Coffee House

Nigel Farage disowns all of Ukip’s 2010 manifesto policies

23 January 2014

3:07 PM

23 January 2014

3:07 PM

‘We need to have a domestic policy agenda that adds up’ — Nigel Farage said on the Daily Politics today. The Ukip leader aptly summed up, and proved, one of the main challenges for his party as they attempt to become a mature force.

Farage did his best to disown anything the party stood for at the last general election. Andrew Neil quizzed him on a variety of official policy positions, many of which are inconsistent and unfortunately remain on their website or available in official documents.

On replacing Trident, Farage claimed his position was at odds with what is stated on the party’s website:

‘Andrew Neil: Is Ukip now against replacing Trident?

Nigel Farage: Yes. That’s a debate we’ve been kicking around for sometime in Ukip

Neil: So you’re now for a non-nuclear defence strategy for Britain?

Farage: No, I don’t know where you got that from.

Neil: From your website, the Ukip defence website

Farage: That is not the case. It was the case…when it comes to websites I’m not the expert’

[Alt-Text]


Farage was also asked whether it was still Ukip policy to introduce a compulsory dress code for taxi drivers. His response — ‘Do we? That’s news to me’ — doesn’t inspire much confidence. He also denied it was still party policy to repaint all trains in ‘traditional colours’. ’Absolutely not, I’ve never read that. I’ve no idea what you’re talking about’, he responded. Farage attempted to shut down the debate by disowning anything before his time:

‘Under the last leadership [of Ukip], we managed to produce a manifesto that was 480 sides long so you can quote me bits of it I won’t know. That’s why I said none of it stands today and we’ll launch it all after the European elections’

The party are not blind to the issues with their policies. This disclaimer used to appear on parts of their website:

Screen-Shot-2013-07-08-at-13.26.05

Unlike many of the personal jibes towards Ukip (loonies etc), attacking them on policy grounds will make voters think twice. Conservative HQ is having plenty of fun on Twitter pointing out Ukip’s obscure policies, such as returning the Circle line to being circle. But does any of this matter to Ukip voters? A significant chunk of their supporters are protest voters who’ve given up on the main parties. It’s unlikely these people care about the colour of trains any more than a sensible economic strategy.

Highlighting these polices is a reminder of how far Ukip have come in three years but also of the challenges they face to produce a credible, consistent manifesto in 2015. Having an out of date website with an agenda Ukip no longer supports is unacceptable and as their response to Cllr David Silvester’s comments last week showed, Ukip still have plenty of growing up to do.

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Show comments
  • David Atherton

    UKIP are f-ing loonies. Come on, trains in trad colours, crowns on pint pots. 15% of the population are nuts.

  • saffrin

    UKIP Nigel Farage full interview on Australian TV
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vAyzWKXtbq0

  • saffrin

    Martin Callanan vs Nigel Farage on EU 2014 elections (12Sept13) http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yC_y8AFD4OE

    Nigel Farage v Alastair Campbell On Alcohol Abuse
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PN6zlq8lnzo

    UKIP Nigel Farage VS LIBLABCON on BBC Paxman
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FMxjcQpCf4k

  • The Patriot

    I read in one paper, I think it was the Mail, that one of the policies was, ‘Ban the burqa and hold referendums on new mosques’

    I do hope he keeps that one!

  • swatnan

    ‘Nothing to do with me’ …. says Nige; I’m only the Leader.

    • saffrin

      Nigel Farage doesn’t write the establishments scripts. In case you failed to notice, he didn’t get a chance to answer any question fully before another was thrown at him.
      Canada 2013 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9SxKUAMCw5Q
      Australian TV http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vAyzWKXtbq0
      Make the effort to listen.

      • Valerie Arnold

        That is because they do not like the fact that he can and will answer, he doesn’t fluff around like the others, and they are all scared stiff.

    • Valerie Arnold

      He did not say that, he said he had nothing to do with the last manifesto, so would not discuss it. He will do his OWN manifesto when the time comes for the GE. Why do you need to keep misquoting everything he says.

  • Not Voting For You

    So the Spectator continues to do it’s bit for one party Lib-Lab-Con politics in the UK by constantly trying to smear UKIP and anyone else who sees that politics is broken.

    The only answer is to deny the representatives of these three parties any legitimacy at all, and we achieve this by not voting for them again. When we vote for them they gain power like some vampire sucking the life out of the body politic.

    We must pledge not to vote for them again, despite the best efforts of the Spectator.

    http://www.notvotingforyou.org/take_the_pledge.php

  • aron lipshitz

    I am saving my vote for an honest politician, but I note that while the pederast party, the lying-in-the-teeth party and the hand-up-the-skirt party all gang up on UKIP and seem to employ a lot of sad little schoolkids to post on comments pages–they have all began to nick their policies regarding immigration, education, welfare and so on. It reminds one of how the elite and their boyfriends once railed at David Lord Sutch and his Rock and Roll Party, Teenage Party and finally Raving Monster Loony Party with their bizarre ideas such as Votes at 18, commercial radio stations, passports for pets, all-day pub opening, free transport for pensioners and foodbanks for the deprived.

  • Tim Reed

    “A significant chunk of their supporters are protest voters who’ve given
    up on the main parties. It’s unlikely these people care about the colour
    of trains any more than a sensible economic strategy.”

    What dismissive arrogance – to suggest that those who no longer have faith in the three main parties are clueless and apathetic when it comes to important issue like the economy.

  • Smithersjones2013

    Well go figure ! The Tories pet anti-UKIP propaganda poodle writes another sneery little piece about UKIP. Did anyone see Lord Pearson leading UKIP in 2010? If ever there was a reason to abolish the Lords (current UKIP policy), Lords Prescott and Martin aside, then Pearson provided it whilst leading UKIP.. Never again should UKIP allow an establishment insider run their party

    No wonder Farage has disowned the manifesto that Pearson stood on.

    Now of course if we are going to judge parties on prior manifestos should we judge Labour on the one Miliband part wrote (and needed Harriet Harman to sort out) in 2010 or the one that Cameron helped write in 2005 or the one that the Foreign Secretary stood on in 2001. I’m sure there will be some juicy little nuggets in those manifestos as well.

    As ever whatever mud the Tories sling at UKIP you can be certain that they are guilty of ten times worse.

  • judyk113

    Being the Man in Pub Party means never having to say you’re sorry…..

  • paulus

    The conservative party is no longer conservative , it is Liberal and conservatism is dead.

    • the viceroy’s gin

      …it’s not dead, as that’s the purpose of UKIP, to breathe life into it.

  • Daniel Maris

    Isn’t that what Tony Blair – ex CND activist and most popular UK politician of the last 50 years – did.

    • Smithersjones2013

      He wasn’t even close (even within his own party) of being the:

      most popular UK politician of the last 50 years

  • JabbaTheCat

    Lolz…Niggle Farridge demonstrating, yet again, that the Ukip policy clusterf*ck is alive and kicking…

    • southerner

      Anyone have a clue what this means?

      • Tom

        No must be one of those words the young kids use which baffles grown up’s.

      • Smithersjones2013

        No idea. I think its some sort of ‘pigeon’. but other than that its gibberish

    • Two Bob

      So what happened to the Labour/conservative policies? Oh yes, wiped. Erased. Gone.

  • Adro

    I’m no fan of everything the Tories do, but the online Kippers are hilarious. Jumping angrily to the defence of the apparently sainted Farage and his party at the merest perceived slight. Even the most die-hard of you have to admit, having policies like making taxi drivers wear a uniform, ‘making the circle line a circle’ and painting trains in ‘traditional colours’ are a bit comical. They’re rather like the ‘quiet bat people’ or ‘4th sector pathfinder’ policies on TV’s The Thick of It.

    That’s without any serious criticism of the policy of magically raising spending by £30bn at the same time as cutting taxes to the tune of £90bn, and not borrowing to fund it. I really don’t know why you get all worked up about UKIP being scrutinised about this stuff. Brillo would give the same grilling (and regularly does) to Labour, Tory or Lib-Dem MPs if they proposed stuff like this, and rightly so. If anything you should take it as a complement. The exposure to scrutiny indicates that the media and political circles are taking the party seriously as an electoral contender, hence the need to brush up the policy book. ‘I’m not an expert on websites’ is hardly an excuse for the leader of a serious party not knowing the defence policy as it stands.

    On a somewhat off-topic point – I’m also not sure why you’re all getting mad about this website pointing out things like this. Calling them ‘Tory teenagers’ is hardly conducive is it? The Speccie is the house magazine of the Tories, they’re not exactly going to suddenly start finding excuses for Nigel being a bit embarrassed by journalistic questioning are they? If you want that, go to whichever UKIP blog you like, not the Spectator.

    • Two Bob

      It is the 2015 manifesto that counts, and it will be with us shortly. There is nothing wrong with reminding people of that.

      • Adro

        Oh I don’t dispute that, but I think the point is that just over a year out of a general election, the only piece of policy that the vast majority of people know UKIP for is leaving Europe. Given the Euro elections are also coming up (in which I’ve no doubt UKIP will do well), they need to make their policy portfolio a bit more credible. Before I get attacked, I’m not referring to absolute detail, but having at least a broad idea. The defence policy is pertinent to this. Given the 2010 manifesto is the last thing that journalists have to go on, its natural for them to base their questions on this.

