that same website says there are 3000 jobs available in Spain or something like that. Do you really think their are only 3000 jobs in the whole of Spain?
                  Your xenophobic attitude to EU immigrants. believing most of them are poor or living in garden sheds is stupidity beyond belief. And then you go on to say that they are not as much of a problem as those from outside the EU. You give away your racist credentials.

                • Realpolitik/ fruitcake/ racist

                  It’s true, I’m not taking much time over my replies, I can’t really be bothered with it.

                  I can’t be angry with you, you’re just wrong.
                  10 countries in the EU have lower unemployment than us, this is substantial considering our GDP compared to theirs.

                  How are immigrants not taking our jobs? As said before, this is a scientific certainty, we have such a great deal of promising youngsters who just need a break, every job that goes to a cheap immigrant is one that our young should be getting.

                  our unemployment was much lower before 2004, but this you will argue was due to the recession, so I can’t argue with you rationally on this point, so by challenging me to argue this is an underhand tactic.

                  Those education statistics are more in my favour than yours. Why are you against training our unemployed and providing incentives to get them to work without mass competition for jobs that drives down wages?

                  i’m not xenophobic at all, I care about my own people and can see my country slipping away like a free for all buffet for Europe. I think it’s treasonous that a government who is meant to represent our interests is putting Europeans before our people.

                  if that makes me xenophobic ( phobia= irrational fear) then so be it, I am not alone in my feelings.

                  “3000 or something like that” Oh do be quiet, of the 1.6 million jobs advertised in the EU this month 900,000 were in britatin. “The free for all buffett open to 29 million unemployed people” Why not put our own people first? Get our house in order?

                • Des Demona

                  Oh for goodness sake – the unemployment figures peaked in 1993 and came steadily down until 2009 and the crash.

                • the viceroy’s gin

                  …per capita income has come down steadily as well, lad. It still is.

                • Des Demona

                  And according to you that is due to migration and not the world recession and destructive Tory policies, sonny boy?

                • the viceroy’s gin

                  Doesn’t matter what it’s due to, laddie, but per capita income is declining steadily, even as you’re proclaiming the wonders of mass, unfettered immigration.

                  Try again, lad.

                • Des Demona

                  ”Doesn’t matter what it’s due to”
                  Oh ok, so what is your point then sonny boy?

                • the viceroy’s gin

                  But we’re discussing your point, lad. You screech for the wonders of the EUSSR and mass immigration, claiming that unemployment is “falling” as a result of these.

                  But so is per capita income falling, all along your splendid EUSSR/immigration path, meaning whatever value you are joyfully celebrating re “unemployment” is a vapor.

                  Try again.

                • Des Demona

                  I’m afraid your comprehension skills are sadly lacking. Per capita income in the UK grew hugely until 2009 and the global recession. As far as I’m aware immigration was taking place on a much larger scale before then.
                  Can you show an actual causation/correlation between immigration and unemployment/per capita income or are you just twatting around as usual, sonny boy?

                • the viceroy’s gin

                  Per capita is falling, lad. You seem quite ignorant of the data. Your claim is that unemployment is falling as well, but it should, as income is falling.

                  The net? The net is what socialist stupidity always provides, which is why you’re shrieking in favor of it.

                  Try again.

                • Des Demona

                  Ahhh twatting around, ok.

                • the viceroy’s gin

                  …you socialist nutters are, yes.

                • Realpolitik/ fruitcake/ racist

                  But who’s to say the unemployment figures wouldn’t have been lower were it not for the opening of the flood gates in 2004?

                  When have I said “stole our jobs”? You make it sound like I blame immigrants. I don’t I understand their plight, I blame the government for working on behalf of big business by oversupplying our labour-market in order to drive down wages. I don’t blame immigrants at all, I’d do the same.

                  Your argument rests on the assumption that all of the immigrants happen to find jobs that have no competition from the British people, this is such a lie, there are plenty of people on benefits who want to work but are turned down because of the huge amount of competition, a lot of them don’t even see the point as the oversupply of our labour-force has driven down wages.

                  In the old days if nobody applied for a job you increased the salary to attract interest, these days they will get hundreds of applicants for minimum wage jobs. there are too many people from impoverished countries undercutting out own people and providing too much competition. our own don’t stand a chance of ever affording the luxuries you and I take for granted.

                  I don’t care what you believe, if you buy the kind of sales patter the EU spiel out I don’t want you believing me. You appear mentally unhinged and unsure of reality. Do you fancy a game of find the lady?

