Coffee House

An alternative reaction to Margaret Thatcher’s death

9 April 2013

9 April 2013

On my way home last night, I dropped by Windrush Square in Brixton to observe an alternative reaction to Baroness Thatcher’s death. It was easy to find the party simply by following the cacophony. Around 200 people turned out to engage in a cold evening of drinking, dancing and heckling. Three competing sound systems blasted music against occasional shouts of ‘Maggie Maggie Maggie, dead dead dead’. Was the crowd attempting to make a serious point or was it just an excuse for a drunken party? These pictures should give you an impression of the impromptu event:

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Ironically from what I could see, many in the crowd appeared rather too young to remember Thatcher: some looked too young to have even been alive when she was in power. The only reference to politics were chalk scrawlings referencing Hillsborough, the Battle of Orgreave, David Cameron and the cost to the state of her funeral. The rest simply appeared to be pure jubilation.

Like many of the passing drivers honking their horns and shouting, I found the whole thing utterly distasteful. Lambeth’s Unison branch, present at the event, should be ashamed to be associated with it. Even if you have a severe problem with Thatcher’s legacy, a drunken rave is not the way to air your views.

UPDATE: Ed Miliband and Ken Livingstone feel the same way:


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Show comments
  • http://www.facebook.com/barbara.lloyd.7902 Barbara Lloyd

    Thatcher’s death discussion- vitriolic and divisive. Ironic!

  • Dai

    All I see here is double Dutch Thatcherite wannabes who are upwardly mobile self-obsessed and seekers of the club culture not delivered to them by their birthright. They seek to identify with the privileged classes without appreciating that they are just as amusing to those classes as are th great unwashed .

  • http://www.facebook.com/barbara.stevens.790 Barbara Stevens

    I’ll not fuss about Mrs T’s passing or celebrate either, I remember her early days and recall many who took their own lives in despair. Those who appear in the picture seem far to young to remember those days unless they have families who recall. Dancing on someones grave is awful, and shows lack of commonsense, and shows the true character of those that participate.
    Those days were sad days, days that were hurtful for many, not all of these people were rioters of the day, many were folk who had lost jobs, houses, and breakdown of marriges. Brother against brother, father against sons, it was not a happy time at all. That is why we see such hatred, memories have been recalled, perhaps by grandfathers or fathers and uncles. Time does not fade memories and the pain that went with the times.
    Yes Mrs T achieved somethings, like standing up to the EU, its a pity the leader we have now could not show the same mettle as she did he’s certainly lacking the fibre to do so. She allowed people to buy their council homes, but once unemployed refused to help them sustain them by cutting mortage interest payments, she was astute or cunning in her delivery of poliices, they will always be her legacy good or bad,

  • MariaKay

    The DT is reporting that one of the chief organizers of the celebrations is a washed-up D-list “actress” who currently “specialises in ‘facilitating workshops for young, excluded and potentially criminalised individuals and uses drama techniques she has developed to explore resolution of conflict and oppression,’ according to the company’s website.”

    Three guesses as to who pays for these indoctrination “workshops” at schools.

    So there you have it. A public titty-sucker employed in a worthless, taxpayer-funded non-job as a professional indoctrinator.

    Yes, I can see quite well why she hated Mrs. Thatcher.

  • James Munro

    The facile noise of protest was rather predictable. Best to employ planned ignoring. They were never able to unseat her so they wait till she dies when she cannot respond.

    Margaret Thatcher won three General Elections. She achieved everything within a Parliamentary democracy. Quite an incredible feet achieved by dint of her conviction. The rabble will fade after having a large hurrah at the funeral but I take comfort that anything which aggravates, among others, Galloway and Morrissey must be ok.

  • Simon Morgan

    It’s a disgraceful hate-fest. These people are bereft of any humanity and have no shame. They are people without a single redeeming feature. What on earth has become of Britain?

  • MikeF

    These people don’t even deserve contempt – they are not worth the act of will required to summon up the feelings. They are squalid nonentities – nothing more.

  • evad666

    No metion of all the foreign diplomatic staff expelled after the Riots in Northern Cities or mention of all the factory closures during the major Blair years.

  • http://www.facebook.com/roger.hudson.946 Roger Hudson

    Would those chanting idiots like to live in mid-seventies Britain? I remember it had all the signs of a country in rapid decline. Thatcher made many mistakes ( Rhodesia, squandering oil and dumping redundant workers on sickness benefit and ‘schemes’ but her passing should be treated respectfully.

    • MariaKay

      We’ve suffered these idiots and their descendants for half a century. It’s simply past time to ship them all off to North Korea so they can live in their Commie paradise of their dreams.

      Confiscate their goods and donate them to the survivors of the 20th Century Commiecaust. I know several Chinese folks who richly deserve some compensation for the years they spent in one of Mao’s labor camps.

  • Fergus Pickering

    But these are children. They know nothing about it. They should get back to slagging off their mothers and fathers. Oh, and they should try getting a job..

  • DWWolds

    Since most of the people at the “party” seem to be very young their behaviour is a comment on the dire state to which our education system descended under New Labour.

  • MariaKay

    As a Yank, I will always be grateful to Lady Thatcher for standing up for us after 9/11, when the nasty, hateful, despicable European left were literally dancing on our graves. I remember when she said, “Look here, there were children on those planes–this simply isn’t right!”

    • Colonel Mustard

      Yes, the European left is indeed a nasty lot but the British left give them a run for their money as you can see from the comments here. Compassion and caring, which they boast of having more of than any other, are conspicuously absent.

      I often find them too ghastly for words.

      • MariaKay

        I was including the British left under the term “European left.” I hate to tell you this, but we Yanks generally regard Brits as “European.”

        • Steve R

          Oh dear, Maria, this correspondence was going so well – but now you’ve let it slip that us Brits are generally regarded as “European” you’re going to really upset most, if not all, followers of this blog. There is no greater slur!!!

          • MariaKay

            All I can say is that I learned in 3rd grade geography class that the British Isles were part of Europe the same way that Greenland is part of North America

            • Steve R

              No offence meant, Maria. In my comment, I was merely (trying to)display another quaint old British trait – Irony. Best Regards.

              • MariaKay

                None taken.

                Regardless of how you categorize them,the Left on your side of the Atlantic are a truly hateful bunch. It was their comments after 9/11 that gave birth to my undying hatred for them.

        • Colonel Mustard

          Not to worry. Technically we are via the EU – or at least a lot of dreary trendies think sitting at pavement tables and drinking awful coffee qualifies us as Europeans. There is a resistance though and I should never think of myself as European, ever. The most the EU will ever be for me is an illegal occupier of my country and a source of irritating nonsense.

          The British left have certainly allied themselves to the European left though and it is now quite difficult to discern who is the barmier of the two.

  • MariaKay

    Remember how they screeched and squealed just because some lout drew a scatty picture of Mary Beard in Photoshop and posted it on the net? The hypocrisy is unbelievable.

    • Colonel Mustard

      Indeed. Their hypocrisy is always bare faced and blatant beyond belief but sadly they always seem to get away with it. I absolutely detest the left.

      • MariaKay

        Respect for authority is a conservative value, so even if we wanted to act the same way, we couldn’t, without betraying our principles.

        In contrast, disrespect for authority is a left value, so this kind of behavior is natural for them. We OTOH are not going to be out popping champagne corks if Bliar or Milipede shuffled off; we would have respect for their positions if not for their persons.

        • justanoldfart

          What on earth are you blathering on about?

          “Authority: the power or right to give orders, make decisions, and enforce obedience.” I’m rather glad that all the resistance fighters in Europe during WWII didn’t have any respect for authority.

          “Millipede: a myriapod invertebrate with an elongated body composed of many segments, most of which bear two pairs of legs. Most kinds are herbivorous and shun light, living in the soil or under stones and logs.” Is that your idea of respect for the position of Leader of the Opposition.

