Coffee House

MPs to push government on plans for new migrants

22 April 2013

12:50 PM

22 April 2013

12:50 PM

MPs will debate the government’s preparations for more Bulgarian and Romanian migrants in Westminster Hall today, as another survey suggests that there’s no need to get unduly worried about the lifting of transitional controls.

Ministers have in recent weeks managed to calm Tory backbenchers down by making announcements regarding restricted access to benefits and housing, but there’s still sufficient appetite for this afternoon’s debate, led by Mark Pritchard, and a session of the Home Affairs Select Committee tomorrow with the Bulgarian and Romanian Ambassadors and Immigration Minister Mark Harper. Pritchard tells me:

‘EU migration and non-EU immigration is of real concern to many communities throughout Britain given the record numbers who entered Britain between 1997-2005. This influx has caused real social change. This debate will seek to underscore the benefits of immigration whilst not shying away from perceived and real dis-benefits. The government is doing a lot right on this issue – but there is much more to do.’

We’ll learn more from Pritchard and colleagues during the course of that debate about what more needs to be done, but chances are those demands will involve greater focus on the ‘push’ factors as well as the ‘pull’. When Coffee House broke the news of this debate back in February, Pritchard said he was keen for a discussion about extending the transitional controls themselves, which is a big ask of ministers. But there may also be demands for tougher controls for new countries acceding to the EU in future: many MPs are already turning their minds to Turkey’s accession.

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Show comments
  • Roy

    Educated, skilled, clean living immigrants or not, I can’t believe there are still idiot recommendations coming out of the educated establishments of the country touting the immigration ticket. As if this is the only idea they can come up with. Yes, he would have been right some good few years ago. Now the damage has been done and we are left with the effluent the decision makers have made. The country has enough people, the only ones to benefit would be big business.
    The solution is getting people working or they go hungry!!! Have the educated establishment got the balls to admit this and put it right? You can’t carry such an enormous amount of idle people in society and expect the country to pick itself up and its economy suddenly revive. If they will not except work … they go hungry.

  • thanksdellingpole

    I’d vote for UKIP if only they warned us about this…

  • Dogsnob

    Top four in the history of artful lies:
    4. The sleeves should ride up with wear Sir.
    3. Oh that’s only surface rust.
    2. No we won’t enter Britain without a firm offer of a job.
    1.

  • chan chan

    Turkey will never get to join the EU.

  • Colonel Mustard

    The problem with the BBC poll is that it does not distinguish from those migrating for genuine work opportunities, those migrating from extreme poverty and deprivation to take advantage of better benefits or those migrating to pursue criminal opportunities. When it comes to practice rather than blather I’m not convinced the UK Government does either.

    • http://twitter.com/rayveysey Ray Veysey

      See UKIP web site for complete dismantling of the BBC’s figures. They really are dangerously deluded.

  • Abhay

    Turkey is not joining the EU anytime soon so why even bring it up? The day it joins will be the day EU meets disaster with its borders touching the out of control mid-east with no buffer in the middle.
    Non EU immigration should reecive a bit more attention.And the idea of multi-culturalism should be given a very indecent burial.
    The passionate votaries of multiculturalism are always welcome to emigrate to Saudi Arabia, Somalia, Sudan etc. to enjoy the full tapestry of multi-culti.

    • The Sage

      But of course, asylum seekers rarely seek asylum in countries less wealthy than the country they have left. So for years, we have seen arrivals seeking “asylum” who have already crossed several borders of apparently safe countries before deciding to claim asylum here in the UK – and then never sent back thanks our useless and toothless Border Agency.

  • Jebediah

    Educated young skilled immigrants (like many of the Poles) do well, positively contribute and generally fit in. The same is true of Indian doctors and skilled people from all nations
    Unskilled, non-English speaking, welfare dependent, illiterate in their own language, anti-western muslim immigrants from Africa and Asia tend to drag us down.

    • dalai guevara

      Yes, so is it finally time to embark on a US/Australian type points system?

      Is it finally time to call an end to housing….eh, rephrase landlord benefits and sheds with beds living to be curtailed?

      Is it finally time to pay the displaced and uneducated indigenous contingent a LIVING wage to survive the high costs incurred when facing London borough living?

      What would the fat cats think of this radical proposal?

      • the viceroy’s gin

        Like anybody else with some sense, they’d probably say you’re a ranting socialist seeking to grow the government and bankrupt the populace’s future.