        • Tom

          Do you honestly believe the BBC wanted to know UKIP’s policy’s?.
          As always with the MSM they went through the 2010 manifesto with a fine tooth comb for anything that would put UKIP in a bad light the BBC being the worst by the way.
          This tactic is so obvious it is actually backfiring on them.

          • Adro

            Resorting to the ‘ooh it’s all a conspiracy’ tactic isn’t exactly credible Tom. The leader was brought on to be interviewed on UKIP policy and he ballsed it up. The media are always going to go for the politician on air, and knowing this going in, it is up to the particular representative to attempt to give a decent account of themselves. Excuses (like that about the website) don’t cut it, and nor should they for any party leader looking to be taken seriously at an election.

            • Tom

              Agreed on the website bit but do we really expect any politician to know every word in a manifesto from 4yrs ago?.
              Farage knew more about who was building our ships unlike a defence minister who hadn’t got a clue and she is in government.

            • Two Bob
              • Adro

                The Tories taking their website down was stupid, as was Labour doing the same. But the problem is that we’re not talking about the Tories, we’re talking about UKIP’s policy platform, which is apparently woefully lacking.

                Just as the Tories blaming Labour forever, Labour blaming the Tories/Thatcher etc won’t work forever, UKIP (and their followers on here) have got to stop attempting to deflect legitimate criticism by having a go at the Tories. Saying “oh well, they did this” is not an excuse for one’s own failings.

                • Smithersjones2013

                  UKIP (and their followers on here) have got to stop attempting to deflect legitimate criticism by having a go at the Tories.

                  What an absurd argument. Every politician I have ever seen in the media or elsewhere attempts to deflect criticism onto other political parties. You (and Payne) might want to talk about UKIP but you can guarantee everyone else (UKIP, Labour and even the Libdems) would first and foremost prefer to talk about Tory failings.

                  True you have to change the things you are blaming them for from time to time to keep it fresh but it doesn’t change the reality that dumping on other parties is a core activity of politics.

                  What is increasingly clear and is rather novel is the modern Tories inability to take what they dish out. This lot certainly lack the resilience of other parties and their own predecessors

                  Why should the Tories get a free pass from UKIP? UKIP owe them nothing other than a good hiding.

                  Next you’ll be telling us its just not fair that everyone is picking on the Tories.

                  To which the response likely will be. Boo Hoo.

            • Rallan

              Really? Because I’ll bet you that his excuses DO cut it. In fact, I’ll bet that UKIP support won’t even blink in the face of this, nor even in response to gay rain.

              UKIP isn’t a political party like the others. It’s a popular movement with gathering momentum. You can’t fight it with political point scoring or snide insinuations.

            • ButcombeMan

              ballsed it up?

              Another one who does not get it. Farage was taking the piss. Neil plainly knew that.

              There is no pressure on Ukip to produce a manifesto until after the EU elections. Meanwhile the other parties stay absolutely desperate to know what will be in it.

              Enjoy the ride. This will be fun as the Cameroons panic.

              Red Ed will maybe need to panic too if Wythenshawe does not go well .

          • 2trueblue

            Andrew Neil is the only person who gives all politicians the same unbiased interrogation, and is the only one who does his homework. So are you saying that he did not treat Farage as he treats others?
            If you are referring to the BBC in general then they only have one party they support and that is Liebore. Andrew Neil is the only person at the BBC who understands what unbiased means.

            • the viceroy’s gin

              He’s an establishment twit, who fights the LibLabCon clone corner tooth and nail.

            • Tom

              Andrew Neil may be fair minded but as you point out his boss’s are not neither is Jo Coburn
              As I pointed out regarding Godfrey Bloom there reporting of similar occurrences couldn’t be more different.

            • ButcombeMan

              I like Neil he one of the few BBC interviewers I have any time for. I agree with you.
              I watched the interview, I think Neil was enjoying the joke with Farage.
              Serious political commentators like Neil are going to enjoy the prospect of Ukip continuing to ruffle feathers.

        • Two Bob

          So where are the 2015 manifestos for the other parties?

          At least UKIP stand for something. Unlike them.

    • Tom

      At the end of the piece he mentioned how he thought UKIP handled Councillor Silvester badly and still have a lot to learn.
      How about the the handling of Lord Rennard by the established Libdems and Nick Clegg,what is their excuse?.
      Its the unbalanced reporting that get’s Ukippers backs up.

      • Adro

        But Tom, the media have been giving the Lib Dems a massive grilling over the Rennard issue, and rightly so. Most of the last week or so’s political news has been focussed on it. I’d hardly call one interview negative reporting. Besides, the questions were perfectly fair, and it was Farage who gave the less than brilliant answers. All parties complain of biased reporting, but I’d argue that until relatively recently (the last couple of years), UKIP have had a relatively easy ride in terms of media scrutiny. As I said, if anything the increased coverage shows that they’re being taken seriously.

        • Tom

          I fully expected closer scrutiny especially on policy but the media witch hunt is so obvious.
          Take Godfrey Bloom hitting that reporter with a newspaper and the furore it caused then take a look at how the media reported Farage being hit with a placard,they actually made a joke of it on the BBC’s Daily Politics and unless i missed it never reported it at all on BBC News.

    • Valerie Arnold

      I want to stay on the spectator site because I like the way you are all trying (unsuccessfully) to slur UKIP. Nigel is a patriotic Brit, I bet he knows what the Magna Carter is. Everytime you lot from other parties try to besmirch Nigel or UKIP, you get us more votes, please keep up the good work.

  • Tom

    I’m surprised at the surprise UKIP in 2010 were a far different party to the one that will be going into the 2015 election.
    Is this specific to UKIP I think not.
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sQ2n7oMcSi0 http://www.theguardian.com/politics/2012/sep/19/nick-clegg-apologies-tuition-fees-pledge
    http://iaindale.blogspot.co.uk/2010/04/labours-27-broken-manifesto-promises.html

    Makes you wonder if a manifesto is worth the paper it is printed on when the Liblabcon can renege on vital issues.

  • AnotherDave

    In their 2010 manifesto, the Conservatives said: “The steady and unaccountable intrusion of the European Union into almost every aspect of our lives has gone too far.”

    Now they intend to pass justice and home affairs powers to the EU. (8m50s into the video linked to below).

    http://youtu.be/c3JnIw50zL8

  • AnotherDave

    The Conservatives recently blocked pre-2010 material from their website.

    http://blogs.spectator.co.uk/coffeehouse/2013/11/why-have-the-tories-purged-their-website/

    New election, new offer. I don’t see why UKIP should be singled out for this.

  • Two Bob

    Sorry but no policies are better than policies that I hate (liblabcon do not have any policies I like).

    The issues that they are strong on are good enough for me I am afraid.

    • the viceroy’s gin

      Yes, UKIP’s core issues are the EUSSR and sovereignty. They’ll sink or swim on those. In fact, LibLabCon could probably liquidate UKIP tomorrow, if one of them came out and adopted a UKIP line on those issues.

      • Two Bob

        Lets face it, you do not try and win over support for a 2015 GE by mocking a rival party on their 2010 manifesto.

        Voters may be stupid, but they are not THAT stupid.

        It is the 2015 manifesto that counts and I have the feeling that the establishment know the new manifesto is going to be pretty good so this is all they have left to go on.

        I smell fear.

  • chris_xxxx

    Does anybody know what the policies of Labour are?
    Does anybody know what laws and regulations Cameron wants to renegotiate with Brussels?

    Is it a good economic policy to be borrowing more than £120 billion for the past three years and have a national debt of over £1.2 trillion?

    Is it a good economic policy to put a minimum price cap on carbon emissions for the UK, which is three times greater than in Europe?

  • callingallcomets

    BTW since Seb is a bit late with the Wythenshawe by election news here are details of UKIP’s candidate. Local man, not parachuted in, self made man from humble beginnings…just the sort of person who wouldn’t be invited to the Speccie Christmas party….lol..

    http://www.ukipdaily.com/wythenshawe-meet-ukip-candidate/#.UuFLbNLFLs0

    • the viceroy’s gin

      If that guy takes it, there will be enough shat pants in LibLabCon to keep the asian cleaners busy ’til Easter.

  • callingallcomets

    Ignore young Seb…I know he is supposedly the Speccie “expert” on UKIP but i think you would be better off asking Eddie the Eagle for his skiing tips than expecting any serious analysis from Seb on UKIP

    Tim Montgomerie, however, although I don’t always agree with him at least deserves some respect
    http://www.thetimes.co.uk/tto/opinion/columnists/article3983223.ece

  • Bill Brinsmead

    Whoa. I’m sure I heard Nigel say that he wants a bigger army as it is UKIP policy to use soldiers to help keep public order. He’s more European than he lets on.

    • David Kay

      No its common sense. We’re going to need troops on the streets soon when the jihadists come back from syria and continue their jihad here.

    • AnotherDave

      In times of emergency. He specifically mentioned troops manning police stations, during something like the recent London riots. Freeing police from admin to front line service.

      During the last fireman’s strike military firemen provided a service to the general public.

    • Smithersjones2013

      Being European isn’t a problem (Farage is married to one) its being members of the EU that is.

  • albertcooper

    The Media and in particular ,continually try to denigrate UKIP as “off key”. All I can say is ,do your worst as both me and I believe the elector can see through it all

  • saffrin

    Typical BBC bias.

  • Blakenburg

    Nothing changes ! There are those on here who keep supporting the establishment parties that has done nothing for the good of this nation for the last few decades, and there are others who want to see a new approach, new beginning for the best interest of the country and its people. I know which camp I WANT TO BE IN !