          You seem to be very selective with your respect and principles.

          • MariaKay

            Calling someone a silly nickname is not the same as publicly orgasming in your undies about someone’s death just because you didn’t like their politics.

            Resistance fighters in Europe–give me a break. The biggest headaches for the Third Reich were Charles de Gaulle and Winston Churchill, two authoritarian conservatives if there ever were ones. In addition, respect for authority doesn’t include respect for the authorities of alien invading occupiers.

      • justanoldfart

        And I absolutely detest the barefaced and blatant hypocrisy of people such as you – left or right.

    • justanoldfart

      Winifred Mary Beard, OBE is Professor of Classics at the University of Cambridge and a fellow of Newnham College.

      I don’t recall her being Prime Minister or having any power whatsoever to change people’s lives for good or bad, and I don’t know who you mean by ‘they’; so what’s your point?

      • MariaKay

        The point is that there was much howling and indignation at the “sexism” directed at Beardy, while there have been nothing but paroxysms of orgasmic joy accompanying much worse commentary about another prominent female.

        Can you not see the hypocrisy right before your own eyes?

        And Beardy DOES make political statements– furthermore, she is given a platform by the BBC to make them on, so saying she is not political is simply not true.

  • Hookeslaw

    its funny (pathetic) to see the ‘milk snatcher’ jibe since it was a labour minister who finally removed free milk from infants.
    You will find most socialists totally ignorant of that.

    But as a conservative I relish the ignorance and nastiness displayed by the socialists.
    They are a magnificent advert for voting tory.

  • chan chan

    Leftists love death. That’s why they celebrate Thatcher’s passing. You’ll be hard pressed to find a leftist who will denounce the death of close to 100m people at the hands of communism. And that’s because they love it.

    • Russell

      Not forgetting the most infamous National Socialist with the ludicrous moustache.

    • justanoldfart

      Grow up you moron. Stalin was a dictator and a despot and I object to being associated with him because of my left wing leanings. Would you like to be associated with General Pinochet and his murderous regime?

      • HarryTheHornyHippo

        Sorry but when it comes to the genocide/nastiness stakes Pinochet is in the conference and fighting off relegation whereas your Messrs Stalin and Hitler are very much in the Champions’ League.

        • justanoldfart

          Did I say they weren’t? I think my point was that I object to being associated with anyone who is a mass murderer just because my political beliefs lean towards the left, and when someone says “You’ll be hard pressed to find a leftist who will denounce the death of close to 100m people at the hands of communism” I tend to get somewhat annoyed.

          • HarryTheHornyHippo

            I know, but I was being a facetious git. Have a ‘like’ from me.

  • http://www.facebook.com/ben.lewis.3760430 Ben Lewis

    Sheltered Tories in moral outrage shock. Meanwhile back in the real world:
    http://lifeunderthatcher.tumblr.com/

    • darwins beard

      boring

    • Colonel Mustard

      Moral outrage shock is something I normally associate with the left. I think in this case you are confusing it with disgust and contempt.

  • paulus

    Its pretty obvious that the people who bankroll, support and vote for the Labour party are now dancing on the grave of an old woman. Their distate is a spectacle of indecency and all decent people can see them for what they are.

    Mrs Thatcher allowed millions of people trapped at the bottom of society to aquire their own home and accumulate capital to escape the trap of poverty and have a cushion of assets, people who had previously only had to accept the gruel of what the state handed out and follow the orders of marxist agitators who used their power to further their own political agenda, irrigardless of the individual wishes of the memebers that the proported to speak for.

    This is the power the lost and this is the hatred for the ordinary people who rejected their existance under them.

    • Andy

      Which is why the Fascist Left scum hate her. Lady Thatcher allowed so many working people to radically change their lives and that is why the Left hate her so much. She broke their power base.

      • MariaKay

        More than anything, she and Reagan defeated their precious Commie dream and exposed it for the murderous, incompetent fraud that it was.

        That’s the main reason they will never forgive either of them.

        After the Berlin wall fell, and then the Chinese abandoned the Commie dream in all but name because it didn’t work, they were truly spooked.

        And they’ve just gotten nastier and nastier in the ensuing two decades as a result.

        • Hookeslaw

          You are right to mention Reagan. She and Reagan won the cold war. where were Labour then …? Supporting Greenham Common numpties.

          • MariaKay

            How many of them were taking money under the table from the KGB or the East German Stasi? There are lists floating around all of Europe that have been suppressed to save the Left’s tender feelings. . .How many senior Guardian editors and BBC producers are on those lists, I wonder?

        • Colonel Mustard

          And both Thatcher and Reagan were proper grown-ups. Something we haven’t really seen in politics since.

    • Hookeslaw

      Correct … Mrs Thatcher and her party, the Conservative Party.

      Ask yourself which party is the best one to govern Britain. Which party above all others do you want to prevent governing Britain. Take a look at the people who want to prevent the conservative party governing Britain. A long look and wonder what it would be like with them in charge.

  • Austin Barry

    I’m taking early bookings for the George Galloway Death Celebration at a date to be determined by fate. BYOB.

    • http://twitter.com/MisterQuintus Tony Quintus

      Let us not reduce ourselves to their morally bankrupt state.

  • Smithersjones2013

    Such creatures are not fit to adorn the underside of Baroness Thatcher’s shoes

  • Augustus

    Disliking someone is one thing, cacophonous cretins who can’t even wait until the lady is in the ground to start their vitriol is quite another, and entirely shows up the despicable morals of the left.

  • wrinkledweasel

    None of these people were around at the time and they are not important now. Move on, there is nothing to see.

  • Eyesee

    As an indication of how completely separated from the people of Britain the Left are and how completely Thatcher exposed that, these idiots and their adolescent partying couldn’t be bettered. The fall of the Soviet Union was deeply shocking to them, it removed hope that the Left would ever succeed in subjugating Britain to their will. But they have been wildly successful in many ways. Every time someone says ‘you can’t say that’ they are repeating Left ideology. Believing in man made Global Warming is another indicator that you have swallowed the most unbelievable of lies (in fact it seems the Left decided on MMGW specifically to show how easily they get people to believe even extreme lies). The poverty of our education is due to the Left infecting teacher training and the poverty on our streets because of the welfare trap laid by the Left. These parties are to celebrate the loss of a conviction politician who helped shine a light into the dark corners they inhabit. They are pleased that at least they have one of their own leading the Conservatives now; hopeless, populist cant pedlar, looking to stay in power anyhow.

  • http://www.facebook.com/people/Simon-Fay/1127268875 Simon Fay

    Uncouth and improper behaviour. I couldn’t stand her myself but self-control is required by this lot.

  • monty61

    The question is would she have defended the right to free speech, or sent in the mounted police, truncheons blazing? I think we know the answer to that one.

    Frankly seems an understandable reaction to the sick-making hagiography that has passed for commentary everywhere except the Grauniad.

    • Fergus Pickering

      Ah, everywhere except the Grauniad. Thank God for the Grauniad. Where would we be without it?

      • Colonel Mustard

        Where might we be without it? Be still my beating heart.

        • Fergus Pickering

          Ah Colonel! Let us go then, you and I….

      • MariaKay

        Yes, the Grauniad is a right proper hatefest! They are always screeching about “hate” and “haters” — I guess this is their perfect opportunity to sample what they rail against.

  • Macky Dee

    From 1964 under labour approx 300 pits were closed, info from NUM website, Con govt under Thatcher planned 20 closures.

    Like this article says – most people at the demo were too young to be alive at Thatchers time. But like most lefties – they hate the same figures so they can keep up the pretence they are united

    • http://twitter.com/MisterQuintus Tony Quintus

      Conservatives always get the blame for everything, just like New Labour claimed they’d created growth in the UK, when really it was the economic plans of the Major government which started the ball rolling 5 years earlier.
      If only the media would use these facts, just once!