        • James Strong

          Really laddie, don’t you think we need to find a way to discriminate between immigrants who can be a benefit to the UK and those who are likely only to be a drain?
          How about a simple test: eat a pork pie and drink a pint of English beer or your application to immigrate to the UK will fail.

          • the viceroy’s gin

            No problem with that, lad.

            Although it’d be better if you did that without growing the government and bankrupting the populace’s future.

        • dalai guevara

          I got it now – you are Robbie Fowler!

          • the viceroy’s gin

            Impossible.

            Clearly you’ve never “got it”, re this or anything else.

      • http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=100004981542519 Tom Tom

        The Australian points system is so wonderful that boatloads arrive via Indonesia to sample the delights of Australia without actually having any points

        • the viceroy’s gin

          It’s worse with the US, actually.

          But yes, Canada and Australia at least make small effort in this regard.

        • dalai guevara

          Well, so is the American system. On my last trip to NYC, I noticed that the ENTIRE low wage service/catering side of things was run by Mexicans.
          So there we have it: even if you have rules, you don’t have rules.

          • the viceroy’s gin

            So you’re only now getting that?

            The rest of us had it long ago, and it’s amusing that a socialist is only now getting it.

            • dalai guevara

              Rules are for plebs, waving the flag of a nation state is for townies and fascists. And, most notably, a pressure cooker is a weapon of mass destruction.

              • the viceroy’s gin

                Actually, striking out at flag waving is fascist. You fascists just like to make sure the flag is the one you prefer.

                And yes, you fascists do believe rules are for plebs.

                • dalai guevara

                  You better check up on your housekeeper on what she’s doing with that pressure cooker, now that it emerges that everyone could be a potential threat.
                  Or even better – if you haven’t got one, why not just place an order of 5 tomorrow on amazon.ca and let me know how you got on with the friendly chaps who will come and see you at the door 45 minutes later.
                  Hahaha!

                • the viceroy’s gin

                  Well no, it’s you multi-culti fascists who think that “everyone could be a potential threat.”

                  I don’t need 5 pressure cookers, and so I wouldn’t order them. Stupid hypotheticals are for you fascists, and you use them to steal liberty. It’s one of your favorite tactics.

                • dalai guevara

                  What a silly conflation. Multi-culti and ‘everyone could be a threat’. Of course that is the line of your moronic secret services. Now think it through will you and witness the curtailment of your civil liberties. The Norwegians are leading the way here, all the way. Everywhere else, and in Anglo America in particular, we witness the emergence of soft fascism. I will coin a phrase now: sofascism (with a Bud light in hand).

                • the viceroy’s gin

                  Oh no, you multi-culti fascists thrive on “everyone could be a potential threat”. You’ve been doing it these past 8 days, in fact.

                  And yes, you fascists seek to use this and anything else to steal more and more of our liberty. And your excuse as per your post is that fascism already exists (sorta like your fascist windmills), so we might as well have more and more and more of it.

                  Like your Leveson schemes.

                  No, you’re a fascist alright, and individual freedom and liberty is a scourge to you types. You despise it. The quicker Brussels takes over and subjugates everybody, the happier you fascists will be.

                • dalai guevara

                  You have perfected your tactics of conflation. Leveson is not about curtailing civil liberties, Leveson is about strengthening them and stopping big players from calling all the shots.
                  And then there is the rule of law, only applied to the minnows, not to the big players – they just meet for coffees and have a chat and then strip titles. Who gives a T about that?

                • the viceroy’s gin

                  Leveson is about censorship, and destruction of free speech, a favorite tactic of you fascists. And as usual, you fascists claim to be “protecting” us, as you steal our freedom and liberty.

                  One might think that you fascists drive enough of your fascist narrative to accomplish your freedom snatching ends, what with the “anybody could be a potential threat” multi-culti nonsense being one of your tried and true bits of propaganda, deployed to great effect these past 8 days.

                  But apparently controlling the narrative isn’t enough for you fascists, you need to shut down those who disagree with you. That’s how you can always spot a fascist. They directly impinge on personal freedom and liberty.

                • dalai guevara

                  If I was into being spanked wearing a fascist uniform I would agree with you.
                  If I was of the opinion that this was none of your bleeding business, then I am not.

                • the viceroy’s gin

                  If you were about the business of making sense, you wouldn’t make such a stupid post.

                  That post is so stupid it makes my hair hurt.

                • dalai guevara

                  Go on then, tell me about your Chinese kids. Then add your residential address below so I can come round and take daily photographs of you when you take the bin out etc.