  • Rallan

    The 2010 UKIP manifesto was silly and everyone acknowledges that. But UKIP has changed completely since 2010. It’s got a change/return of leader, many thousands of new members, millions of new supporters, a much bigger presence, greatly improved electoral results and much wider ambitions.

    Basically, UKIP is undergoing a complete reboot. Attacking the previous version of UKIP simply emphasises how successful the rebooted UKIP is by comparison.

    • MirthaTidville

      what UKIP is doing, is successfully forcing items up the political agenda and forcing LIBLABCON to react. That is what they hate.

    • Chris lancashire

      So that’s OK then.

      • Rallan

        Yes, it is. Really.

        • Chris lancashire

          Yep, that figures. If it had been Cameron, Miliband or Clegg that had just junked a manifesto 36 short months old, said “not me guv” and “rebooted” (ho ho) scorn would have been poured. But as it’s good old Nige we’ll all believe him. Not.

          • Rallan

            The Labour Party has been established for a century. The Tories have been established for three centuries. Even so, Ed Miliband disowned their 2010 manifesto and has a blank piece of paper for his policies. Meantime David Cameron and Nick Clegg hide behind each other and simply disregard their 2010 manifestos.

            UKIP is a party of just 20 years old, and since 2010 it has been drastically evolving in response to the the public mood. It is not just OK that UKIP has disowned its 2010 manifesto, it’s an absolute necessity in order for us to become the political force that this country needs.

            • Chris lancashire

              Welcome to fantasy land.

              • Rallan

                Take a look at the polls. Take a look at public perceptions of the parties and their leaders. Take an objective look at the governance of this country during the last half century. Take a hard look at our current political masters.

                This country wants a change.

                • Chris lancashire

                  I have, UKIP are polling a very creditable 10-11 percent which, with an outsize stroke of luck might get them 1 MP in 2015. Possibly 2 if everything falls the right way. That’s twice as many as the Greens. And about the same influence as Miliband ditches any referendum and gives us a command and control economy.

                • Rallan

                  Now who’s in fantasy land? Polls vary, and you’ve quoted the bottom end of the range. All polls, even the favourable ones, have underestimated UKIPs actual election results. The polls simply don’t know how to cope with a 4th party.

                  Whatever. None so blind as will not see. Keep your head in the sand and pretend it’s not happening. If you wish really hard maybe eveyone will fall back in love with LibLabCon and UKIP will just go away.

                • Chris lancashire

                  OK, how many MPs do you think UKIP will get in 2015?

                • Rallan

                  I don’t know and neither do you. But I’ll bet you “reckon” something*, eh?

                  We could swap our ill informed “reckons”, which are far-forecasts based on dubious/conflicting data and partisan perspectives in a complex changing environment. We could then pretend to be really confident of our “reckons”, and argue about which one of us is talking less made up crap. But what’s the point?

                  But UKIP is a new player with substantial support and is gaining ground against a unpopular political establishment. It looks probable that UKIP will do very well at the EU Elections. Beyond that I expect we’ll make good progress and the current trend supports my expectation. None of this can be disputed.

                  [* Hat Tip to Mitchell & Webb for the “reckon” thing.]

            • HookesLaw

              The tories are not disregarding 2010 manifesto they are implementing it.
              Fantasy land does not even begin to describe the planet you are living on.

              • Smithersjones2013

                You mean the Tories are implementing a few bits of it that uncle Nicky has said they could implement.

                Fantasy land does not even begin to describe the planet you are living on.

                But it does the one you live on.

          • Smithersjones2013

            That is pretty much exactly what Cameron did within 6 months of taking over from Howard, unless I missed Howard, installing windmills, disowning Grammar Schools, hugging hoodies and mushing huskies and he has continued junking it ever since (even though he wrote some of it).

            Typical Tory donkey utterly clueless about what their leaders up to! Shish!

            • Chris lancashire

              I always think crude insults are a poor substitute for reasoned discussion. As for sticking to things, Cameron, aided by the excellent Osborne have done pretty well. Which is why the country is enjoying such a strong recovery.

              • HookesLaw

                I see you did not get a number.
                But you will not get any sense out of sad ignorant loony right wing extremist nut jobs.
                I despise people who want to split the right wing vote and let in a Eutrrophile left wing govt led by a crypto marxist.

                • the viceroy’s gin

                  It’s amusing how you jabber about the “right wing vote”, lad, socialist that you are.

                • Smithersjones2013

                  Well you must despise yourself then Hooky? You are the best repellant to the Tory Party I know. The original ‘Toxic Tory’.

                • the viceroy’s gin

                  Yes, this troll has to be in Farage’s employ. It’s the only possible explanation.

                  And Telemucus works for Call Me Dave, obviously, to fire up the Camerloon vote.

              • Smithersjones2013

                I always think

                In my experience you never do. Even Hooky does better than you do. As for sticking to things lets see. The EU policy has u-turned all over the place,The most notable being Cameron denounciation of a referendum bill followed by the tacit support of a referendum bill. Of course back in the day there was the climb down on Grammar School expansions followed by its reversal by Gove which will come back to bite Tories in Kent.Then there was minimum pricing of alcohol, the no plans to raise VAT, and this lot all from before May 2012:

                http://www.theguardian.com/politics/2012/may/31/coalition-u-turns-full-list

                I’d hate to think what you’d consider to be a poor performance.

                It always makes me laugh how politicians take the credit for everything that goes right in the economy but always blame someone else (banks, tax avoiders, voters and even the public sector) when things go bad. Perhaps if they gave the credit to those due it when the economy is improving (all the millions of hard working people who actually create the wealth in this country) they might not be viewed with such contempt.

                • Chris lancashire

                  As before.Q.E.D.

                • Smithersjones2013

                  What have you proved? That you can type three letter acronyms?

                  Telling us what you ‘think’ is not proof of anything but failing to address the substantive arguments against your assertions certainly tells people something……..

          • HookesLaw

            Come off it Saint Nigel sh!ts gold bricks…

  • MichtyMe

    A Party only needs policies if it is a contender for Government and then should vague on detail, left to the last moment and capable of a future fudge. Mountains of policy just provide a quarry for opponents to mine for ammunition as naive Ukip are discovering. Protest parties only require to make the right sort of noises to attract a vote, they attack, they give out some aspirations.

    • HookesLaw

      Protest parties can say one thing in Canterbury and another thing in Cleveland. Thats what UKIP are doing. UKIP bang on about defence but are happy to insult our NATO allies and are casual about our fundamental strategic defence and moreover our ability and credibility to have any say at the worlds strategic conference tables.

      Policies – UKIPs policies are what Farage decides them to be when he gets up of a morning.

      • Wessex Man

        If it were true it would still be better that the EU Commissioners deciding our fate but you know it’s not true you little fibber you.

      • Rallan

        What makes UKIP different are it’s aspirations. It’s not a party of ideology and “principled opposition”. UKIP want’s to make a difference right now. So it’s is changing at breakneck speed to become a credible political party, and will use selected “ready-made” policies to produce a strong manifesto. You can expect to see a range of solid policies before 2015.

        • 2trueblue

          Yep and so does the fellow in the local pub, and he has got as much chance of making the next government as UKIP have.

          • Rallan

            True enough. No one expects UKIP to be in government, not even in coallition, after 2015 GE. But that’s not the point. The intention is to become a serious and undisputed political party. Come 2020 I hope that UKIP will be a party ready for government.

      • saffrin

        I’ll be voting UKIP whatever our bias media report.
        The facts are, UKIP is anti open door immigration, anti EU dictatorship and as all the LibLabCon artist are pro, it leaves most of the people nowhere else to go but UKIP.
        Expect a UKIP landslide May 2015. Like it or not, the Houses of Parliament as it stands today does not represent the mood of the nation or it’s people.

        • 2trueblue

          And can you translate that into the number MPs they will have? And what difference they will make them? You will still have a Liebore government and be bound ever tighter within the EU. You might even get the euro.

          • the viceroy’s gin

            …perhaps you Camerluvvies shouldn’t split the UKIP vote, then.

          • saffrin

            UKIP will win a landslide.

        • Chris lancashire

          Good luck with that.

          • saffrin

            Luck doesn’t come into it. The opposition have ignored the voice of the people for too long for there to be any credential alternative.

            • Chris lancashire

              A landslide? Are you sure? You’re beginning to make Telemachus look sane.

      • Lord_of_Orange

        Just because we have allies doesn’t mean we shouldn’t be sceptical about the foreign policy of the US for example. Britain was sceptical of the Vietnam adventure and thank heavens – just as we were sceptical of the Syrian Civil War and thankfully kept out of that.

        Being strong on defence doesn’t mean having to be trigger happy.

      • Smithersjones2013

        Whereas Dave needs George, Nick and Danny to tell him what his policies are……..

  • Count Dooku

    To be fair the non-circular Circle Line is a major pain when getting home from Baker Street.
    Vote UKIP!

  • HookesLaw

    Reggie Perrins brother in law just about sums up UKIP.
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oJ-9R6NCZ0A

    Presumably since, as we all know, deeply comforting rays of sunshine eminate from Farage’s backside the typical kipper does not mind being told what to think from one week to the next.

    • Wessex Man

      You rude crude child you!

    • Two Bob

      No wonder the Tories are set to lose in 2015 with people like you on board.