      • MariaKay

        Not to mention that NuLab’s “growth” was based on a 1.) a propert/construction bubble created in part by mass immigration and cheap imported labor; 2.) a dodgy finance sector allowed to do what they wanted and 3.) massive funding for government non-jobs.

        What real jobs and wealth did they create?

        • Colonel Mustard

          I like the cut of your jib. Please stick around.

          • MariaKay

            I usually post at the DT, Colonel. But they have closed all comments on Lady T. in a very cowardly way. Most disturbing.

            • Nicholas chuzzlewit

              You are very very welcome here!

              • MariaKay

                Thank you.

    • MariaKay

      I can’t understand why they are screeching about coal mining so much? Isn’t it “dirty” and “polluting” and deeply destructive to Mother Gaia?

      The same people would have shut down the mines to clear the way for windmills anyways.

      If the mines were still open today, they’d be out screeching and screaming and picketing and waving their stupid little Che posters around, demanding that the mines all be shut down to save the world from “global warming.”

      Their hysterical ideology grows more illogical by each passing day.

      • Nicholas chuzzlewit

        Agreed but that would require logic and the left does not do logic.

  • http://georgeigler.com/ George Igler

    People ALWAYS cheer the death of their political enemies.

    Just as politicians *always* end up focusing on individual cases and tragedies in order to forward their own political agenda: Philpot, ATOS “suicides”, Lawrence, Climbié…

    It’s called pol-i-tics.

    Really all this vacuous we’re more sanctimoniously respectful-than-thou, between the Left and Right over the last week, has been nothing short of gag inducing.

    “We’re nicer than you are… the likes of us don’t make political capital out of the death of children in order to criticize the welfare state. Unlike you lot.”
    “No, WE’RE nicer than you are… the likes of us don’t celebrate when a frail old lady dies. Unlike you lot.”
    “NO, we’re nicer than you are… people should vote for us.”
    “No, we’re NICER than you are… people should vote for us.”

    No! WE’RE nicer. We’re cuddlier. We’re not nasty. We’re seemly. We’re respectful. Are you hearing us Mr BBC man? Please, please, please, pleeeeeeeeeease tell absolutely everyone that we’re nicer so people should vote for our side instead…

    Give me strength.

    • HJ777

      Do they?

      Margaret Thatcher famously went to pay her respects at Eric Heffer’s funeral.

      • http://georgeigler.com/ George Igler

        Ugh… If you’re trying to tell me there won’t be champagne corks popping across Tory households when Blair eventually snuffs it, I really don’t know what planet you’re living on.

        • Chris lancashire

          It’s more likey to be the parents of dead soldiers rather than any one political class.

        • http://twitter.com/MisterQuintus Tony Quintus

          I can’t see that happening, Blair signed up to conservative plans for the country in his first term, now Brown might get a few corks popping.
          More hate exists in the Tory party at large for Ted Heath than any Labour figure, the only socialist who might get the kind of send of maggie is getting would be Scargill, but he’s just as hated by a lot of lefties these days anyway.

          • Hookeslaw

            Why should Scargill be admired by anybody?
            He never actually signed any agreement in his life and refused to grant a strike ballot to his members.
            Scargill, Hatton. Keep reminding us of these people — please.

        • Julian_F

          Of course there won’t. Tories by their nature tend to believe in such old fashioned notions of respect for the dead and dignified behaviour.

          • http://georgeigler.com/ George Igler

            Really? Do you really *actually* believe that?

            That your political persuasion makes you a morally better person than those on the the other side of aisle?

            How is that any different to how the Left responded with moral indignation to the Right’s reaction to the Philpot trial?

            I rest my case.

            • Julian_F

              It’s just a fact

              • justanoldfart

                And that’s the extent of your argument? Cant!

            • Colonel Mustard

              I should just rest if I were you. Your “case” is risible.

              • http://georgeigler.com/ George Igler

                So risible that it’s not worth any effort to try and refute, right? Gotcha.

                • Colonel Mustard

                  Well no actually. I rather enjoyed making that comment and it clearly got to you. I think your brain is saying to itself ‘winner’ when everyone else is thinking ‘loser’.

                • http://georgeigler.com/ George Igler

                  That’s right, your absolute comedy zinger “got to me”. Just keep on telling yourself that.

                • Colonel Mustard

                  No need. I’ve moved on. You are the one apparently still griping about it.

                • Fergus Pickering

                  You can’t reute anything that is not an argument.

                • justanoldfart

                  You’re right, you can’t ‘reute’ anything because there is no such word.

                • Fergus Pickering

                  Oh dear oh dear. Shall I try again, old fart? You can’t refute anything…. blahblahblah. Do you get it now? The word is refute.

            • http://twitter.com/MisterQuintus Tony Quintus

              Self responsibility means I understand that my words have consequences, people today have forgotten that, just look at that “Youth Crime Commisioner”.

          • 2trueblue

            It is called ‘common decency’. You can analyse an individuals impact etc without being vulgar, or behaving in a disgusting manner.

            • Jambo25

              Not reducing huge areas of the country to economic devastation, penury and social collapse is what I’d call common decency.

              • Hookeslaw

                Take a look at Sunderland – which produces 500,000 a year. Or Derby.

                The traditional industries in this country were devastated because the unions destroyed them and refused to face overseas competition. You can throw in bad management if you think you can justify it but it was nothing to do with politics.

                The trade unions destroyed UK industry. If you take british Steel as an example, a massive over investment programme under Labour left it with overcapacity and It merged with the Dutch Koninklijke Hoogovens to form Corus in1999. which itself was taken over in 2007 by the Indian Tata. All under Labour.

                MG Rover was destroyed by political meddling. Labour stood by and did nothing whilst Phoenix wasted their 500 million dowry. It vetoed the Alchemy bid.

                • Jambo25

                  Industries in this country were destroyed by bloody awful management. Incompetent, short termist and under qualified. There was also a lack o any coherent, long term industrial policy at government level as was common in other industrial states such as Germany and Japan.

                • Colonel Mustard

                  No, they were destroyed by bad management and bolshy unionism together.

                • justanoldfart

                  Unfortunately bad management prevailed.

            • justanoldfart

              Does your ‘common decency’ extend to Harold Shipman or Jimmy Saville? After all, they’re both dead. Personally I’m glad they’re no longer with us, but I don’t wont to upset you so just keep on living in your own little world and telling yourself that you have to respect the deceased regardless of what they did in life.

              • 2trueblue

                If you can not see the difference you really do live up to your name.

          • Jambo25

            Tories, of course, often show little respect for the living; particularly if they are poor and don’t fit their Tory profile.

            • Colonel Mustard

              Nonsense

              • Jambo25

                Of course it must be nonsense. After all; you said so.

                • Colonel Mustard

                  It is not nonsense because I said so but because of its inherent content which speaks for itself. I have no doubt you believe it but that does not make it true and does not make it sensible.

                • Jambo25

                  So you have nothing to add other than reiteration.

          • huggatory

            Except when the dead are innocent kids who can be handily linked to a welfare scroungers story.

            • Colonel Mustard

              More nonsense

              • justanoldfart

                Do you actually have a point to make? If so I would be interested to hear your views, and I may be persuaded by your argument if it is well constructed and lucid. But if you persist in repeating the word ‘nonsense’ like a parrot then I’m afraid you’ve lost me.

          • justanoldfart

            Unfortunately some of them have very little respect for the living.

        • HJ777

          I regard Brown more than Blair as the worst and most damaging politician of the last decade or so.

          However, I was just relieved when he was no longer in a position of power. And that’s the end of it, although I am annoyed that he will enjoy a generous taxpayer-funded pension while he helped to ruin mine and those of many in the private sector.