                • Des Demona

                  You start off with ”but who’s to say” and then state my ‘arguments are based on assumptions”
                  Priceless.

                • Realpolitik/ fruitcake/ racist

                  I’m pointing out that your arguments ARE based on assumptions, this is not being hypocritical, I’m proving that point with an opposite assumption which is of equal merit.

                  That’s right run away the second you can see I have the time to debate with you.

                • Des Demona

                  I would not suggest that no immigrant has ever taken a job that could have been done by a British person. Similarly I’d never argue that no British person working abroad has ever taken a job that might have been done by a local person.
                  But as I’ve pointed out before, if you could move away from your ‘they’re mostly all poor and live in sheds” mentality, and look at the figures showing the economic benefits of immigration, especially from the EU – you would see that it actually creates jobs. That is the macro economic effect, not the reduction to ‘I could have got that job in Tesco if it wasn’t for that guy’ mentality.
                  Our unemployment rate is falling – if you can believe any unemployment statistics – net immigration is not falling significantly, so there would appear to be no significant correlation between immigration and unemployment.

                • Realpolitik/ fruitcake/ racist

                  I’m glad you admit that it does happen. But you refuse to admit that every job on offer that an immigrant gets could have been taken by one of our unemployed people had they the incentive and training.

                  I don’t see what bearing my perception of impoverished immigrants has on the economic benefits of immigration. I accept they have economic benefits, I’ve never denied that they help the big business achieve their profits and our EU state/country increase its GDP.

                  I have never denied this. I am arguing for the man on the street who can’t find work, for our young who will never afford a home due to the driving down of wages that an oversupply of labour causes. I’m arguing that the fabric of our culture is being destroyed. I’m arguing that immigration could be better managed to work in symbiotic relationship with our own people and not against them. I want my elections to mean something, I want a choice and a voice, I want to retain our standards of living, i want higher wages for our poorest, I want to use the 57 million we send to the EU a day to go towards training our young so they have a future which they currently don’t stand a chance in. And much much more, you are an enemy of the poor. And you’re yet to explain why.

                  You are assuming that the falling unemployment has a direct correlation to immigration. Where’s your evidence for this?

                • Des Demona

                  I agree with your wish list. Where I don’t agree is that the blame is laid at the door of immigration. I’d put it down to the shocking ineptitude of successive governments who appeared quite happy to have a virtual ;;underclass” of the long term unemployed and unemployable.
                  The apprentice scheme is a start, but very little and very late.

                • Realpolitik/ fruitcake/ racist

                  The blame is very much laid at the door of MASS immigration. You seem like a good intentioned person, but sometimes it’s like talking to someone from North Korea. I think you must realise that we let too many immigrants in and are being raped by the EU.

                  The establishment need an underclass, they also need the underclass to feel like victims; this is necessary for their end goal, and it’s working tremendously.

                  The housing shortage arrived around the time labour decided to open the floodgates in 2004, this is when the housing waiting lists doubled and house prices tripled. Labour didn’t build enough homes to accommodate the increase in our population.

                  You really need to lift the occupation from your mind. Immigration is good. But not the kind of immigration that hurts our people. You seem to defend our current immigration level as though immigration is great and if someone doesn’t agree it’s because they’re a racist. This is not true, you will constantly rely on more and more immigrants with your approach. And there won’t be a shortage when the Euro collapses, I hope you are retired, as if you’re not keep looking over your shoulder for the Albanian wizz-kid who’s going to do your job for half the price and a cherry on top, then you can start feeling how our poorest do.

                  I used to pick fields when I was in my teens, last summer I suggested it to my son to earn some pocket money, he was told by the farmer “sorry we only hire Polish workers”

                  Welcome to the reality of the fairytale you speak of.

                • Des Demona

                  I’m afraid that though I recognise your passion for your cause both your arguments and political leanings leave me cold.
                  Do you not recognise that accusing someone of being like a North Korean when they don’t happen to agree with you actually makes you sound like the North Korean? Do you not recognise that you talk of the establishment needing an underclass when at the same time you call most EU immigrants poor and living in squalid conditions?
                  No,- emotive calls for ”patriotism” and chip shop anecdotes are indeed the last refuge of the scoundrel as far as I’m concerned.