    • Smithersjones2013

      Meanwhile Tories compete for their politician of the year prize:

      http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TSqkdcT25ss

    • ButcombeMan

      Telling voters they had to re define marriage without putting it in the manifesto, was not an honourable thing for Cameron to do. Was that telling supporters what to think?
      As for Kippers being told what to think, that is the absolute opposite of what is possible.
      Most Kippers have an independence of mind which is missing in LabCon
      It is what puts them there.

  • Shinsei1967

    A compulsory dress code for taxi drivers ? What a staggeringly un-British policy. The Great British Cabbie has been able to wear what he likes since the days of (not) driving Alfred the Great south of the river after 10pm.

    Imagine UKIP’s reaction if the EU had suggested such a proposal.

    • Wessex Man

      get back to 1967!

    • ButcombeMan

      There might well be some advantages to both public & cabbies so it is worth discussion.

      Smartness and professionalism worked for Eddie Stobart trucks.

      • Doggie Roussel

        I thought Eddie was having financial problems

        • ButcombeMan

          Everyone is now, especially in that industry,undercut by continental cheap fuel.
          Stobart grew big by being smarter and better.

  • John Moss

    They also pledged to cut one third off the NHS budget, one third off the school budget, 40% of adult social care and 75% of spending on industry agriculture and employment training.

    • Redrose82

      Not true.

      • HookesLaw

        As ever with UKIP policy its based on an it’ll be all right on the night philosophy.

        • saffrin

          LibLabCon = ignore the UK’s populations concerns, comply with every Brussels diktat, aid USA’s foreign policy to the death, albeit not the politicians that demand it.

          • HookesLaw

            Isolationism then? Thats a clever idea. if out of the EU we would still have to abide by EU single market rules to be in the single market. The EU single market give the UK billions worth of inward investment. The UK is the top destination for inward investment. UK won 697 projects in 2012 creating 30,300 jobs. (source – The FT)
            ‘Wayne Zhu, chief executive of Bosideng UK, the Chinese fashion retailer
            that opened a London store last year, said: “Like us, a lot of other
            Chinese firms choose the UK as a base to address Europe as a
            whole . . . If the UK withdrew [from the EU], those investors might think again.” ‘

            UKIPs policy would lead Britain off into a corner where we could sulk.
            But do not worry – I do not expect to convince you. You are too thick. But others might just want to ponder on the wisdom of you dumb notions.

            • Lord_of_Orange

              The very same firms, mainly car companies, said exactly the same when the debate took place in the year 2000 over our membership of the Euro currency.

              If we didn’t join the Euro we would isolate ourselves, they warned. It was all complete horse****. Ford for example just came out and threatened a rethink of it’s UK operations if the UK left the EU, yet only last year Ford move it’s van operations from the UK (an EU member state) to the Republic of Turkey (a non-EU country).

              The same with Sir Richard Branson who goes on about how we MUST stay in the EU yet has now moved his company offshore to a non-EU country. Hypocrites, the lot of them.

              Corporations love the EU for one reason and one reason only: lobbying. It’s easier for them to bribe and lobby one parliament than it is 28 parliaments.

            • saffrin

              Buy British.

            • Smithersjones2013

              You really are a timid spineless gullible soul aren’t you? Every time some organisation’s head comes out with some drivel about walking away you believe it and capitulate?

              No wonder the Tories are so crap at politics!

        • Smithersjones2013

          Whereas Tory policy is based on a philosophy of failure on the night is it?

          Yep another good one Hooky. Go with that one in the election. I’m sure it will impress voters!

          PS In hindsight perhaps when it comes to the Tories it should be based on a philosophy of failure on the night.

  • @PhilKean1

    .
    I will go back on my commitment to support UKIP in 2014 and 2015 –

    – if what the man sitting next to me on the train told me is correct, that – in their 2015 manifesto – they intend to include a commitment to make all males wear their underpants on the outside of their trousers.

    Other than that, and if Cameron continues along his disastrous path, UKIP can very much count on my vote.
    .

    • Kitty MLB

      Phil, as the night is long, you can be sure that Cameron will continue on his
      disastrous path
      that will lead to electoral oblivion- they could have dome so much
      yet have achieved so little.
      I honestly believe if Thatcher was our leader now, that she would have
      taken this country and the EU by the scruff of the neck years ago,
      and considering we are told our fragile economy is recovering, she
      most certainly would not allow the EU and all its laws to put that at risk.
      We would have a referendum at the end of this parliament if she were around.

      • Lord_of_Orange

        But Thatcher could never have done such a thing as leader of the avidly pro-EU and anti-sovereignty Conservative Party.

        It’s no surprise that she was advising then-UKIP leader Lord Pearson prior to the 2010 General Election.

        • Kitty MLB

          The treacherous predecessor ‘s to the Camservative party
          threw her out and every single true Tory is aware of their mistake- well I hope they are.

      • MichtyMe

        The Thatcher I remember whacked the anti EU Foot & Benn with their 83 Out Manifesto then legislated the Single European Act.

        • McClane

          That was then. This is now. Big difference.

          • Kitty MLB

            Indeed.
            Being able to look into the future would be an excellent idea!
            Thatcher would not recognise the EU and indeed this country as it is today and its how todays politicians deal with the consequences that matters and Cameron is making an absolute mess of things.

      • HookesLaw

        And there are fairies at the end of your garden.
        But under this tory party we will have a referendum and you can vote in 2017. All the actions of UKIP are designed to bring into power a europhile Labour govt.
        As for just voting for UKIP in the EU elections – how many UKIP MEPs are left from last time?

        • Lord_of_Orange

          There isn’t going to be an in/out referendum in 2017 even if the Tories wanted one – which they don’t really, hence why the vast majority of the parliamentary party voted against an in/out referendum back in 2011.

          The reason why there isn’t going to be a referendum is, as Richard North has explained over on EUreferendum.com, that there is going to be a new European Treaty in the making at that time which will be completed around the 2018/2019 period. Merkel has already begun pushing for it, and federalist groups are working on proposals as we speak.

          The fact is that the EU isn’t going to be interested in Cameron’s pathetic renegotiation attempts because they’re going to be busy with proposals for a new treaty. And even if they weren’t busy with a new treaty, they still wouldn’t be interested in renegotiation as there is no such thing in EU law. The EU operates under ‘ever closer Union’ – read the treaties, it’s very clear cut how it works.

          • HookesLaw

            Your link comprising many stories does not seem to make any sense compared to your statement
            But it does not matter what the EU think – we will get a referendum under the tories and you can vote.on it.

            You will not get a vote under Labour.
            But the tories have passed legislation already which would trigger a referendum to ratify any new treaty. We can presume labour in power would repeal that bill. Brown signed Lisbon without a referendum.

            • Smithersjones2013

              But the tories have passed legislation already which would trigger a referendum to ratify any new treaty.

              Not so

              1) The treaty must transfer further powers to (from?) the EU

              2) The Foreign Secretary has to deem it appropriate to hold a referendum.

              Therefore it will not apply to “Any New Treaty” but as ever those that the Government cherry pick to have a referendum on which since 1975 is none.

              Miliband need not repeal anything. In any case it is highly questionable whether there will be any treaty to approve given that they could well use Article 352 of the Lisbon Treaty (the enabling clause) to waive any desired changes through on the fly. After all they wouldn’t want the UK upsetting the applecart with a no vote now would they?

        • McClane

          You are rapidly beginning to sound like telemachus

        • Kitty MLB

          They are fairies are they?
          Good God, I thought we only had tree sprites at the bottom
          of our garden.
          What do you have at the bottom of yours,
          La La Land.

        • Chris lancashire

          Sadly, wasting your time with the oldsters here. Red meat has been thrown, ravening wolves are devouring it.
          And when PM Miliband takes office in 2015 it’ll be “that taught Cameron a lesson”. Wonder what they’ll say in 2016 as the Miliband-Hollande axis takes us deeper into EU integration?

          • Smithersjones2013

            UKIP’s finest ally in its efforts to withdraw from the EU (no not Ken Clarke or even Hague and Cameron) is the EU itself and the more it dictates to this country, the more it will demonstrate to the people how they have been betrayed by the establishment parties and how truly impotent and worthless those parties are.

            PS And the idea that Hollande will survive after April 2017 is risible. So your so called ‘axis ‘ain’t going to last very long.

          • the viceroy’s gin

            Actually, Hollande is finding out that many French aren’t any more fond of the EUSSR than UKIP, lad.

            But as you’re so concerned with the Millipedes, perhaps you should consider not splitting the UKIP vote .

            • Chris lancashire

              That’s about the tenth time we’ve had the old saw about the UKIP vote splitting on this thread alone. I note your repartee hasn’t improved.
              Aren’t you up late for an oldster?

              • the viceroy’s gin

                …what old saw, lad? You socialist Camerluvvies are the ones squealing in pain over the threat of your Millipedal soulmates, so apparently you need reminding that you yourself can do something to resolve your pain, by not splitting the UKIP vote.

              • Smithersjones2013

                Aren’t you up late for an oldster?

                It can’t be that late if your mummy hasn’t tucked you up nice and snug……….

          • saffrin

            You yonkers are too young to remember it was Miliband’s lot that wrecked this country in the first place. However, seeing as they dumbed down your education to the bare minimum, we can all be thankful I guess you are able to write your own name.
            Stay out of things you clearly fail to understand sunny.
            Tebby still needs a cuddle remember.

            • Chris lancashire

              OK dad.

              • saffrin

                OK then, now go and play outside in the fresh air.