          • Hookeslaw

            You are right about Brown (in fact I think he was the most damaging politician since the end of WW2), because Brown undermined what ‘new labour’ (for good or bad) stood for and used his position to promote himself.

            Much though I despise Brown I would be appalled at seeing any similar celebration of his death to what wee see shown here. At least it exposes the total nastiness of the left.

        • AlexJ

          Questioning a mans right to be on £60k benefits… In response to a journalists question, doesn’t really equate to throwing a street party for someone dying.

        • Colonel Mustard

          Well you soon showed your true colours.

        • Russell

          Maybe some Labour MP’s will be at the parties with Owen Jones and others, but most people still have standards of behavior above those of the National Socialist (labour) party and many of its supporters.

        • Nicholas chuzzlewit

          No there will not as far as I am concerned. I find mr Blair and odious opportunist who did this country little but harm through his illegal war in Iraq and placing it’s economy into the hands of an incompetent, cowardly ideologue. It has nothing to do with sanctimony. Treating the dead with respect is simply the product of a sound upbringing by parents with a proper sense of decency and the goodness and common sense to pass it on to their offspring.

          • Hookeslaw

            Blair did not put us into an illegal war – but he did mismanage it. The reason it was mismanaged was that despite him thinking it was right (if we give him that credit) was that he had to appease a pacifist labour party.
            Personally I think the Iraqi was was right but have the nagging doubt that Blair went with it to try to create a ‘Falklands Effect’. We can never know.
            The result was though that we went into the war less prepared than we should have been and politically we did not have the will to see it through properly.
            The war ended in a defeat for Britain (when we sneaked out of Basra) and of course Blair and Labour rarely get the blame for what really was a national humiliation – the freedom loving beyond regulation press were complicit.

          • justanoldfart

            So, by your logic, one should teach one’s children to respect the likes of Stalin, Hitler, Pol Pot, Pinochet et al because they’re dead. Oh dear, it seems that I failed to bring my daughter up with a proper sense of decency. Perhaps I should’ve consulted you for guidance as to who to teach her to respect.

        • http://twitter.com/WholeLottaSusie Sue Ward

          You are wrong. I would no more gloat over Blair’s demise than I did over Foot, Wilson or Callaghan or would over Benn, Brown or Livingstone. I don’t like their polcies but I don’t hate them as people – a concept the left seems to struggle with.

          • justanoldfart

            Not all ‘the left’ are celebrating Margaret Thatcher’s death. I didn’t like her policies but I certainly didn’t wish for her death – a concept that some on the right (not all) seem to struggle with.

        • Fergus Pickering

          Labour households surely. He is hated much more deeply by the Labour Party.. Apart from anything elese he put them in power and they much prefer opposition sinecures.

        • HarryTheHornyHippo

          Dear God one doesn’t waste perfectly good champagne on Blair. Honestly… your lack of breeding is quite undignified.

        • fubar_saunders

          Rather it be in the households than out on the streets though, no?

    • Colonel Mustard

      That’s tripe. It is always the left making these claims of being nicer whilst the right is always on the defensive of accusations of being uncaring.

      • http://georgeigler.com/ George Igler

        And now you’re behaving in precisely the same way. Thatcher would not have paid any more mind to these ludicrous idiots than a derisive snort.

        If anyone on this thread genuinely thinks any different I’m afraid you’ve all long since passed the pull-the-other-one event horizon and are hurtling ludicrously towards the satire singularity.

    • 2trueblue

      It is called ‘common decency’. You can analyse a persons impact on society without descending to gutter level and disrespectful behaviour.

  • WatTylersGhost

    So which political bunch deserves the title “The nasty party”?

  • HJ777

    At least these people serve to remind us how throughly nasty are many on the left to people who disagree with them – and gives an indication of how they would behave if they ever came to power.

  • Archimedes

    It’s entirely logical that a leader like Thatcher causes divisions among those directly effected, but when those divisions cross generations then you can only conclude that they were made by the malevolence of those that opposed her.

    It’s a sad story that people choose to behave like this.

  • JabbaTheCat

    The Daily Mash summed up these idiots well…

    “THOUSANDS of people under 35 are rejoicing at the demise of a woman they once read about.”

    • Russell

      And were told by their parents that she was evil, frequently, from a very young age, i.e. indoctrination. Even their parents were told this continuously by Labour MP’s and labour supporting newspapers and other leftie establishments like the Guardian. Mirror, and the BBC.

      • http://twitter.com/MisterQuintus Tony Quintus

        Funny none of them were told how evil Labour was for closing hundreds of pits in the 60’s

        • DWWolds

          And none of them seem to have learned that more jobs in manufacturing were lost in the Blair/Brown era that under Maggie.

          • HJ777

            Or that manufacturing output went up under both Thatcher and Major and fell under Blair/Brown.

    • James Lynch

      “read about” is probably being generous to them….

    • Jambo25

      Quite a few oldsters, like myself, weren’t exactly crying either. An awful lot of people in Wales, the North of England and Scotland will be glad to see the back of her.

      • Russell

        All the run down Labour areas, which labour have ensured stayed run down for decades.

        • Jambo25

          Yes, my part of Colinton/Spylaw, in Edinburgh, is very run down. Just ruins and slums. Good god. It takes 15 minutes to drive to our nearest Waitrose, We still didn’t like Thatcher though.

          • Fergus Pickering

            Well of course you didn’t. You are Scotch.

            • Colonel Mustard

              Quite.

          • Nicholas chuzzlewit

            Just let us English vote in the Scottish independence referendum and trust me, you will not have us to blame for all your woes for very much longer.

            • Jambo25

              Be my guest. Demand your vote.

          • Colonel Mustard

            Ah, I see.

          • HJ777

            It’s a pity that the huge expansion of new industries, such as electronics, in Scotland under the last Tory government was reversed under Labour, don’t you think?

            • Makroon

              Very good point, well made.
              Silicon Glen – where art thou now ?

      • Colonel Mustard

        As we should be glad to see the back of little rays of sunshine like you.

      • Fergus Pickering

        Why?What difference does it make now?

        • Jambo25

          Well basically, the Tory Party is as dead as a Dodo in large areas of the UK. For those Tory loyalists who are unhappy about not getting a majority in 2010; thank Thatcher. She made you largely unelectable in large parts of the country.

          • fubar_saunders

            .. and thats fair enough. But you’re not out partying in the streets are you? what you refer to is what toxified the brand, and it is Camerons’ fear of toxification that has led him to be as wet and ineffective as he is. The party has to rebuild what it stands for and if necessary place some sort of distance between itself and its history and prove that it is different to that era, but they have nothing like the media savvy that the left do. They do not have control of the political narrative. The failure to achieve a majority in 2010 was largely down to two things… the start of the melt-away to UKIP and the failure to mobilise the core vote. They only have themselves to blame.

            But those things are hardly an excuse for what we have seen in the last 36 hours.

            • Jambo25

              Sorry. The Tories are toxic because of Thatcher; not Cameron. I’ve made this point before but it doesn’t seem to get through to Tories down south. There is no god given reason for Scotland to reject centre-right politics. However, you can do an interesting experiment. Get in a car and drive north from Berwick on Tweed on the A1. For mile after mile you drive through beautiful, lush farmland, pretty little towns until you reach Edinburgh which is one of the most affluent cities in the UK. In England that would be prime Tory country. In Scotland it used to be. Now there isn’t one Tory MP along that route. There are hardly any Tory representatives at all. Thank Thatcher.

              • fubar_saunders

                My apologies, that is what I meant. What I should have said, with reference to Cameron is retoxification. I lived and worked/served in the Armed Forces in Scotland in the 1980’s, til 1991 and remember vividly what it was like and remember paying the Poll tax while living in a portacabin barrack block room with shared facilities where I could stand in the middle of the room with a six inch ruler in each hand and touch the walls on either side. I dont doubt a single word you say, it is all accurate. And, incidentally, I’m not a tory although historically I would have been a natural tory voter being ex services, but the last GE I voted UKIP… the only party that could be bothered to get off its butt and ask for my vote. Nobody else bothered, they just assumed.