                • Realpolitik/ fruitcake/ racist

                  UNLIMITED IMMIGRATION COSTS BRITISH JOBS, 900,000 OF THE 1.6 MILLION ADVERTISED IN THE EU THIS MONTH WERE BRITISH JOBS.

                  CHEAP LABOUR PUSHES DOWN WAGES, THIS HITS OUR POOREST AND YOUNGEST HARDEST.

                  Most liberals can genuinely agree with me that GOOD immigration that works with our people not against them is a GOOD thing, I must say you’re the first person I’ve ever met to support MASS immigration; and do it so proudly.

                  You sound like a North Korean because you have been so brainwashed by the establishment run by big business that you believe MASS immigration is a good thing.

                  The establishment do need an underclass for many reasons I could go into, but seen as you’re not contesting that I won’t provide them. The majority of EU immigrants that come here to work are poor, a lot aren’t but the MAJORITY are. DO you understand that I have always consistently said the MAJORITY not ALL immigrants? DO you get that?

                  I don’t see how these are at all contradictory statements. You cannot help the poor by flooding the country with immigrants forcing down wages, it’s such basic economics it makes me weep for your ignorance….. And that just effects the Brits who can get a job with all of the competition.

                  Get a spine and start believing in this country and its people.

                • Des Demona

                  Your caps lock appears to be stuck.
                  The best performing and most productive economy in Europe for decades? Germany.
                  The country with the highest EU immigration? Germany.
                  RIP Ukip.

                • Realpolitik/ fruitcake/ racist

                  It’s not stuck, it’s my attempt of getting through your thick skull. I take it you’re not English then? “Qui tacet consentire”: “Silence gives consent”.

                  Desdemona slept with Othello……..

                  Germany has a great industry, lots of jobs.

                  WE DON’T

                  Awe bless, you’re clearly a brainwashed state-schooled drone/immigrant who has found himself reading a journal he’s unaccustomed to and to be wanting on economics, politics and his love of England.

                • Realpolitik/ fruitcake/ racist

                  Also, EU immigrants aren’t as much of a problem as the majority who come from outside the EU

                  But the problem is we have no power to control either. Where do you draw the line? Why don’t you invite the entire world to live in Britain?

                • Des Demona

                  Correct, the majority do come from outside the EU. And that is why we have border controls for non EU would be immigrants. Once again you are wrong.

      • Colonel Mustard

        Ah, that old chestnut. Works on those who cannot remember the past and who have had the past revised by people just like you.

        • swatnan

          To most anyway, the past is a foreign country.
          Teflon Nige is unfortunately streaking ahead in the Cheekie Chappie Stakes, with a pint in his hand as always.

          • Colonel Mustard

            To many it is the present which is a foreign country, thanks to politicians who have sold it out from under us.

          • Wessex Man

            and what’s wrong with that? I had several pints in my hand over Friday night till I fell over!

    • Richard N

      I’m afraid they won’t be too bothered.

      They’ll be congratulating themselves on having designed the EU so that the unelected EU Commission can carry on their conspiracy, no matter what happens in the EU Parliament.

      The main effect of a big success for anti-EU parties will be in the national politics of the EU member countries – where the pro-EU parties will be forced to take more eurosceptic positions.

  • Raw England

    Beautiful to watch the foreign, cancerous, putrid political and media class of London panicking and collapsing as the native British majority finally begin to fight back.

    We now must correct the political spectrum: UKIP are the new party of the natural British Centre; Labour are far-Left/foreign, Lib Dems are far-Left and the Tory party is…..Well, I don’t know what the fuck the Tory party is.

    The battle now is THUS: The people versus the cancerous city of London, and the far-Left ruling elite.

  • Realpolitik

    The EU can’t afford to stop trading with us- their largest export market in the world. It’s laughable that even countries like Iceland can negotiate trade deals with China and they only have a population of 300,000; yet we are told we don’t have the influence.

    As for the 3 million jobs:

    https://scontent-a-lhr.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-frc3/t1.0-9/10301537_853286564686429_7034090809159182965_n.jpg

    Vote for UKIP. Every UKIP vote cancels out a lib/lab/con vote.

    • wobble

      Surely an admission of their own political ineptitude and weakness….

      Maybe we need some Vikings in charge …

      errr !

      • Realpolitik/ fruitcake/ racist

        Is that some kind of dig?