                • Chris lancashire

                  Speaking of playing, just re-read your previous comment to me – it’s the level of playground insults. I do try hard to be as courteous and factual as I can on this forum which I believe is for the grown up exchange of political views and ideas. If you descend to insults then at least try and make them witty or interesting. Childish as your insults are I have to grant you they are one step up from your two infantile mates on this thread.

                • saffrin

                  Just re-read your previous comment to others. If you think they are courteous or factual, your dumbed down education also failed to include an introduce to the Oxford Dictionary.

                • Chris lancashire

                  Remember- witty or interesting.

                • the viceroy’s gin

                  …and you Camerluvvies are none of that, lad.

      • @PhilKean1

        .
        http://blogs.telegraph.co.uk/news/pollingobservatory/100256123/the-tories-are-edging-closer-to-defeat/

        You are right, Kitty.

        Cameron still thinks there’s a magic poll bounce to be had if the economy picks up.

        Times have changed. This is the first election where a high number of voters are refusing to be taken for mugs.
        .

        • Kitty MLB

          Indeed Phil, that is quite correct.
          The electorate when Thatcher took over , had hope again,
          they knew a Conservative Party would correct the mess left by Labour. They must have believed this again and had hope when
          Cameron was spouting that he was the ‘ Heir to Thatcher’.
          he actually said that for a while.
          Scaremongering about Labour and insulting UKIP,
          will not work especially when their is no trust and respect.

        • Kitty MLB

          Sorry a correction- there and not their.

    • Hexhamgeezer

      If it meant getting rid of LibLabCon,m displaying my boxers would be a small price to pay.

  • A_Libertarian_Rebel

    “…the challenges they face to produce a credible, consistent manifesto…”

    Strange. I don’t remember anything in the Conservative 2010 manifesto about jumping into bed with the risibly mis-named “Liberal” “Democrats” in the event of a hung Parliament, and without giving the Parliamentary Party a vote on it.

    Or about taking up Parliamentary time to re-define marriage – irrespective of one’s individual views on the rights or wrongs of any such re-definition.

    Or about legislating to enable the first State control of a free press in 300 years.

    Hmmm: tricky things, manifestos, aren’t they?

    • the viceroy’s gin

      Well said.

      The Speccie teenager has his orders, no doubt, to put out this hit, but it’s quite hypocritical.

      • telemachus

        It becomes important not only to see what Farage stands for but to demonstrate that he is a bag of wind piss that has no clue about what goes on in his own party
        *
        We know all the history of bongo bongo racialism followed by sl*tty misogyny and more recently homophobic divine global warming
        *
        When the going got tough he disowned these folk as well
        *
        Next we will read that he has changed his mind and from his base in the European parliament he will make a bid for British leadership of Federal Europe
        *
        But only if they reintroduce smoking in pubs

        • the viceroy’s gin

          Is there some particular reason you plastered your blather after my post, lad?

          • telemachus

            Yes son
            It is important to trumpet the vapidity of Farage from the top

            • the viceroy’s gin

              Do you think anybody is listening to an idiot like you, really?

              • telemachus

                People are hungry for the truth

                • the viceroy’s gin

                  Maybe, but are they really hungry for an idiot like you?

                • telemachus

                  Let’s get back to Farage
                  For some reason 12% of folk seem to want to vote for an idiot like him
                  The true idiocy being exemplified by the Neil interview

                • the viceroy’s gin

                  No, let’s get back to you being an idiot, and to whether anybody is listening to an idiot like you.

                • Nicholas chuzzlewit

                  I can confirm that he is an insufferable idiot.

                • the viceroy’s gin

                  I still think he’s a Cameroon plant, to roust the tribalists.

                • Nicholas chuzzlewit

                  No he is leftist scum.

                • the viceroy’s gin

                  …maybe, but that doesn’t preclude him being a Cameroon plant, you know.

                • telemachus

                  More and more are not just listening but hearing
                  Whoever the messenger the message will be heard

                • the viceroy’s gin

                  No, people discriminate based upon the messenger. For example, they might not choose to listen to idiots… like you for example.

                • Nicholas chuzzlewit

                  Listen to the Viceroy. You have absolutely no credibility whatsoever on this site and I suspect that nobody has any interest in what you say beyond the amusement offered by the complete absurdity of your comments. More likely, most contributors feel that you pollute every thread you enter. I suspect everybody realises that you are merely a dissembler for Labour the most dishonest, uncaring and incompetent party in the UK.

                • telemachus

                  And the party that will rule in 16 short months

                • Nicholas chuzzlewit

                  Rule being the operative word for the party of dictatorial left wing excrement.

                • Nicholas chuzzlewit

                  No point in talking to you then.

                • telemachus

                  We welcome this Election; it gives us, at last, the chance to end eight years of Tory rule. In a television chat with President Eisenhower, Mr. Macmillan told us that the old division of Britain into the two nations, the Haves and the Have Nots, has disappeared. Tory prosperity, he suggested, is shared by all. In fact, the contrast between the extremes of wealth and poverty is sharper today than eight years ago. The business man with a tax-free expense account, the speculator with tax-free capital gains, and the retiring company director with a tax-free redundancy payment due to a take-over bid-these people have indeed ‘never had it so good’.

                  It is not so good for the widowed mother with children, the chronic sick, the 400,000 unemployed, and the millions of old age pensioners who have no adequate superannuation. While many of those at work have been able to maintain and even improve their standard of living by collective bargaining, the sick, the disabled and the old have continually seen the value of state benefits and small savings whittled away by rising prices. Instead of recognising this problem as the greatest social challenge of our time, the Prime Minister blandly denies it exists.

                • Nicholas chuzzlewit

                  More plagiarism from a shameless leftist troll.

                • telemachus

                  Not plagiarism
                  The 1959 manifesto
                  The Truth then
                  The Truth now

                • sfin

                  A better argument than your previous insults and vulgarisms to the viceroy…

                  …”haves and have nots” will always be with us – the term is entirely relative. Recent reports put the definition of “child poverty” as any child who doesn’t have his or her own bedroom – so as a former public schoolboy, I spent my entire childhood in “poverty” – who do I sue?!

                  You don’t increase your wealth by collective bargaining. It achieves two things:

                  It reduces the wealth of those, whose enterprise and initiative creates wealth for others and it ties us all into common thought and action – without freedom of individual expression – that, to me, is a fundamental evil.

                  The diminished value of savings can be laid directly at the door of your hero – a certain Mr G.Brown whose whole economic strategy was based on super cheap credit. We, rightly, are grateful to the wartime generation for creating our easier lifestyle – our children’s generation will not be thanking us for the same.

                • telemachus

                  I think my point cribbed from a former manifesto is that we must not crow about economic improvement to the point of forgetting those who fall through society’s cracks

                • Pip

                  They wont learn the truth from the likes of you that’s for certain, people like you are why we find ourselves in such a mess, you are in fact part of the problem, your ilk had your chance and completely cocked it up, now is the time for a complete change.

            • Colonel Mustard

              The vapidity you are trumpeting is not that of Farage but rather your own.

              But the arrogance of suggesting that your comment is more important than others tells us all we need to know about you, the Labour party and the type of people that support it.

              • telemachus

                I have just listened to a party political broadcast on behalf of Farage for Wythenshawe on the Today Program
                I find it very sad that our major broadcaster should trumpet the party of this vapid man
                Can you just imagine if he had any imput into our policy on Syria, on Egypt, on Burma or our relations with Obama
                And how would he deal with for example the Tottenham riots
                How would he look at health regulation
                How would he deal with the crisis in sink schools
                I may detest the policies and outlook of Gove and Hunt but I would give them life tenure of office before letting Farage or his fruitcakes getting anywhere near the levers of power

    • sfin

      Bravo! I also seem to recall a certain “cast iron pledge” for a referendum on the Lisbon treaty.

      • 2trueblue

        Prior to Brown scuttling off to sign it. Difficult for Cameron to sort it if Brown was determined. Also Darling scuttled off to give more of our money to the EU. Considering we are not part of the euro why?

        • sfin

          The point being – that when he made that “pledge” he knew damn well that it couldn’t possibly take place once it had been signed. Commentators like to call it ‘politicking’ – a good example of it can be found in one of Blair’s responses to the Chilcot inquiry: When challenged as to why he told parliament that the intelligence for justifying war with Iraq was ‘detailed, extensive and authoritative’ when the actual intelligence was qualified as ‘patchy and sporadic’, he replied “I was being political.”(oh well, that’s all right then!)
          Another example can be found in the latest pledge on an in/out referendum in 2017 (providing the ‘conservatives’ have a majority). The referendum will be based on a “renegotiation of our membership” – an impossibility under current EU rules – and, if I know that, Cameron certainly does.
          Like I said, commentators call it politicking, I call it what it is – Lying – and if commentators are picking over a four year old UKIP manifesto, then I rejoice – they are all, quite rightly terrified!

          • telemachus

            I detect a difference between “spinning” and a total repudiation of a manifesto
            What we saw on Neil was a one man band with one policy
            And of course his fruitcake disciples

            • David Kay

              just like Labour putting it in their manifesto that they were opposed to tuition fees and had legislated against it, then introduced tuition fees once they were re elected. Lying socialist scumbags

              • telemachus

                Circumstances change

                • David Kay

                  indeed they do, thats why theres hope for you telemachus, to renounce the evil socialist ideology of the likes of marx, lenin stalin, mao, pol pot, miliband and hitler and embrace the ideology of farage and vote UKIP

                • Pip

                  Most disgraceful comment on the thread.