      • HJ777

        Of course, all the workers in companies like Nissan and Komatsu in the North East will be very grateful for the inward investment her government attracted.

        • Jambo25

          I don’t think that the several million people who were flung on the scrapheap by Thatcher will be grateful though. Incidentally, has anyone asked those Nissan workers how grateful they are?

          • HJ777

            There you show your lack of understanding of economics.

            What happens in the economy is not all the result of what political leaders do (especially in the relatively short term). She inherited high and rising unemployment and overmanned industries hiding much unemployment. Unemployment rose in all European countries – her legacy is that for many years subsequently we had lower unemployment than other European countries.

            I know several Nissan workers. I also worked in manufacturing industry in the North East from 1982 onwards after leaving university. I never heard people in those industries criticising her, and quite a few praising her, for her government’s efforts on inwards investment.

  • Swiss Bob

    “You snatched our milk”

    1) 1968 – Labour government takes free school milk away from secondary school children. The Secretary of state for Education at the time was Ted Short.

    2) 1971 – Conservative government takes free school milk away from 7-11 year olds. The Secretary of state for Education at the time was Margaret thatcher, who unlike her Labour predecessor and successors, faced a campaign of personal vilification over the decision which is still remembered today.

    3) 1977 Labour government with Jim Callaghan as PM and Shirley Williams as education secretary, cancels free school milk for 5-7 year olds. So it was Jim Callaghan and Shirley Williams, NOT Margaret Thatcher, who took free school milk away from the infant Jamie Reed.

    http://chris4copeland.blogspot.ch/2010/08/milking-issue.html

    • Magnolia

      As a kid in primary school, I can remember drinking the warm milk that had been left out in the sun on the playground.
      I was always bilious as a child.

      Removing the milk probably saved lives.

      • James Lynch

        actually some time afterwards, Thatcher herself said that that whole milk debacle thought her a valuable lesson in politics. No point doing something when the opporbrium outweighs any gain, economic or otherwise. The amounts actually saved were nugatory.

      • Harold Angryperson

        Absolutely, it put me off the stuff for life, save for in tea or coffee. Nearly 50 years on I still can’t bear to drink a glass of milk.

      • MariaKay

        Well, in my U.S. state, the public school system in many districts offer free breakfast, free lunch and even free dinners (suppers) at school, with plenty of milk and orange juice to wash it all down with. No U.S. citizenship required either.

        • Magnolia

          Maria, each to their own.
          I would replace Child Benefit here in the UK with a wholesome free school meal for every child.

          • MariaKay

            It’s a little bit over the top when it gets down to feeding the little tots (and their whole families as well) several hours after school time has ended.

        • http://www.facebook.com/barbara.stevens.790 Barbara Stevens

          We could well afford to feed our own kids if we stopped foreign aid to the tune of 15 billion per year, many families now have to resort to food banks to survive each week. Many go to school hungry and no winter clothing either. What does that tell you about modern day UK.

      • rubyduck

        I’d happily drink up any that was unwanted. Didn’t do me any harm.

      • Radiant

        Entirely agree. Cows’ milk is not good for you anyway.

    • http://twitter.com/MisterQuintus Tony Quintus

      Funny isn’t it that none of the anti-thatcherites seem to have any political knowledge at all

      • Russell

        More sad than funny.

      • Jambo25

        Well, I’m an anti-Thatcherite with experience working in the secretariat of a large government ministry, a degree in politics, post-graduate qualifications and 30 odd years experience teaching and lecturing in History and Politics.

        • http://twitter.com/WholeLottaSusie Sue Ward

          Plenty of ‘real world’ experience then! Have you ever had a job in the private sector or have you always suckled at the tax payers teat?

          • Jambo25

            Waiter, shop assistant, rat catcher, brewery drayman, fish porter, industrial cleaner. And your experience please.

            • http://twitter.com/WholeLottaSusie Sue Ward

              BA, MSc, Debenhams, MOD, Aviation Consultant, Senior Estimator, Bid Manager, Senior Manager in Construction. Oh and my husband drives an HGV, I expect mine’s bigger than your’s as well.

              • Jambo25

                Well my dad was the HGV driver as well as being ex RN CPO Guns, a glass blower and brewery worker. My ma was an insurance agent, laundry worker, cook etc. My was a research pharmacist then ran a retail pharmacy (Both private sector). My sis is a corporate banker and my son a project manager in construction. As for you having a bigger one than me. Well, you’re not saying that you’re trans gender, Sue? Are you?

                What is it with you right wing fruit cakes that makes you think that those who don’t share your naive view of reality have no “real world experience”?

                • Colonel Mustard

                  Could you post a link to your family tree, medical records and CV. Might as well go the whole hog since you so determinedly have something to prove here.

                • Mr Creosote

                  I’ll have nothing said against fruitcakes – vote for the kippers on May 2nd!

                • fubar_saunders

                  Because if you waddle like a duck and quack like a duck, moreoften than not, that makes you a duck. Means that occasionally there is going to be collateral damage and both sides of the entrenched fence are guilty of it. The left’s assumption is that anyone who disagrees with them is automatically a dyed in the wool, public school educated chinless tory. Its the regrettable nature of modern day political conversations that has led to this “shoot first, ask questions later”/”act in haste, repent at leisure” situation.

                • Jackthesmilingblack

                  Fellow Internet correspondents: You’d be well advised not to disclose personal information, however much provoked. Identity thieves lurk everywhere. Especially everywhere.

            • the viceroy’s gin

              Well, no doubt, government should have plenty of call for those with rat catcher experience. That is, if government is doing its job. However, my guess is that they make better use of the fish porter background, and finding new ways to fob off the same old rotten pescaluture, the essence of politics.

              • Jambo25

                I think the Secretariat of the Board of Trade made more use of my Economics and IT skills.

                • the viceroy’s gin

                  You don’t think they’re fobbing off rotten fish there?

                  That’s the rotten fish monger’s work stall, isn’t it?

            • Colonel Mustard

              When did you learn your modesty or have you always had that quality?

              • Jambo25

                Humility i my middle name. It’s a pity that charm and manners aren’t yours.

                • Colonel Mustard

                  Hubris more like. I don’t usually do charm and manners when I am at war although in peacetime I have never been accused of lacking either.

                • Jambo25

                  “At war”? You really do take yourself far too seriously.

                • Colonel Mustard

                  No, I take the danger from socialist ideologues like you seriously. I have seen what damage they have done to my country over the space of half a century.

                • fubar_saunders

                  Humility is your middle name? Did your parents not like you or something? :-)

                • Jackthesmilingblack

                  “I’m never wrong”
                  How’s that for a middle name?

            • Fergus Pickering

              I didn’t know you needed a degree in politics to do these things. Geroffofit. These were jobs you did in the vacations. I was a bus conductor, a janitor, a clerk, a hotel porter and a worker in an off-licence. Apart from the hotel-portering, every job was a doddle featuring plenty of pay for very little work.

              • Jambo25

                And they were also jobs I did at night when working as a civil servant, teacher and lecturer to make ends meet. Quit a few peopel have more than one job. It’s what marks out the “strivers from the skivers”. Isn’t that what Thatcher and her grandchildren, like Osborne, want us to do?

            • fubar_saunders

              You sound like William Hague.

        • Colonel Mustard

          You don’t seem to have learned much though. Too busy indoctrinating the young I guess.

          • Jambo25

            I left political indoctrination to others. My job was to spread drug addiction and sexual perversity. Much more fun.

        • HJ777

          What relevance does a degree in politics have to whether you have any political knowledge?