  • Conway

    However much Farage and co paint themselves as more than disgruntled ex-Conservatives, their views remain remarkably in line with the Tories.” You mean the Tories before Dave reconfigured them into something else, presumably? UKIP is picking up votes from Labour and the Lib Dems as well, but most significantly, it is picking up the votes of those who have not voted before or who have not voted for many years because they felt they didn’t have a party that represented their interests to vote for. Now that they have, smear tactics won’t work.

    • Realpolitik

      Tory membership

      from 1.2 million in 1980 to 170,000 members in 2010.

      • Lady Magdalene

        And apparently down to 100,000 now. But the Tory Party is refusing to comment.

        • Realpolitik/ fruitcake/ racist

          I imagine that’s true, mine is an old source.

  • Conway

    All this indicates Ukip is set to have its best ever election next
    month, and very possibly come first, but will have a significant
    challenge to maintain their current levels of popularity after that.
    ” A week is a long time in politics, never mind a year.

    • Realpolitik

      Not when the establishment’s arguments go out of the window and they resort to drip feeding obscure UKIP members’ ignorant tweets. liblabcon have lost the argument and resorted to Ad homs rather than addressing the real issue; the pros and cons of EU membership.

      • Conway

        The problem is, there aren’t any pros that justify the enormous expense. They are all off-set by the cost of the cons.

  • Agrippina

    The posters are not racist, because if they were legal action would have been taken and the posters removed. So please try to stop pushing that lie.

    Voters want to vote for anyone who is prepared to deal with the issues that concern them, namely uncontrolled immigration and the only way to deal with that is to exit the EU.

    UKIP to put the concerns of Brits 1st.

    • Realpolitik

      Thought I’d get the top comment before telemarxist

      The EU can’t afford to stop trading with us- their largest export
      market in the world. It’s laughable that even countries like Iceland can
      negotiate trade deals with China and they only have a population of
      300,000; yet we are told we don’t have the influence.

      As for the 3 million jobs:

      https://scontent-a-lhr.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-frc3/t1.0-9/10301537_853286564686429_7034090809159182965_n.jpg

      Vote for UKIP. Every UKIP vote cancels out a lib/lab/con vote.

      • Agrippina

        I know what you mean, no doubt he will try to pop into here, but the truth is no-one listens to him or any of the liblabcon artistes anymore.

        • Realpolitik

          They’ve resorted to digging up 5 year old tweets from nebulous UKIP members; rather than debating our EU membership rationally. The people aren’t as thick as they like to think, we can see through the drip-fed brainwashing a few weeks before an election, all it does is show them to be deceptive invidious cretins.

          • Agrippina

            Agreed, the sadness is that the frightened media want to hang onto their jobs, so will pedal any old guff to try and keep their chums in power.

            Hopefully voters can see that the media cannot be trusted and to make up their minds based on what is happening all around them.

            Ghettos everywhere and unlike the trio of troughers & media, Brits struggling to find decent well paid work.

            • telemachus

              If the posters were not racist your post is
              *
              But the fact is the poster campaign was constructed with the basest of motives
              Why do you suppose that Farage turns up in cities with large Asian communities and starts threatening jobs with dark undertones of sending people home
              *
              These scare tactics are at best divisive but in reality appealing to the racist views inherent in many of these communities
              *
              Those who the gods wish to destroy they first make mad

              • Fergus Pickering

                I thin I have racist views. I liked Britain better when it had mre British people in it. And I don’t mean anyJohnny-come-lately muslims with passports.

                • Kitty MLB

                  Mr Prickly having racist views, I am dumbfounded.
                  It requires more then a passport to make someone English.
                  Its about love for your country, shared history appreciating
                  values and traditions. Johnny- come- lately muslims are guests
                  and not English. But are we? our blue English passport is now a red
                  EU passport … Englishness may be a fleeting memory.

                • Wessex Man

                  No Kitty no, never give up, it’s no fleeting memory to me.

                • Kitty MLB

                  Glad to hear that. There really is not much of it left in the UK now. Just in some of our historic towns and beautiful countryside.

                • Fergus Pickering

                  Certainly not, Kitty. I am as English as W.G. Grace though his beard is longer.

                • Kitty MLB

                  Fergus had a beard does he? chaps can look quite distinguished with beards but it does depend on what type.
                  And not a Brian Blessed type beard- wildlife probably lives
                  in there.