                • Nicholas chuzzlewit

                  Labour doesn’t it is the party of lies, lying and liars.

            • Nicholas chuzzlewit

              A Labour troll calling supporters of another party fruit cakes now that is hilarious. You could give Mr Kipling another 10 factories and he couldn’t produce enough fruit cakes to represent the utter madness of the Labour Party and it’s idiot supporters.

    • Smithersjones2013

      Indeed and of course George Osborne never had any plans to raise VAT and the Libdems were touting VAT bombshell posters about the place. Of course the Libdems were in favour of an in-out referendum as well (not to mention their tuition fees pledge). Seems both sides of the Coalition have their own problems with sticking with their manifestos.

      People in burnt out glass houses shouldn’t throw stones.

    • Chris

      The author is arrogant.

      Please keep talking down to us. It will makes us step back in line like good little boys and girls.

      Honest.

    • HookesLaw

      rUBBISH – WE NHAD AN ELKEF[=CTION AND BECAUSE KIPPER VOTES IN KEY SEATS SPLIT THE RIGHT WING VOTE WE

      • Smithersjones2013

        Oooh arent you getting touchy tonight! No need to shout.

        You are talking complete nonsense as ever.because your extremely arrogant assumption in each case is if those who voted UKIP hadn’t voted UKIP they would have voted for the Tories when poll after poll all suggest that the vast majority would do no such thing.

        When are you going to face up to the reality that you cannot win a majority because you are too unpopular and lack what it takes to beat Labour decisively.

        • HookesLaw

          Caps lock on – stuff happens. The lowercase truth is still valid.
          20 seats where kipper votes cost the result. You want a Labour victory. You want to defeat the tories. Miliband is your ally.

          • the viceroy’s gin

            No, the socialist LibLabCon clones are your allies, lad.

            • HookesLaw

              Hows the grand wizard sonny?
              Had trouble keeping the cross in flames in all the wet – sonny?

              • the viceroy’s gin

                …is that some Camerloonian code you socialists use, lad?

                • Wessex Man

                  Hooky like most of the Tories I know once he’s lost the argument descends into insults and childish name calling. It’s not clever and it’s not pretty but bless it keeps him happy.

          • Smithersjones2013

            No its not valid because it is predicated on the arrogant assumption that those votes would otherwise have gone to the Tories and you cannot for the life of you prove that.would have been the case. Even if they stayed at home instead of voting UKIP the Tories would have still lost. Why don’t you blame the 35% of the electorate who didn’t vote. There are an awful lot more of them than there were UKIP voters in 2010.

            Frankly this continual childish Tory repetition of this ‘vote UKIP get Labour mantra’ is all rather bitter and twisted paranoid schizophrenia if you ask me and is just a rather pathetic excuse for the enormous inadequacies of the contemporary Tory Party.

            Basically you Tories are no longer up to the job at hand and in such circumstances why would people vote for that? Be a man for once in your life. Face up to it. The Tories are just not good enough

    • Ben Kelly

      The Conservative manifesto included cast iron guarantees that were soon discarded, so yes, tricky indeed!

      • HookesLaw

        No you are wrong again. Another thicko who can only tell lies to justify his stupidity and ignorance.

        • Wessex Man

          oh so rich!

        • Ben Kelly

          “Thicko”, i’m sorry, are we on a playground here?

    • HookesLaw

      Rubbish. We had an election. No overall majority. So the largest party would still have had to cut deals to get things done. So in other words unable to carry out its manifesto. As it is we will have had 5 years of sane policies from a conservative chancellor. 5 years of policies as outlined in manifesto on health local govt education crime. etc.
      5 years were we will have had massive job losses in central and local govt. As per manifesto
      You are totally thick and living on another planet.

      Ah – I see – Mr libertarian does not like gay marriage. Why are you so afraid of gays. You are obsessive about it. Funny how it all comes back to that. You and your little coterie of bigots.

      Libertarian? – Don’t make me laugh. You are happy to be a libertarian as long as everyone thinks like you.

      • sfin

        And that line of argument is beneath you.

        • the viceroy’s gin

          …nothing is beneath that socialist troll .

          • sfin

            Ooooh! a bit harsh my fellow combatant! – Hookey is a conservative, albeit to the left of thinking – he just doesn’t realise yet that his party no longer is (he is me, ten years ago). If you look at his posts on any subject but this – you find a balanced, common sense view. ‘Returning sinners’ are always welcome, I say. Posters like Hookey can bring some balance to our argument – better to convert than condemn.

            • the viceroy’s gin

              No, there is no converting socialists, and no, this troll is not a conservative, or anything even close to it. He’s a socialist, same as any other Cameluvvie. Sorry, but we’ll have to agree to disagree here.

    • helicoil

      Didn’t the liblabcon remove all their old policies from their websites a few weeks ago?

  • Lord_of_Orange

    More desperate Tory attacks on UKIP. Why don’t the Tories try standing up for national sovereignty, controlled immigration, grammar schools and a sensible immigration policy instead of attacking other parties?

    The Tories have to attack UKIP because the Tories are devoid of a belief in anything other than – as Peter Hitchens has pointed out – the need to obtain office. But what is the point in seeking office if stand for nothing? And that’s the problem the Tories have and always have had.

    My vote is firmly with UKIP. Rate my comment up if you are the same.

    • HookesLaw

      UKIPs policy on grammar schools (ie not to have grammar schools as such but pretend they do; not to have an 11 plus but well just have some sort of woolly cuddly test)) is typical waffle. Or was that just a manifesto notion?

      • Wessex Man

        When it comes to the world of pretend Hooky your glorious party exceeds all others apart from you most loyal camp following Lib/Dums. The tame hacks on the BBC and the UKip hating Tory who reported this, here do nothing to shake ayone’s belief that government is not safe left in Call me Dave hands.

        Get used to it you don’t fool anyone!

        • Lord_of_Orange

          You have to feel sorry for the likes of HookesLaw though.

          For years they and CCHQ have thought that they automatically had the patriotic vote in the bag because there was nobody else to go and vote for. But now? It’s finally dawning on them that the Tory Party can no longer command a parliamentary majority as it withers away across Scotland, Wales and the North of England … meanwhile in the East in both the north and south, UKIP are threatening previously safe blue seats.

          Why is this? Because the Tories have proved themselves utterly useless in that they stand for nothing other than ‘keeping Labour out’.

        • HookesLaw

          the pretence comes from UKIP who pretend that being out of the EU would be terribly different from being in.

          • Lord_of_Orange

            Oh not at all. Making the most of our post-EU future will very much depend on the removal of either the Conservative Prrty or Labour Party from Government/Opposition and them being replaced with proper adversarial, patriotic parties on both left and the right.

            In other words, the grey slime we have at the moment needs to be washed away – starting with the useless Conservative Party.

            • southerner

              Absolutely right your Lordship. Waste of time telling Hookey though. He is a pretend conservative who wants to retain the left liberal status quo (hence continues to campaign for Cameron and the other social democrats).

              • ButcombeMan

                I have watched Hookey for months, rather like Cameron,he is not recognisably a Conservative.

                • southerner

                  Quite right.

                • Wessex Man

                  what on earth are you wasting your time watching Cameron’s foot slogger for?

            • Holly

              Good luck with that.

            • HookesLaw

              Ah … you sad jerk.

          • fubarroso

            It would be very different even if we rejoined EFTA/EEA as a trading partner. We would be out of CAP and CFP for a start and we would not be heading toward political union.

            Also there is no requirement by EFTA/EEA to be members of ECHR so we could tell them when they are overstepping their authority.

            • HookesLaw

              Being in EEA/EFTA (3 countries not in the EU?) would still mean being in the single market and paying into EU regional funds. just not having any say in the rules.
              CAP? We would still be subsidising our own farmers.

              • Lord_of_Orange

                Indeed, that’s why I prefer the Swiss option of a simple Free Trade Agreement (FTA) being concluded.

                But if the Norway option of leaving the EU but remaining in the Single Market is a temporary solution that leads at least to our withdrawal, then i’m prepared to go with that.

              • sfin

                When we were 1 of 9, I might have said that “having any say” had some relevance. Now that we are 1 of 28 with qualified majority voting – I would say it is entirely irrelevant. Our ‘influence’ diminishes with every treaty passed and with every new member admitted – loss of sovereignty was always too high a price for any trade deal.

              • Hexhamgeezer

                ….and if we subsidise them it will be because WE choose to.

              • fubarroso

                ..just not having any say in the rules.

                That tired old argument! You know perfectly well that most trade related regulations originate in superior bodies to the EU. You also know, but will not acknowledge, that Norway has a seat around the table of those bodies while the UK does not. Our place is taken by EU apparatchiks that will not necessarily be batting in the UK’s interest.

                Subsidising our own farmers as opposed to French farmers you mean?

            • HookesLaw

              We invented the ECHR we were in it before the EU. We are one of the countries charged with making it work.

              The EU is not going to disappear because we are not in it and we would have to deal with it still even if out. But why are you so upset? There will be a referendum in under the tories in 2017 but you want to put in power a party that will not give you one. Under labour we will end up in a political union but you want to split the right wing vote that will keep us out of one.
              How thick mis that?

              The end result of a 2017 vote is we may end up as an EEA type associate member or some such. But I am not fooled like you. it will be little different from now. There is no upside economically only a potential downside.