          • Jambo25

            Possibly it’s something to do with having a knowledge of Political and Moral Philosophy, constitutional law and theory, party structures voting systems campaigning techniques. Minor things like that.

            • Colonel Mustard

              All of which must have been very useful in your indoctrination classes. How many young socialists do you think you helped create?

              • Jambo25

                I’m a socially conservative centre rightist. Why would I want to create young socialists?

                • Colonel Mustard

                  Ha ha! That’s the funniest thing you’ve peddled yet. False flag is all the rage in online Labour rebuttal units these days.

                • Jambo25

                  I’m an SNP voter and despise the Labour Party.

                • HarryTheHornyHippo

                  So you’re a Tartan Tory then. Welcome.

            • HJ777

              I know plenty about those things and my degree is in physics.

              It’s not that demanding, is it? Some things are better learned in conjunction with experience rather than purely academically without experience.

              • the viceroy’s gin

                Yes, “politics” is like floral arrangement, only less disciplined and not as knowledge based.

              • Jambo25

                Oh I was a professional association rep for a number of years and a political party activist for a number of years as well. I also studied economics at university which i more than Osborne did.

                • HJ777

                  So no experience of having to earn your living in an internationally competitive market then?

                  Robert Mugabe studied economics at university. How is the Zimbabwean economy doing? Much economics taught in universities, especially macroeconomics, is nonsense, based on fallacies about the way that the economy actually works.

                • Jambo25

                  No I haven’t. Then I didn’t get the kind of salary, expense accounts, company cars, bonuses and other perks which go with that either. I also didn’t work amongst the overwhelmingly incompetent group of anuses known, oxymoronically, as British management. I suspect, that for your part, you haven’t sat up half the night translating information from German language documents in order to prepare answers to parliamentary questions and then running down to Westminster the following morning to make sure that the minister you were working to didn’t end up looking stupid. I doubt you were ever left in charge of 140 or so resentful 4th formers in the hall of a rough school until they could be taken home during a blizzard. I doubt you’ve ever worked to a strict schedule to prepare and send off 80-90 UCAS applications, each one being vital to a young person’s future.

                  I could go on exchanging insults with you until the cows come home but I’ll simply repeat what I’ve stated elsewhere. Why do you right wing head cases think that you and you alone have some monopoly on reality?

                • HJ777

                  So you think that people who earn their living in internationally competitive markets get paid more? You think they all get bonuses, expense accounts (as if an “expense account” involves claiming anything more than legitimate expenses incurred doing business) and company cars? Perhaps you think they never get made redundant either? Most of them are ordinary people doing everyday jobs where they have to persuade customers to part with their money.

                  What sort of world do you live in if you think that’s the case? Certainly not one in any way related to reality.

                  And what would you know about British management (much of which is very good)?

                  The fact of the matter is that you may have been useless at your jobs – and you still wouldn’t have been put out of business by more efficient competitors. Cushy.

                • Jambo25

                  I think that most of them do and I have enough friends working in that area to know that I’m right. Of course you are right. Teaching is full of people who are awful at their jobs and have absolute job security. It’s a well known fact. You don’t half write a lot of dross.

                • HJ777

                  Most people working in internationally competitive markets work on the shop floor, or designing products and services, etc.. Most don’t even travel, don’t have ‘expense accounts’ and don’t get company cars or bonuses.

                  Clearly you think that the only people in this country who earn their living in internationally competitive markets are people who travel and swan around on planes. Somehow you fail to include all those whose living is dependent on their companies being competitive against overseas competitors in export markets or against imports. The entire shop floor at Nissan in Sunderland, for example. Everyone in the electronics industry, for example.

                  So if you think you’re right, you’re completely deluded.

                  Teachers have an extremely high level of job security. Some are very good – but not all. How many are ever sacked for being no good at their jobs? How many lose their jobs for being not as good as their competitors in other countries?

        • http://www.facebook.com/barbara.stevens.790 Barbara Stevens

          Well said not all people are morons like some suggest.

    • Eddie

      We kiddie had milk in the 70s in Kent. I think because even though the government stopped paying for it, local councils could choose to pay for it instead. We had to pay for our biscuits though – half p a rich tea and 1 p a digestive: a rip off in 1975/6, when I think about it!

    • First L

      Milk was introduced in schools because kids were getting ricketts because milk simply wasn’t available during the war. Fast forward to the eighties, not a single kid was getting ricketts thanks to milk deprivation at home. Free milk was the answer to a public health problem, once that public health problem was solved, why should the state carry on spending cash in order to hand out milk to no good effect?

    • Fergus Pickering

      I am old enough to know what happened to the milk. Most of it was poured down the drain because children didn’t like it. It was only available to get rid of surplus milk.

    • fubar_saunders

      typical selective memories from the left. Arseholes is too kind. Arseholes serve a purpose.

  • Jebediah

    Most of them were too young to have been there. What does that make them? Ghouls, unthinking left wing automata perhaps. Or just inhuman scum.

    • Colonel Mustard

      And/or the products of decades of socialist/pro-Labour and anti-Tory/Thatcher indoctrination in schools and universities.

      • Russell

        Indoctrination is absolutely the correct description of these cretins.
        Included in that description are the instigators like Galloway, Livingstone, Scargill and many Labour MP’s and Trade Union leaders.

        • telemachus

          Up where I live, the body politic is pragmatism and many supported Thatcher in 1989
          However when whole towns lost their industry and nothing came in to replace it despair set in and the diasadvantaged children had only the 4 term Tory Government to blame.
          As always there has to be a name of personification
          The views of the young round here therefore are a product of the removal from proud working people of the meeans to earn their daily bread
          This is nothing to do with cretins or indoctrination

          • Colonel Mustard

            Get lost.

            • huggatory

              Ah the joys of thoughtful debate

              • Colonel Mustard

                “Thoughtful debate” is not a description that comes to mind for telemachus’ comments. More like “brain dead slogans”.

          • Shazza

            And what did Labour do to improve their lot during their 13 year misrule?

            • telemachus

              Gross domestic product (GDP) grew at an average annual rate of 2.8% over the period 1997–2005. This can be compared with the previous 8 years where growth averaged1.9%.
              Gordon Brown on accession made growth a priority and directed private sector encouragements and government strategies to the employment blackspots created when the previous government threw so many out of work
              It was a marathon task and the results imperfect
              In 2010 there were many Capital Projects in these deprived areas axed by the coallition which would have created more jobs not just the high profile project in Clegg’s backyard highlighted by the media

              • McRobbie

                “there’s no money left” that was labours legacy in their own words.

                • telemachus

                  Liam Byrne did a good line in baiting and Osborne genetically programmed to cut welfare to the poor fell
                  In truth it is always possible to invest for growth
                  That is how capitalism works

                • McRobbie

                  I thought one thing you had going for you was that you could string a sentence together! Maybe your outpouring of bile against the best PM this country has ever had is distorting your brain cell. Capitalism works by giving people the right to chose, that means no nanny state ran by politicians who have never worked in the real world, and that does not exclude tory politicians but definitely includes fat cat union leaders and theoretical dinner table trained party leaders, and brown and bliar and balls and kinnock and foot….shivers waiting for a spine, in the words of a shining star of british politics, Maggie.

                • telemachus

                  In case you missed it most of my posts have indicated the magnificent leadership of Thatcher
                  Her true heirs (Tony and Gordon) continued this magnificence

                • http://www.facebook.com/neil.tabraham Neil Tabraham

                  Right to choose? Like water or, to a lesser degree, trains? The failed experiments of capitalism….Today’s rose tinted concept of Conservatism, with the derision of the ‘nanny’ state, bears more resemblance to Anarchy (what is the state there for if not to ‘nanny’?). Thatcher wasn’t the last of the politicians with conviction, she was the creator of the new breed you so succinctly describe. However, I’ve yet to hear of a union leader who was a Bullingdon boy or studied politics at Oxbridge…. or had the personal wealth to retire (and die) in The Ritz.