                  Oh, you sofascists… one law for you, another law for everyone else.

                • the viceroy’s gin

                  You’re the fascist who wants to silence our speech, force us to pay for your fascist windmills and anything else your fascist comrades in Brussels inflict on us, without our consent.

                  No need for you fascist pots to call the kettle black.

                • dalai guevara

                  You forgot to add your address. Come on, go all the way, matey. I promise I will write a weekly column about your Jekyll’n’Hyde logic. I will even add photographs of you trying to get away from it all.
                  Freedom of speech…zzzzzzzzzzz

                • the viceroy’s gin

                  Yes, the fascist pot calling the kettle black.

                  A well known fascist tactic, to accuse others of that which you fascists yourselves are doing. There’s a nice fascist sinecure in Brussels awaiting you, if you keep that up.

                • dalai guevara

                  Katie Price’s exhibitionism will not change my rights to privacy.
                  If you want to read that voyeuristic tat, go and buy it – but then e x p e c t someone to come and visit to check you out. Live by the sword, die by the sword.

                • the viceroy’s gin

                  That post is starting to make my hair hurt again…

                  I suspect you fascist like the thought of that.

    • Simon Scarth

      You are so right.
      I live and work on the continent and the experience here is the same. Poles etc
      are industrious though they can be lively but never the less fit in or return
      when they have earned enough. The problem we have here is the Muslims (nearly
      50% of Rotterdam). The incident of social claiming, crime and the failure to
      integrate is a serious problem. I see that the asylum seekers in the UK runs at
      about 22k, the vast majority being illiterate Muslims who are a very very high
      percentage welfare dependent. This really must stop; they are in such peril for
      their lives that they leave wives and children behind! I can imagine the
      Islamic Titanic ‘ Women and children last!

    • Davey12

      Tell your Tory MP’s they will never see my vote again.

      They can let them all in.

      You can fight for the ethnic vote with Labour and the LibDems.

    • styants64

      There are over six and a half thousand poles in British prisons and I have found a lot of Asian doctors are not very good at all and had little confidence in them.

  • telemachus

    You can never have to many immigrants because each one increases the national wealth both financially and culturally. We are now more diverse than ever which can only be a good thing. having a single monocultur that is the same is always ging to lead to sterility. we need a rainbow cultur for a rainbow people. Ed Miliband has recently said that migrants must not be targetted as they are overall a very good thing for the country.

    The majority of people in London are now non-British and a recemt poll says that they di not think more immogration is a problem. I agree.

    • Jebediah

      Yes you’re right it led to the terrible sterility of Britain becoming the richest, most powerful and scientifically creative society on Earth in the 19th century.
      So more illiterate, welfare dependent, muslim, anti western immigrants can only add to our recent success.

    • Austin Barry

      Rubbish post, Tele: the spelling is awful, ‘single monocultur that is the same’ is a tautology, and ‘The majority of people in London are now non-British and a recemt poll says that they di not think more immogration is a problem’ is stating the obvious, bleeding or otherwise.

      • telemachus

        i am typing on my ipid and so spelling is not brilliant. but the point stands. with a diverse london it makes it easier and easier for new immigrants to fit in. it is only white british people who complain, and they are increasingly a minority and there opinions count less and less.

        • Jebediah

          Traitor.

          • telemachus

            In the New World Order there is no place for petty nationalisms. We are all British now by virtue of the fact that we live in Britain. That is all that counts now to be British.

            • http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=100004981542519 Tom Tom

              No. Noone can bestow Nationality. It is not for a Civil Servant or politician to bestow

              • telemachus

                You are right. there is no such thing as nationality. which is why a Somalian or Bangaldeshi has as much right to be called british as anyone else who lives here. the time of nation states (which didn’t last very long) is passing. we are entering a new world order.

            • tele_machus

              the clone

        • Reconstruct

          Just a wild conjecture, but you’re not ‘Leftythinker’ in disguise, are you?

        • Colonel Mustard

          If this is the real telemachus my name is Clegg.

          • telemachus

            Colonel Clegg. We are all telemachus now. We are all increasingly tolerant of the diverse cultures we now enjoy. Those who complain are a noisy but shrinking minority. I bet that within 15 years we will have a black, Muslim Mayor of London establishing some form of sharia in London. We need to except the way that things are going and learn to love it.

            • the viceroy’s gin

              The shadow telemucus is still my favorite.

              • dalai guevara

                by far!