              • fubarroso

                We invented it but we have had no control over what has happened to it since. It uses a system of law that is completely alien to the UK and has gone completely out of control interpreting law to favour the perpetrators rather than the victims.

      • Lord_of_Orange

        It’s pretty simple actually. The grammar school system would be brought back but the difference would be that the 11+ examination would be styled more alike the German grammar system whereby it’s more flexible and not set in stone where a child ends up. For example, if little Johnny isn’t academically gifted at age 11 …. but improves (as many kids do) by age 14, he’d be shifted to a grammar school.

        So nice try, but you lose.

        • HookesLaw

          So they do not propose a return to grammar schools then?

          • Lord_of_Orange

            They do. But under a more flexible, German style system.

            Think (and read) before you post.

          • fubarroso

            The crucial point is the UKIP propose a return to selection albeit a more flexible one to allow for late developers. Is that so hard to understand?

            • HookesLaw

              Is it so hard to understand that it is practically impossible. Where are the secondary schools to match the grammar schools. Where are the technical schools?
              What is needed are good schools. The tory education policy with free schools has by passed to knee jerk kipper reactions.
              UKIP education policy insofar as they had thought seriously about it was just waffle.

              ‘Return to selction’ – is that a vote winner for a national mass appeal party?

              • fubarroso

                Permitting the building of new grammar schools whilst leaving the present comprehensive structure in place would seem like a sensible way of going about things. A means by which comprehensive school high achievers could transfer to grammar schools would make the system more flexible. In my school days (50/60s) there were both comprehensive and grammar schools, but an 11+ failure barred you from entering the grammar school system.

              • fubarroso

                ‘Return to selction’ – is that a vote winner for a national mass appeal party?

                Yes because it gives bright kids from poor families the chance of a schooling that is at the right pace for their abilities whereas in a comprehensive school they are forced to learn at a slower pace.

        • McClane

          an 11+ followed by a 13+ for eligible 11+ fails was standard in all areas with grammar schools, until grammar schools were abolished. Not a German system, it’s an English system.

          • foxoles

            Correct. Interestingly, much of the German system post-war was based on ours (some regional variation exists). So people suggesting we follow the German system are actually recommending we go back to what we were doing, which worked.

      • ButcombeMan

        You again pervert what the position is, Farge made it very clear that schools with some form of selection are required to improve social mobility. He did imply they would not or might not be called by the old name.

        Nothing wrong with that, it ought to be Cameron’ s policy. It is a very sellable proposition to all except extreme Guardianistas.

        • HookesLaw

          ‘selection’ Thats a vote winner? lets see what education policy is next week shall we?
          Meantime tories are pursuing a policy that is aimed at forcing out bad schools and replacing them with good ones. UKIP want to return to a policy that branded voters children failures.

          • ButcombeMan

            You have been notably overexcited on this thread Hookey. Very sadly you feel the need to denigrate all opponents for their contrary views.

            Now get this, there is nothing very wrong with Tory efforts to improve education for all, I support Gove generally, but you make me sick with your false claim to being a Tory. Just like your flawed hero Cameron, you are no Tory.

            No true one nation Tory could be satisfied with an education system which preserves the best education only for the children of the wealthy and do that however high the potential of poorer young people.

            Frankly you disgust me.

          • Smithersjones2013

            Do you know something? There are 164 remaining grammar schools and almost all of them are in Tory constituencies.

            Why are Tories supporting ‘the branding of voters children failures’?

            You really are crap at this politics game aren’t you?

          • Michele Keighley

            Better that we recognise failures than ignore achievers. You amuse me, there is no rhyme or reason to some of your outlandish posts – it’s almost as if there are more than one of you. Tell me it ain’t so Hooky, tell me you are the one and only!!

      • Two Bob

        A grammar school came out best recently!

      • sfin

        UKIP are merely trying to address the, understandable, criticism of the old grammar system, namely deciding a child’s entire future, based on one exam taken at 11 years old.
        Personally, I think the French do it very well. A child enters “college” at 11 and undergoes, what is essentially a three year selection which will decide what type of “Lycée” he will attend at 14 (academic or technical). A child only has to show aptitude in one academic discipline ( a dyslexic might be good at maths for example) to be selected for an academic Lycée and he or she will receive rigorous academic training in the discipline, for which they show aptitude, with the goal of getting them to study it at university.
        Either way – our current “one size fits all” education policy is a disaster – and that used to be a conservative view. But like too many conservative views, it has been quietly shelved by the social democrat party which still calls itself ‘conservative’.
        Wake up Hookey! I see, from other posts that you are a naturally, conservative thinker – your party no longer is.

        • HookesLaw

          Free schools?

          • Smithersjones2013

            Except you are not free to chose a Grammar School. You can chose virtually any other sort of selective school but not a Grammar school? So much for ‘free’ schools..

          • sfin

            Which give “priority to founder’s children”. So much like the situation today with comprehensive education – a child’s education based on how wealthy his/her parents are…
            Look at the stats – the outflow from real grammar school education had every prime minister from Wilson to Major (Douglas-home – who wasn’t elected – excepting) educated at grammar schools. The outflow from Crossland’s vandalism has seen every prime minister (Gordon Brown – who wasn’t elected – excepting) educated at private schools.

    • Kitty MLB

      Excellent post.
      Just one gripe though, there is nothing remotely Tory about the mishmash
      disaster that is the Camservative Party.
      They attack UKIP and grassroots Conservatives ( other blog sites have also started doing this) because they utterly desperate, and devoid of any principles.
      Besmirching the characters of other parties as a way to manipulate and
      control are leftie lessons Cameron learnt from his idol Blair.

  • 2trueblue

    It sheds light on what actually UKIP really do believe in, which is where the light should be. So far it is unclear and is at the soundbite stage. Farage needs to get on with it as there is nothing solid to put forward yet.
    Being a protest vote is great to have at the local and EU elections but if his party is to gain traction rather that just provide a distraction at the general election then we are in trouble.
    The country is in too much trouble to be thrown off course and let Liebore back again. The Tories need to shut up fighting and provide a solid case for people to back them in 2015. Cameron is not going to go at this point but there must be others who can be given a real role and get back to the basics that we expect a Tory government to stand for.
    If the threat of UKIP being a distraction can get the Tories to get their act together and get the electorate then good. It is becoming more obvious that they are not ready yet for office.

    • Lord_of_Orange

      If Labour get in then what difference does it make? Either way under the LibLabCon we’ll end up with more debt, poor comprehensive schools, more EU and more immigration.

      The Tories are unreformable just like the EU. The only future the useless Tories face – having not won a General Election for more than 20 years now – is destruction. I hope UKIP do to the Tories what the Reform Party in Canada did in the 1990s when it destroyed and replaced the Progressive Conservative Party of Canada.

      • 2trueblue

        Well it depends on whether you want to kiss your future, your childrens future, and you grandchildrens future goodbye.

        • Lord_of_Orange

          I don’t. That’s why i’m voting UKIP.

          • HookesLaw

            We must hope that the numbers of people as terminally stupid as you is vanishingly small.

            • Lord_of_Orange

              It’s at 19% according to the latest national polls, with Local Results putting the figure in the mid-20’s.

              Meanwhile the number of tribal Tories like yourself continues to plummet as Tory membership begins to dip below 100k.

              They did it in Canada under FPTP – so can we.

              • the viceroy’s gin

                Yes, Canada is the model. The Camerloons are finished, much like Mulroney’s mob.

        • Smithersjones2013

          Every ex Tory voter could vote for Cameron in 2015 and it will make not one iota of difference. The key group are those 2010 Libdems who have shifted to Labour because they could not stand the thought of the Libdems co-operating with the Tories.

          How many times does this need to be highlighted before denialist Tories get it through their thick skulls? Cameron caused your defeat in 2010. End of story……

      • HookesLaw

        So can you shout out that a bit louder. Kippers do not care if Labour are returned to power?

        • Lord_of_Orange

          That’s absolutely spot on – it makes no difference to many Ukippers whether or not the Tories or Labour are in power.

          We detest them equally.

          • HookesLaw

            Louder please- you do not care if Labour are returned to power. And you try to pretend that you are all patriotic.

            • Lord_of_Orange

              I am patriotic.

              That’s why I want the unpatriotic Tory Party (which is only patriotic at election time – wonder why?) destroyed so that we can have a proper patriotic political party to oppose Labour.

              • HookesLaw

                UKIP are a bunch of extremist loons with no wide mainstream appeal and exist merely to split the right wing vote.

                • Lord_of_Orange

                  If we have no wide mainstream appeal then why is it that UKIP continues to do well in the north of England whereas the Tories are withering away?

                  In the last few by-elections UKIP has beaten the Conservative Party and is fast catching up on Labour.

        • Wessex Man

          why would we? you are all just a gluttoness mass of left wing nutters.

        • ButcombeMan

          You just do not get it. Kippers come from all other parties and from none.
          Some will have voted against Labour, others will have voted for Labour, in the past.
          A vote for Ukip is a vote for Ukip. nothing more.
          The whole basis of your silly blackmail attempts fails because you have not understood the Ukip ideology.

          You have also not understood the depth of disgust Cameron arouses, in those of us who used to support the Tories.

          • Michele Keighley

            I think you just nailed the disconnect – these people have absolutely no understanding of how a large percentage of the population have come to loathe both the Conservative and Labour parties equally. As both parties have the same basic core practices it matters not if voting for UKIP means another Labor government – we would be hard pressed to notice any difference.