                • Fergus Pickering

                  More D’artagnan thna Anthony Trollope, Kitty

                • Kitty MLB

                  Your beard is exactly the type of beard that would suit a
                  Arts Scholar ( what a coincidence) I like a Goatee beard on
                  a chap which I think is similar. My father-in-law has your type
                  of beard, very distinguished! especially when worn with a trilby hat. I would like my husband to grow one but, I have been told
                  he doesn’t have the right shape face to wear a beard. Thank God you do not have a ghastly Antony Trollope forest attached to you, it doesn’t bare thinking about.

                • CharlietheChump

                  Wimmin must be allowed the right to have beards too. (Harriet Harmon)

                • Realpolitik/ fruitcake/ racist

                  She hates beards! She likes them young:

                  http://labour25.com/

                • Kitty MLB

                  Forgot to say, I know your not in the slightest part racist.
                  come sempre sei un caro gentiluomo con un bello anima.
                  and that is why.

                • Fergus Pickering

                  How beautiful the Italian language always sounds. Unintelligible alas to me.

                • Kitty MLB

                  It is a beautiful language like the culture ( especially poetry) history, scenery , food, the smell of wild flowers and the yellow buildings glowing in the twilight.
                  Oh, it was just a compliment I was paying Fergus,
                  everything just sounds more enchanting in Italian-
                  even a shopping list. I hope you have visited at some point.

                • Fergus Pickering

                  Indeed I have. Urbino was my favourite place.

                • Conway

                  As always you are a dear gentleman with a fine mind.

                • Fergus Pickering

                  A gentleman and a scholar. As you are, sir.

                • Kitty MLB

                  The very charming conway speaks a little Italian,
                  he got the first part right but the second part
                  was something to do with a organ that true
                  poets and writers would pale into insignificance
                  without.

                • Fergus Pickering

                  Dear me. Rudeness. And in a foreign language!

                • Kitty MLB

                  Thought you didn’t speak Italian, how did you know? Ah, You
                  knew it was Italian. such trickery! you are a scoundrel of
                  the second waters.
                  ho bisogno di essere molto attenti in futuro
                  con tale subdola poccoli riccio .
                  la prossima volta ma si potrebbe non piacere esso .

                • Kitty MLB

                  By the way, I’ve never been contumelious or indecorous. Italian is not a foreign language( I have a few Italian genes) prefer ‘ rudeness’ it’s matter of fact. Most that I exchange posts with more often,
                  tend to be used to my idiosyncrasies. They say put a sock in it quite often,
                  especially when I should remain background noise and stop hogging mere
                  mortal’s but what can I say I’m unconventional and have average intelligence.
                  Apologies for inadvertently irritating you and for benighting your reply box again. Its been a pleasure making thy
                  acquaintance, you are a gentleman sir.
                  God speed and all that, With regards K.

                • Kitty MLB

                  Italiano fa la anima canto.
                  volevo parlare in Italiano di Fergus.
                  avrebbe parlato in inglese come parlo quelle lingua troppo.
                  non ho scelto di.

                • Realpolitik/ fruitcake/ racist

                  Every immigrant that comes into our small nation makes it just that bit harder for our children to get their own small corner of England, I heard that said by an sweet old man in my local about 5 years ago.

              • Colonel Mustard

                You must be well on the way to destruction then because you are already as mad as a box of frogs.

                *

                *

                *

              • Inverted Meniscus

                Did you really get up st 4.00 a.m. in order to write this dishonest drivel?

              • Lungfish66

                There aren’t that many cities without a large Asian population- I suppose he could go to Truro.

              • Realpolitik/ fruitcake/ racist

                I’m glad facts scare you, they should. Now clear off this thread you odious creep.

              • Agrippina

                Keir Hardie wrote an article for the Miner in 1887 in which he states the following “For the second time in their history Messrs. Merry and Cunninghame have introduced a number of Russian Poles to Glengarnock Ironworks.

                What object they have in doing so is beyond human ken unless it is, as stated by a speaker at Irvine, to teach men how to live on garlic and oil, or introduce the Black Death, so as to get rid of the surplus labourers.”

                Mr Hardie told a Select Committee in 1889 that the foreigners had filthy habits and 6 or 7 males occupied a one-roomed hse.

                Neither my comment nor the posters are racist. You should look up the definition. You & your ilk are prob the reason for the lack of labour voters.

              • CharlietheChump

                “Those who the gods wish to destroy they first make” –

                socialist.