            • Airey Belvoir

              ‘Accept’. ‘Except’ tends to mean the opposite

            • tele_machus

              and again

    • itdoesntaddup

      Turning people into cats is a novel idea – well perhaps not for witches. Or is that immogrification?

      • Barakzai

        Careful what you say: you might be hearing from Mr Galloway’s lawyers . . .

    • Abhay

      Telemachus, you should go and preach this high knowledge to the hard-line throat-cutting, Wahabi monotheists in Saudi Arabia and their brethren in Somalia etc. They will love you for it and will pay you fees for the wisdom. There are risks you run but hey! – no pain no gain or nothing ventured nothing gained or no risk no reward!

      • anneallan

        I believe once your head has been cut off, you feel no pain whatsoever. The prisoner may suffer a bit if the executioner is cackhanded, but provided he feels he’s done a useful job, then it’s all worthwhile. 🙂

        • Abhay

          Anne, you are brilliant! 🙂

          • telemachus

            most extreme right wing english little britishers support the death penalty. what is being disputed is who should recieve it. most muslims do not have a problem with the instructions of sharia law and there are many non-muslims who have lived under sharia law for hundreds of years. sharia law is no worse than our own laws and often much better. we should stop being so racist in insisting on oyr own british ways. being british means no more than living here and so the racist attachment to white british culture must continue to diminish. this is as it should be. islam will certainly bring order to the uk, as socialism will bring fairness and equality. the future is bright. the future is socialist and islamic with room for all.

            • Abhay

              If you are trying to wind people up – well enjoy the childish exercise.

              If you are serious – go to Saudi Arabia and enjoy your Sharia etc. Nobody will shed a tear, believe me.

              There will be NO victory for Sharia here in the UK. That is a promise.

              • telemachus

                i never post a word I do not mean. there is much to sharia law which would benefit us all. Since there are already areas of London which are Muslim controlled it is only a matter of time before sharia is introduced locally and then nationally. Even the archbishop of canterbury has spoken warmly about the benefits of sharia law governing the UK.

                If you did not want sharia then you should not have allowed 3 million muslims to come here. since you have allowed this then you must put up with the consequences and make the most of them.

                • Nicholas chuzzlewit

                  Alternatively, they could try and fit in with the traditions which have evolved over the last two millennia which the other 57 million of us are happy to observe and respect in the course of our everyday lives.

                • tele_machus

                  not real

            • http://www.facebook.com/sue.ward.77770 Sue Ward

              I have always believed you were a Labour troll but with the above post I have realised your are just completely insane.

              • Simon Semere

                He’s not insane, what he says is very real; with Islam welcomed so warmly here it’s only a matter of time till I get hanged for concealing a vodka bottle

            • tele_machus

              not me

            • Donafugata

              When the expression ” useful idiot” was coined, it must have been you they had in mind.

    • sarahsmith232

      the only thing Labour’s immigration policies created was a cultural homogeneity, not diversity. you#d know that if you knew London

    • chan chan

      Great stuff. This is like something out of Chris Morris’ ‘Brass Eye’, or perhaps a treatment for an episode of ‘Black Mirror’

      • telemachus

        There are many white British people who resist it, but I am looking forward to a future, not so far away, when it doesn’t matter who you are or where you come from. everyone is treated the same and as being equally british. there is no reason for the cultur of Somalia for instance to be valued less than that of Pakistan or England. They are all equalluy valuable when practiced by people in Britain. I look forward to the day when Muslims and Gays and Transgendered and Disabled people are all able to walk through the streets of London hand in hand. When Somalians and English and Pakistani and Poles and Roma Gypsies are all able to walk through the streets of London hand in hand. It will only happen as we give up the unfairly privileged English culture and accept and adopt the rainbow culture of the future.

        • GUBU

          Ah yes, I can see it now…Abu Qatada and Peter Tatchell, skipping hand in hand towards Finsbury Park Mosque, with the Muslim London Patrol and the cast of ‘Priscilla, Queen of the Desert’ accompanying them in the Gloria Gaynor classic ‘I am what I am’. What a day that will be…

        • Colonel Mustard

          The only snag with that, apart from the fact that it appears to contravene the UN Declaration of the Rights of Indigenous Peoples (although the cowardly UK Government has refused to determine what that means in terms of being English), is that those who consider themselves English by birthright and ethnicity and wish to stay that way in their own country would be discriminated against, coerced and ‘cleansed’ without their consent. As indeed some might argue they are already.