    • Wessex Man

      er, what’s the content of the Tory, Labour, lib/dum and Greens maifesto for 2015? sad very sad.

  • David_Boothroyd

    Let us also remember the disastrous televised interview with the then UKIP leader, Lord Pearson of Rannoch, during the election – in which Pearson appeared entirely ignorant of the contents of the manifesto for the party he led, and plaintively said at the end “I haven’t remembered it all in detail. I didn’t come on to talk about this sort of thing.”

    • Colonel Mustard

      Never mind the manifesto. Let’s also remember that you belong to a party whose actual policies in government from 1997 to 2010 were DISASTROUS for this country, including your plan to ‘rub the right’s nose in diversity’.

      • Lord_of_Orange

        Indeed. And a policy that the Tories have continued in office.

        • Colonel Mustard

          Boothroyd is a Labour MP!

          • 2trueblue

            Not all the apples were rotten.

        • HookesLaw

          You are a total idiot.

          • Wessex Man

            Hooky, pot kettlw black, make sure you don’t go in any glasshouses mind. Your point th zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz

          • Lord_of_Orange

            Oohhh, did I touch a nerve diddums?

      • David_Boothroyd

        Pretty poor attempt to change the subject, there.

        • Wessex Man

          pretty poor attempt to be the mam of the people there!

          • David Kay

            Boothroyd when a socialist labour councillor was caught editing Camerons wiki page under a false name for political purposes while he was meant to be impartial as he was on wikis arbitration committee

            a dishonest socialist politician, oh my who would have thought such a thing. Its the sort of the thing you would expect the socialists in 1930s germany to do. Goebbels would be proud of his fellow socialists false flag op

        • Colonel Mustard

          Well, you should know. Labour are past masters at doing that whenever the finger is pointed at them.

          But really, it’s not changing the subject when you provide a demonstration of the hypocrisy for which Labour is infamous.

        • Nicholas chuzzlewit

          Gold medal winning hypocrisy from Labour as usual. Never has there been a group of politicians that has obfuscated so much when faced with a subject not to it’s liking. Hilarious.

    • Lord_of_Orange

      Errrr that was because he was being asked about minor policy details in the manifesto which was hundreds of pages long. Do you think if a minor policy of the Conservatives, Labour or the Liberal Democrats had been picked out and put to Cameron/Brown or Clegg that they would have been able to discuss every one in detail? Certainly not.

      At the end of the day the Tory Party can mock all it wants – but UKIP at least stands for core values that the useless Conservatives do not: national sovereignty, controlled immigration and grammar schools.

      • David_Boothroyd

        The UKIP manifesto in 2015 was 15 pages long, not “hundreds”. And it is perfectly fair to question party leaders about specific details of the manifesto; in the days of Robin Day doing hour-long interviews of the party leaders, it was exactly what went on.

        • Lord_of_Orange

          The main manifesto was short but linked to policy documents which ran into hundreds of pages on specific subjects. That is what the manifesto was comprised of.

          Nice try, but you lose.

        • Wessex Man

          and you are a member of Parliament and don’t know what year it is?

          • David_Boothroyd

            I’m not a member of Parliament.

      • 2trueblue

        Farage is very good but that is all they have to offer. There is no one else in his party that can show what UKIP have to offer. I will vote for UKIP in the EU elections but not in the general election. The thought of letting Liebore in again is too much, and no time to be protesting.

        • Lord_of_Orange

          Paul Nuttall, Roger Helmer, Diane James, Janice Atkinson, Margot Parker, Stuart Agnew, Amjad Bashir, Michael Heaver, Tim Aker, Lord Monckton, Lord Pearson, Steve Crowther, Louise Bours, the Earl of Dartmouth, Patrick O’Flynn, Steven Woofle………….

          Most of whom have real life experience outside of politics. Unlike the LibLabCon trio.

          • HookesLaw

            And what use is ‘real life experience’ particularly when it comes to negotiating with the president of the USA or China or Russia?? A bit of real life intelligence might help.
            If labour doid not exist they would have to invent it. Splitting the right wing vote – a godsend to Labour.

            • Lord_of_Orange

              Most diplomacy is done by Civil Servants in the Foreign and Commonwealth Office – and as you should know, Civil Servants remain no matter what government is elected. Therefore we’d have the same people arguing Britain’s case as we do now, except they’d be arguing based on sensible UKIP foreign policy which means more free trade and less war.

              And can you please stop slurring we Ukippers by pretending that you Tories have anything in common with us? You don’t. Ukippers need to avoid you dying Tories like the plague.

              • the viceroy’s gin

                Yes, it is amusing how the poor, confused lad shrieks hysterically against UKIP, then seeks their support. It’s no wonder the Camerloons are where they’re at politically.

              • HookesLaw

                Priceless.

            • ButcombeMan

              The right/left business is rather overdone. Yes Ukippers are never likely to be Guardian readers, but that aside they are straddling many political and social strands. They will hurt Labour too, as you are about to see with Wythenshawe.

              You seem to be showing signs of panic.

            • Smithersjones2013

              Splitting the right wing vote – a godsend to Labour.

              Oh if that were UKIP’s achievement to claim but they haven’t claimed it and indeed it was not their achievement to claim. It will however be high on the list of David Cameron’s achievements along with splitting the Libdem support and driving half of them back to Labour.

              As far as I can recall never before has one politician managed to split two parties as Cameron has!

              I’m sure both UKIP and Labour will be eternally grateful to David Cameron for that!

            • Lady Magdalene

              So stop splitting it. Vote UKIP.

            • colliemum

              So you foresee a UKIP majority in 2015, and Nigel Farage being the PM?
              That’s good to know, thank you!
              AFAIK, not even the most fervent UKIP supporter is claiming such success.

          • 2trueblue

            As stated above they will still not be the next government, they will deliver Millipede and Balls to lead the next government. Go figure.

            • the viceroy’s gin

              …perhaps you Cameroons shouldn’t split the UKIP vote, then.

            • Smithersjones2013

              Keep on with the pathetic excuses and remain in denial if you must. It is the Tories who have split their own vote and aided the Libdems to split theirs as well. It will be that that will defeat the Tories in 2015.

              The thing is the Tories will never recover until they take responsibility and ownership for their failings

      • Shinsei1967

        Official uniforms for taxi drivers may well be a minor policy but it is so staggeringly bonkers that anyone who has actually read the manifesto would remember it. It’s also weirdly un-British and I would have thought un-UKIP. The Great British Cabby has been able to wear what he likes since the days of Alfred the Great. Imagine UKIP’s reaction if the EU had a policy for taxi uniforms !

        There are fairly obvious things a candidate for election would be expected to have done of know. Read the manifesto, be able to name the important people in one’s party, and know the price of a pint of milk.

        • HookesLaw

          As far as UKIP are concerned all cabbies should be cockney and the country started to go downhill when they took sweets off the ration.
          They think Carrry on Cabbie was a training film.

          • Wessex Man

            hur hur hur how long did it take you to think that one up? no no don’t tell us, you are alre zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz

            • HookesLaw

              2 seconds

        • Makroon

          I think some UKIP loon probably got that idea from Sir Oswald – the UKIP small fry like the idea of “the smack of firm government”. Ironic that Sir Oswald was a great supporter of the European super-state.

          • Smithersjones2013

            I think that says more about those who currently are in favour of the European superstate than it does UKIP as it goes.

      • El_Sid

        he was being asked about minor policy details

        Err – our status as a nuclear power is not exactly a minor policy detail!

        They count cancelling Trident as a saving, but don’t budget for whatever they’d have it in its place. They seem to be clinging on to the fantasy of a nuclear cruise missile, ignoring the fact that they’re pretty useless as a defence – they’re a) much more vulnerable than ballistic missiles (even Spitfires shot down hundreds of cruise missiles in WWII) b) much shorter range c) we’d have to develop a new warhead rather than just buying Trident off the shelf d)we’d need a new maintenance system rather than plugging in to the existing US ones e)Enemies can’t tell the difference between nuclear-tipped cruise and non-nuclear, so they assume the worst – cruise missiles lead to escalation.

        It works out more expensive for a less capable system that doesn’t really deter. It’s a bit rich for UKIP to then talk about national sovereignty.

        There are valid arguments for abandoning the deterrent altogether, but cruise missiles are the worst of all worlds.

        • Lord_of_Orange

          I wasn’t talking about Trident or Farage. I was talking about the interview with Lord Pearson regarding police patrols.

          Nice try at twisting what I wrote to fit your upside-down reality.

      • 2trueblue

        They can stand for motherhood and apple pie, they are still not going to make a difference that will be helpful. But they will deliver Millipede and Balls for sure.

        • the viceroy’s gin

          No, you Cameroons will, if you split the UKIP vote.

        • Smithersjones2013

          Cameron delivered Miliband and Balls when he split the Libdem vote with his Coalition.

    • Nicholas chuzzlewit

      Better that than another 5 years of the treasonous scum that did its best to destroy Britain between 1997 and 2010. You left this country with a massive structural deficit and a 7.3% contraction of the economy both of which you still, incredibly, deny and blame on the coalition. You spent 13 years taking every possible opportunity to persecute the people of this country with your hatred of the middle class and now have the temerity to call yourself a “one nation” party. UKIP may or may not have a coherent message but I would welcome them every time if faced by Labour the most dishonest and disgusting blight on British public life.

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