      • Kitty MLB

        Its all part of belittling what used to be Great Britain,
        now we are insultingly called ‘little England’ by those
        who want to keep us in our place.We used to be a
        great trading nation, and the world is our oyster.
        We just need to move the big EU elephant that is
        in our way..

        • Realpolitik

          They can call me what they like, to insult me is to ensure you won’t get my vote.

          I laughed when Clegg disdainfully said how Farage wanted W.G Grace to open the bowling, I thought “Why is that a bad thing?”

          From a sports prospective he’s considered the best cricketer to have ever lived, is it just the idea of the British heritage he was attacking or what? were these such bad times anyway? Cricket on the green, warm beer, community, local pub….

          As far as I’m concerned this is quintessentially English. Why is it a bad thing?

          • Colonel Mustard

            Clegg will never be the Englishman that W G Grace was and is. The scorn he tried to level at him just demonstrated his ignorance and self-hating nastiness. Like the BBC who regaled us with night after night of boring bloody curling but couldn’t show the test matches.

            When the Deputy Prime Minister who is supposed to represent and protect this country stands on TV and slags it off you know something has gone seriously wrong.

            • Conway

              At the risk of being lambasted, one has to wonder what attachment, if any, Clegg has to this country. He didn’t give his children English names, his wife is an EU lawyer and he unashamedly supports an organisation that avows it will destroy the “evil” nation state. He’s hardly on our side, is he?

              • Colonel Mustard

                His “attachment” is his vision of what this country should be rather than what it was or is. Like so many “progressives” infatuated with the rose-tinted idea that Europe is somehow better his determination that his vision should trump over 1,000 years of our history as a successful nation is staggeringly arrogant.

          • GnosticBrian

            W. G. Grace was rightly better regarded for his batting than for his bowling. Seems that cricket is yet another subject about which Clegg knows nowt.

            • telemachus

              What we know about Grace is that in relation to foreigners he said we had a duty to uphold English Standards
              And what are those standards
              They are the qualities of fairness and tolerance
              *
              Grace would turn in his grave if he heard the racist utterances of Farage and his bunch of misfits
              *
              It grieves me to hear the little englanders invoking this most proper of British Gentleman

              • Michele Keighley

                W.G. Grace played cricket for England – not Britain; And if you research him properly you will find that he was proud of that fact.

                Again, you distort the meaning of ‘Little Englander’ and miss the very good point made by Kitty MLB – the more you pour scorn on the very idea of being an ‘Englander’ little or otherwise, the growing number of people who now connect more with the concept of England rather than Britain will move away from you.

                • telemachus

                  John Dann instilled in young Gilbert the love of British Principles and the pluralistic reality of the British Empire

                • Colonel Mustard

                  You are missing the point. Whatever feelings W G Grace had about the matter Clegg was using him as a vehicle for scorning England’s past.

                • Inverted Meniscus

                  And yet you favour a party (Labour) that loathes freedom of speech and wants to establish a single party state.

                • Realpolitik/ fruitcake/ racist

                  To quote Telemachus

                  “What we know about Grace is that in relation to foreigners he said we had a duty to uphold English Standards”

                  I could not agree more!!!!!!!

              • Colonel Mustard

                Go away.

              • Fergus Pickering

                I think you are wrong about W.G. Grace. But why would I expect you to be anything else, Tele.

              • Realpolitik/ fruitcake/ racist

                Fairness and tolerance are not British or English virtues, they are just virtues.

                We have a stiff upper lip until it’s taken advantage of, and it has been on a spectacular scale.

                He wouldn’t turn in his grave, he wouldn’t recognise the country we’re talking about. Thanks to “progressives” like you.

                We didn’t invoke him your hero Clegg did.

              • Realpolitik/ fruitcake/ racist

                “Telemachus” means “a long way from battle” – Do you live in the home counties?

              • GnosticBrian

                Was it out of a sense of fairness that he refused to walk when bowled out – telling the bowler “They came here to watch me bat, not see you bowl”? Sounds very champagne socialist – the rules apply to others, not to me….

          • Fergus Pickering

            W.G. Grace opening the bowling would be an excellent thing. Have you looked at his figures? He would open the batting as well. And captain the side. And if they were not winning he would cheat just a bit. What’s not to like?

            • Realpolitik/ fruitcake/ racist

              According to Clegg – the British part.

          • Conway

            Because if the English are attached to their homeland, it will be difficult for the EU to destroy the nation state and establish its holy grail, the United States of Europe.