                • Colonel Mustard

                  “what is the state there for if not to ‘nanny’?”

                  By which we see you for what you are. Take a closer look at your socialist politicians (Mandelson is a good start, Umunna to follow) and stop being so stupid.

                • Nicholas chuzzlewit

                  As I never tire of pointing out, investment only works when you achieve a return which exceeds the cost of making the investment in the first place. Governments never have, cannot and never will ‘invest’ they ‘spend’ and that is not the same thing. Brown liked to use the word ‘invest’ but actually just spent incontinently and racked up the huge national debt and structural deficit that we have today. Had all that money actually been invested, we would be a very wealthy country today but it was not, it was spent. In short it was a negative investment and the poor that you so love to bleat about will be paying for the consequences of the fiscal madness undertaken between 1997 and 2010 for decades to come. So before you bandy with terms like investment and ‘growth’ take 5 minutes out to try and understand what they mean.

                • telemachus

                  Your tiresome repeat of this takes no account of the pump priming of confidence

                • Nicholas chuzzlewit

                  Pump priming, more meaningless nonsense that means government spends money and racks up debt with no positive effect on growth.

                • telemachus

                  Not just the direct benefit of pump priming
                  But the boost of the whole economy by the confidence engendered

                • Nicholas chuzzlewit

                  Meaningless drivel. pump priming is simply an alliterative term for government spending, proven time and again to be wasteful and utterly pointless. Confidence will be engendered if we cut public spending and put the money back into the hands of it’s owners, the individuals and private businesses of this country. These constituencies will produce growth and not governments of any hue.

                • HJ777

                  Unfortunately, confidence suffers, and for good reason, when government indulges in wasteful spending as it did under Gordon Brown

                • telemachus

                  What nonsense
                  The boom of confidence from 1997 to Lehman was palpable

                • HJ777

                  Until people belatedly realised that it was unsustainable.

                • http://www.facebook.com/neil.tabraham Neil Tabraham

                  What a load of paranoid nonsense, indoctrination? unsustainable spending? I assume you are one of the faithful right that believe the ‘Disaster’ politics that are being amateurishly spouted by Osborne and co? In case you hadn’t realised, the cold war ended 20 odd years ago, there is no longer a need to fear socialism. In fact, with capitalism such a monumental failure (and the reason for this country’s rapidly escalating debt) a bit of social consideration and humility wouldn’t go amiss. That and checking the facts – spending was lower in 2007 than the previous 30 years. Debt increased to support the failing capitalist system you so vehemently defend. Lastly, it is pure paranoia to think that indoctrination of socialism has been happening in schools, the reality is a new generation – who have a social conscience resulting from an increased stake hold in society. They care about people not money because they can fulfil their sense of self virtually not through the open display of ostentatious wealth that paralyses the Thatcher generation, myself included!

                • HJ777

                  Not quite sure what I said that you are responding to. I didn’t even mention indoctrination.

                  Incidentally, government spending in 2007 was at record levels. It’s simply a fact, as reference to official Treasury figures will confirm. The problem with this spending level was that it was substantially higher than revenue even during a boom (representing aa deficit of around 3% of GDP). This means that it exacerbated the boom, whereas a surplus (which is what you’d normally expect during a boom) would have helped restrain the boom. Prior to the early 90s recession the government ran a surplus, and thus is why the subsequent recession did so much less damage to the public finances.

                • Colonel Mustard

                  “the cold war ended 20 odd years ago, there is no longer a need to fear socialism.”

                  And out of its ashes, with KGB or Stasi gold, rose Common Purpose, socialism behind the mask of unaccountable power and far more dangerous.

                  The rest of your rant is pure rubbish. Youth “culture” in general has never been so self-centred, so lacking in consideration for others, so superficial, so judgemental, so concerned with physical appearance, so ageist, or so obsessed with celebrity and bling. And those “qualities” are combined with rampant stupidity and a nasty, envious view of the world implanted by griping socialist academics and teachers since 1968. Caring and compassion might be spouted about in some ghastly socialist sponsored politics class but it is never demonstrated in reality. If what you say is even half true why are so many socialist mouthpieces so rich and so concerned with the personal display of wealth?

                • MariaKay

                  Exactly right Colonel.

                  Their “nasty, envious” view of the world has hardly spawned a decent or more civilized, livable society fifty years or so after we foolishly allowed these brats to have their massive, KGB-funded temper tantrum all over the Western world.

                  Instead, they gave us a world where “art” consists of a display of Tracy Enema’s poop-stained undies. And “entertainment” consists of a young lady videoing herself sucking on a used tampon and posting it on the internet. Meanwhile, “music” consists of hate-filled, foul-mouthed drivel chanted to mind-numbing primitive jungle rhythms.

                  This is the world they created, and what’s more, they are so lost that they don’t even realize how truly ugly and grotesque it is.

                • Jambo25

                  You do realise that the presidng genius of the Brit Art scene that you rightly despise was Charles Saatchi? Now who was he closely associated with, I wonder? I believe that Jeffrey Archer was an avid collector of Andy Warhol and his gang. Which party and party leader was he associated with?

                • fubar_saunders

                  “there is no longer a need to fear socialism.”

                  Disagreee. The principle is admirable, the execution and realisation of it, is completely and utterly flawed. Looking at insidious organisations like Common Purpose, there is every reason to fear socialism. Those bastards have done enough damage already. Also disagree about indoctrination. “they care about people not money”…. right, so during the riots, they didnt turn over Tesco’s to make sure that the downtrodden victims of toryism on their sink estates got fed, they nicked trainers, tv’s, etc… whilst it is obviously incorrect to tar all with the same brush, not all todays youth are like that, to imply that this kind of revision of history and indoctrination of socialism through the teaching system hasnt happened at all would be equally incorrect.

                • rubyduck

                  Confidence or hubris ?

                • Colonel Mustard

                  Only if you were a Labour supporter. To me it felt like the burgeoning of a fascist state.

                • telemachus

                  During the Blair years all were glad to bask in his international superstar status

                • Colonel Mustard

                  I wasn’t. I didn’t vote for the cnut ever and had him pegged from day one as bogus. The blue jeans and guitar on the way back from Chequers confirmed it. But people are stupid and easily fooled.

                • fubar_saunders

                  But it wasnt a boom though, was it? It was a bubble.

                • fubar_saunders

                  that would have been true during the slight downturn between 2001 and 2004 following 9/11 when it was particularly visible in the IT Sector… but in 2008, there wasnt exactly any water left to prime the pump with, telemachus, the monocular megalomaniac had pissed it all up the wall.

                • Peter Bensley

                  > Governments never have, cannot and never will ‘invest’

                  Insane ideological nonsense. Remember when Gordon Brown sold our gold reserves at the wrong time, and everyone mocked him for it? What are state-owned commodity reserves if not an investment?

                  And all the formerly nationalised industries like BT, how did the government create them without investing? Did they just pop into being from nowhere the moment they became privately owned?

                  In the US, state-run NASA is estimated to provide $7 in tax revenue over ten years for every $1 spent, leading George Bush to call the Apollo Program “the best return on investment since Leonardo da Vinci bought himself a sketchpad.”

                  And the canals, railways, and finally motorways that allowed goods to move around the country, did they only create a boom in economic growth when privately owned, suddenly becoming useless to carry goods the moment the state constructed or nationalised them?

              • Swiss Bob

                And how much did it drop by from 2007 – 2009?

                Approx 25%?

                You really are a dolt, anyone can create illusory economic growth by splurging on massive borrowing.

              • HJ777

                How convenient that the two periods you chose, very carefully and conveniently included a recession under the Conservatives, but stopped short of including one under Labour.

                And Labour inherited strong growth, did it not?