          • tele_machus

            Sorry not the true bill

        • tele_machus

          not tele

        • dalai guevara

          Your posts are beginning to resemble those of the leftythinker in content and spelling. Well done, you appear to confuse everyone on here.

    • HookesLaw

      ‘The majority of people in London are now non-British’
      Wrong.
      The census facts are clear: the population of the London is 60 per cent white and 63 per cent of Londoners are British-born.
      Of the Londoners born abroad many have in fact become British.
      Boris Johnson does not count as ‘British born’. So he is included in the “white British” (at 45 per cent) but not in the British-born 67 per cent.
      75% of Londoners are British

      In other news…
      Increased numbers means increased need for services so your logic is warped.’

      • The Sage

        Yes, this happy diversity was very evident among the charity runners (and the spectators) in Sunday’s London marathon. In fact, so diverse were the runners that those raising the money were almost exclusively white. What does this tell us?

        • HookesLaw

          I was not talking about happy diversity. I was pointing out the facts. I have been and watched the marathon and thought myself that it seemed mostly white.
          The London Marathon is not a London only event – it is a national one.

          • The Sage

            Yes, hideously so. But I don’t believe that being a national event is the key factor here, it’s the raising of money for charity that deters.

            • HookesLaw

              or the culture of marathon running.

              • The Sage

                What? They win it every year! But not for charity, only for prize money.

      • http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=100004981542519 Tom Tom

        Boris Johnson is American but in a diffeent way from Churchill being American

        • HookesLaw

          Wot – in that both his parents are British as opposed to only one? Johnson is American in the different way that he is actually British of Turkish decent.

        • the viceroy’s gin

          I don’t think the albino toff has a nationality. He’s a citizen of the world, and a member of his class.

          • HookesLaw

            Two stinking bits of nasty prejudice in consecutive words. Congratulations. Is there an award going round that i don’t know of you snivelling cur?

            • the viceroy’s gin

              Right back at ya’, you lying socialist tosspot.

      • The_Missing_Think

        So what’s your take on the 2066 factor?

        https://www.google.co.uk/#hl=en&sclient=psy-ab&q=white+minority+2066&oq=white+minority+2066&gs_l=hp.3..0i22i30l4.3376.22336.0.23100.19.14.0.5.5.0.447.2600.0j12j1j0j1.14.0…0.0…1c.1.9.psy-ab.0y09JX9HXPM&pbx=1&bav=on.2,or.r_qf.&bvm=bv.45512109,d.d2k&fp=a27feb7415af5ad3&biw=1152&bih=689

        Is it a political issue, or not…?

        Please, please, pretty please, include either a ‘yes’ or ‘no’, if you respond with silence, I’ll presume that it’s a, very large tacit ‘no!’.

    • The Sage

      No it does not! There are over 2.5 million out of work and migrants deny local people jobs then send home a large slice of the income without ever spending this money in the UK economy. Where is the economic sense in that?
      We don’t want to be diverse.
      We have an anti-diversity policy at our company to ensure that our workforce is not diverse – and long may in remain this way.

    • Simon Scarth

      Immigrants are
      good but the numbers must be controlled. You are wrong about the contribution
      made as many do contribute but the nearly 20K Muslim asylum seekers bring us
      nothing but trouble and division and are almost totally welfare dependant. It
      is also a faith that is injurious to them, let alone us!

    • tele_machus

      not i-if you want to check click on red rose tele which does not go back far enough

  • Their lips are moving so….

    Red herring alert! Turkey? Not likely to join in the foreseeable future.

    Pay attention. Eye on the ball. Don’t get distracted.

    Apparently, a poll or 1000 or so (FFS!) tells us that hardly anyone in either country (combined pop. c. 30m so the poll covered 0.003% of the population) is looking for work in the UK. Well I’ve seen a poll which says survey’s are a waste of time.

    • HookesLaw

      Your logic says then that all,opinion polls are useless.

  • Austin Barry

    “..but chances are those demands will involve greater focus on the ‘push’ factors as well as the ‘pull’. ”

    The only ‘push’ and ‘pull’ factors at play here are the same: the steady and irresistible rise of UKIP, which is causing our political elites linen-soiling anxiety.

    • the viceroy’s gin

      Yes, this is setting up as a bear trap, innocuously lying around and inducing the typical narcotic “debate” within the bubble, inclusive of only the bubble denizens, whereby they convince their target audience of the benevolence of their actions. Problem is, they are their own and only audience.

      And then the trap springs…

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