            • Realpolitik/ fruitcake/ racist

              In my opinion it’s been lost, UKIP is about getting it back.

        • telemachus

          Kitty dear
          First apologies for any perceived Saturday slight
          Second as a well read girl you actually know the reality of the modern world
          We have moved on from the economic usefulness of the Nation State as a stand alone trading unit
          We need the City as the world centre looked to as the financial portal of Europe
          The same is true of a host of multinational industrial enterprises
          Only a fool would think otherwise
          Farage is a fool
          *
          In respect of the first you must learn to suffer the slings and arrows of outrageous fortune
          You cannot by opposing end them

          • Colonel Mustard

            There is a difference between having a tap in the kitchen and a fire hose. You want a fire hose to justify access to water.

            You are a fool.

          • Kitty MLB

            You appreciate Shakespeare do you, Telemachus,
            how interesting to know. The Saturday whatever is forgotten
            now, our very own Blake’s socialist rose.

        • Shorne

          ‘Great Britain’ is a purely geographical term, like Greater London or Greater Manchester, it is not some sort of assessment.

          • monty61

            Not quite true. It was the entity formed by the Act of Union with Scotland in 1707.

            • Shorne

              Fair enough, but ‘Greater’ still never meant ‘better’.

              • Colonel Mustard

                In does/did in the eyes of many of its people. Before it became more fashionable to denigrate it, feel ashamed for it and apologise for the acts of some of its dead inhabitants.

                • Shorne

                  I don’t do any of those things and I dislike people hijacking the English language.

      • Des Demona

        Idiot. The EU exports 17 trillion to non EU countries. On terms negotiated with the clout of being the second biggest market in the world.

        • Wessex Man

          Asia is now the biggest fastest growing bloc, when the UK joined the EEC, European trade accounted for 36% of world trade it’s now, under the guidence of the EU 18% and contracting!

          • Des Demona

            Even if those figures are accurate,18% of a massive market is better than 36% of a small one. Those figures are irrelevant outwith the proper context.
            The EU is the biggest exporter of goods and services in the world, bigger than China, bigger than the USA.

            • Wessex Man

              You are saying that the EU’s exports are bigger than China, really?

              • Des Demona
                • the viceroy’s gin

                  Your link shows the EU running a trade deficit. China doesn’t.

                  Try again.

                • Des Demona

                  My link shows the answer to the question asked.
                  And the UK isn’t running a trade deficit?
                  Try again.

                • the viceroy’s gin

                  We’re discussing your EUSSR brethren, lad, in comparison to China. Your statements are false. Still.

                  Try again.

                • Des Demona

                  Are you being wilfully ignorant sonny boy or is it natural?
                  The question was are EU exports bigger than China. The answer is yes. What part of that are you having difficulty understanding?

                • the viceroy’s gin

                  You seem to be having difficulty understanding that your EUSSR heroes run a trade deficit, and China runs a surplus. There is no comparison between the two.

                  Now, dopes like you may not be able to comprehend this, but any dope can sell at a loss. It takes someone smart to sell at a profit. The EUSSR hasn’t quite figured that out, apparently, although being smart is immaterial to you dopes.

                • Des Demona

                  I don’t have difficulty understanding that at all. That was not the question I was asked. It is however the question I answered.
                  You seriously believe the trade deficit is caused by selling at a loss? Oh dear god.

                • the viceroy’s gin

                  You’re singing the wonders of the EUSSR in comparison to China, lad. The EUSSR is running a trade deficit, and thus per capita incomes are falling continually. China isn’t burdened by that sort of stupidity .

                  Yes, you have difficulty understanding, by definition.

                • Des Demona

                  I think you are burdened by stupidity. First of all you state that the trade deficit is caused by selling at a loss and then state that a trade deficit results in lower per capita incomes.
                  Good grief, your level of ignorance is so breath-taking. that I can’t engage with it. I suggest you go and read up on some basic economic principles.

                • the viceroy’s gin

                  No, trade deficits are caused by stupidity, like you and the EUSSR believe in.

                  Yours and the EUSSR’s stupidity also causes falling per capita income.

                  Now, comparing yours and the EUSSR’s stupidity to China is pretty stupid, don’t you think? They run a trade surplus and have rising incomes.

                  Try again, lad.

                • Des Demona

                  No thanks sonny boy, I don’t engage with that level of stupidity.

                • the viceroy’s gin

                  No doubt, you are at a very advanced level of stupidity.

            • Colonel Mustard

              Does the EU really export stuff? Where from? That big building in Brussels?

      • anncalba

        Well you did get in before insane telemarxist, but only just. I really do believe the only way to get rid of him is to completely ignore his ravings, but there are always some here who seem to think they can argue rationally with him. As for UKIP, the MSM need to come to terms with the fact that they are not much more trusted than politicians, since both have regularly lied to us and treated us like fools. May not support UKIP, but certainly cant give a vote to any of Lib/lab/Cons. Media, and especially the BBC, seem to be having hizzy fits trying to understand this.

        • Realpolitik/ fruitcake/ racist

          Join UKIP

    • Blindsideflanker

      When Sebastian Payne says……

      “The question of whether Ukip are a racist party continues to be asked ”

      ….he perhaps reveals more of the truth than he cared to. What this racist straw man of an argument has been built on is the old ‘are you a rapist? ‘ type question, where the answer or truth doesn’t matter, it is a way of bad mouthing someone to do them damage by the means of posing a question.

      • Realpolitik

        Have you noticed how we’re being drip-fed ancient twitter feeds from obscure UKIP members in the build-up to EU elections?

        Do the liblabcon have no rational arguments to put forward?

        • telemachus

          There is little point in wasting time on rationality when faced with a demagogue
          *
          Farage has forfeited all rights to rational hearing after his racist foray to the North
          *
          Farage should read Secion 28 of the Crime and Disorder Act 1998

          • Michele Keighley

            … and so should Diane Abbot!! The Labour Party, calling the UKIP “racist’ while this member of parliament is still supported by them is hypocrisy at it worst.

            • telemachus

              I guess that in itself is a racist statement
              *
              You folk need to get it into your heads that we are a pluralist society
              However much you huff and puff you cannot change that
              *
              Thank God that the electoral demographic will never allow UKIP any say in our National affairs

              • Wessex Man

                and so the chants of racism continue from people who really have nothing serious to say!

              • Colonel Mustard

                “You folk need to get it into your heads that we are a pluralist society”

                And you need to get it into your head that that pluralism includes politics.

                So stop stalking and harassing commentators here because they dissent fro your orthodoxy.

              • Inverted Meniscus

                Hilarious, Labour wants a single party state and is anything but pluralist.

              • Realpolitik/ fruitcake/ racist

                How is it racist? Dianne Abbott made just as cutting racist comments on twitter as the UKIP people, yet was not reprimanded.

                Well you clearly don’t get out much if you still think UKIP are a fringe party.

          • Wessex Man

            and this post proves my point entirely!

          • Realpolitik/ fruitcake/ racist

            You’re the true fascist, trying to crush any free speech and democracy by labelling people as “insane” or “racist”

            Well guess what Adolf, we don’t care about your EU/nazi plans to take over Europe, we’re English

            Earlier you invoke buzz words such as “tolerance” and “fairness” How exactly is it fair that you feel you can discredit a rational argument with irrelevant labels?

          • Realpolitik/ fruitcake/ racist

            The public listen to rational arguments, something you appear incapable of doing.

            The establishment know they would lose (and have) in a rational debate, thus rely on as homs.

        • Wessex Man

          No, course the Liblabcon have no arguments to counter a very easily put question, do you want control of your own country. We now see this in the very large regional newspaper The Western Daily Press. That Clegg made sure that there is no where to go on giving reasons to stay in the EU in his feeble debate showing, so all they have is insults to throw, which they do daily.

          They can’t understand why the people won’t listien to them anymore, hilarious!

      • Colonel Mustard

        It’s a bit like that Spartacus moment but with people standing up and shouting “I’m a racist fruitcake”.

  • Rhoda Klapp8

    No, it isn’t a serious party, but that means it has fewer restraints. As long as it represents my opinions and the other parties don’t, it will get my vote. Not because I expect or want it to win, but because none of the others have any appeal at all and I don’t want them to win. They have been weighed in the balance and found wanting. If they want to trim and squabble over the left-of-centre floating voter they are no use to me. Vote-grubbing weasels who have not a scintilla of principle. Or more accurately are prepared to bend their claimed principles to any audience they happen to be in front of.

    • starfish

      Could not agree more – the bubble muppets just don’t get it – and now they are starting to agree with joe public – very nice of them!

    • Colonel Mustard

      Exactly how I feel. I just want to give the muppets “governing” us in that EU rubber stamping branch a good kicking.

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