              • kyalami

                Interesting choice of years (1997-2005). I am reminded of the book “How to Lie with Statistics” by Darrell Huff.

              • Hookeslaw

                Why stop at 2005? Why not run from 1997 to 2008?
                What labour did was increase the debt by over 300 million between 2001 and 2008 despite this growth. All labour did was spend money the economy was not generating. The growth figure was meaningless – if it was important explain how labour managed to put more brits on benefits over this period.
                All labour were doing is 2010 was spending even more money that the economy could not afford.

                • http://www.facebook.com/neil.tabraham Neil Tabraham

                  Taking away government borrowing that was to support a failing banking system (blame not apportioned) your evidence for this statement is?

          • Nicholas chuzzlewit

            I have no doubt that these same people celebrating the death of an old woman will make time to go and collect their benefits. Benefits paid for in part by hard working individuals who believe they owe a debt of gratitude to Margaret Thatcher for revitalising Britain.

            • telemachus

              The comment related to those thrown into despair
              They need help

              • Colonel Mustard

                You need help.

              • Nicholas chuzzlewit

                No prospect of them actually doing something for themselves then.

          • Nicholas chuzzlewit

            No chance of these ‘proud’ people actually doing anything to improve their lot.

            • telemachus

              Problem is that when ground down and in despair you cannot see the way forward
              That is what caring reasonable politiocs as all about

              • 2trueblue

                What you mean the 13yrs of Liebore who stole aspiration by downgrading all standards over their reign?

              • Russell

                The ‘singer’ in Glasgows ‘party last night said on Sky that towns like Paisley had their Industries wiped out by Mrs Thatcher and are STILL suffering!
                These towns in Scotchland and the Nort of England funnily enough have had Labour MP’s and Labour councils for decades before Mrs Thatcher and decades since Mrs Thatcher.
                So having 13 years of Labour Governments, having many more years of Labour MP’s and Labour councils has done NOTHING for these hate filled people.
                I don’t hate these people, I detest them and pity them for their ignorance and lack of intelligence.

                • telemachus

                  Not sure what a local MP can do for a whole town thrown out of work when the only employer whether pit of factory closes
                  Are you suggesting the local council creates non jobs in the public sector?

                • Russell

                  Perhaps people would expect one local Labour MP to get support from neighboring Labour MP’s and demand a Labour Council and a Labour government invest some of the £billions Labour claimed to have invested in providing a few jobs through new industries!
                  Plenty of other councils did some work to attract new business to their areas, where they had suffered high unemployment through ‘old’ Industries closing.

                  Why these numbskulls in Scotchland and the North of England keep voting in Labour is baffling, Labour do nothing for them except increase benefits and keep them unemployed.
                  Labour left office with record youth unemployment (almost a million 16 to 24 year olds).

                • DWWolds

                  Why do these numbskills keep voting Labour? You provide the answer in your next sentence: Labour “increase benefits and keep them unemployed”. And as a result of that they destroy all motivation and get-up-and-go. And, of course, they keep them voting Labour.

                • telemachus

                  Why they vote Labour is that they believe in a just and equal society

                • Hookeslaw

                  Where they kept the top rate at 40% for 13 years. Where they took the 10p rate away from millions.

                • HJ777

                  What was ‘just and equal’ about 13 years of corporatism and an unsustainable credit boom?

                • telemachus

                  A world class health service with fast access for all

                • HJ777

                  In 2009, the OECD reported that despite spending “about the average” on the NHS that “the quality and quantity of services are below average”.

                  It rated the NHS as one of the least efficient (along with Greece and Ireland).

                  And remember that until 2008, average waiting list were actually longer under Labour than they had been under the preceding Tory government.

                • Nicholas chuzzlewit

                  As opposed to the dysfunctional health service we have which unnecessarily took the lives of 1,200 people in one hospital alone.

                • Mark Turner

                  World class health service? where?

                • telemachus

                  Yes I agree it has declined since 2010

                • fubar_saunders

                  world class? That kills 12000 people per year and then lies about it and tries to cover it up??? So world class that even the newly free Eastern European and Baltic states didnt copy it?

                  You are taking the piss arent you?

                • Nicholas chuzzlewit

                  You mean like taking away the 10% tax rate as a stunt to discomfit the Tories. Brown was really caring about the poor then wasn’t he. No he thought he was buying electoral advantage by lowering the basic rate to 20% a typically cynical move from a political pygmie.

                • fubar_saunders

                  hahaha, give me a frickin’ break!!! Arf!!!!!!

                • HJ777

                  Are you suggesting that Margaret Thatcher was personally responsible for industries that couldn’t compete and couldn’t make a profit closing down? What was she meant to do? Subsidise everything?

                • telemachus

                  Start with the mines
                  Vindictively closed

                • HJ777

                  The rate of mine closure was faster under the Labour government that preceded her.

                • telemachus

                  only because the Tories had not invested to keep them viable

                • HJ777

                  And where is your evidence for that?

                  The rate of mine closures was also faster under Wilson’s 1960s governments.

                • telemachus

                  Untrue

                • HJ777

                  “Throughout the 1960s, with a Labour Government in office from 1964, the pit closure programme accelerated; it decimated the industry. During this period, nearly 300 more pits were closed, and the total workforce slumped from over 750,000 in the late 1950s down to 320,000 by 1968.”

                  Source: NUM web site.

                • Nicholas chuzzlewit

                  I am afraid that HJ777’s contention is an unalterable historical fact. There were more pit closures and redundancies in the coal mines under Wilson than Thatcher. Nothing you can do to rewrite history I am afraid because this is Britain not Stalin’s USSR.

                • Nicholas chuzzlewit

                  They did not invest because it would mean losing the taxpayers money. It was cheaper to by foreign coal and that it why domestic coal mines were closed.

                • fubar_saunders

                  No, more closed under Wilson and Callaghan (293) between 66-70 and 74-79, than they did under Thatch (160).

                  Try again

                • MariaKay

                  But think of all the carbon emissions that were saved because the mines were closed down. Did you ever think of that, eh? Champagne socialists everywhere owe the lady a debt of gratitude

          • Russell

            And the 3 term Labour government who have done nothing in those same places.

          • MariaKay

            And how many jobs have they lost due to Labor’s mass immigration policies and determination to “rub the right’s nose in diversity?”

            Not to mention how many young British girls lost their whole lives and their whole human dignity because of Labor’s love of “diversity.”

            • telemachus

              The last sentence ill becomes you
              The first is just not true immigration has net benefit to the economy but the effect on eviscerated communities is zero

              • Colonel Mustard

                None of which is supported by any credible evidence.

                • telemachus

                  We will prospectively produce this from the opening next January

                • Colonel Mustard

                  Compare and contrast:-

                  “The first is just not true immigration has net benefit to the economy but the effect on eviscerated communities is zero”

                  The evidence for which is?

                  “We will prospectively produce (evidence of) this from the opening next January”

                  Risible.

                • telemachus

                  The evidence of the economic benefits has been rehearsed here many times, the last by Fraser

                • Colonel Mustard

                  Rehearsed but not proven you facile half-wit.

              • MariaKay

                “Insourcing” and “outsourcing” are two sides of the same globalist coin. Why you lefties fail to understand that, I cannot say.

                Scabs are scabs, whether they are native-born or imported.

          • Jebediah

            Are you for real? You are without doubt the most tiresome, weird, lickspittle, slogan spouting, Balls stalking troll I have ever encountered. Are you some sort of program spewed out by a defunct experimental Balls/Brown computer?

            • telemachus

              In just a couple of years we will be benefitting from the economic nous of the charismatic one

          • Makroon

            This sort of stuff, endlessly repeated on the BBC by “former miners” (usually paid-up NUM staffers and Scargill loyalists), just makes me ask – and what about the subsequent 13 years of free-spending Labour rule ?

            13 years of massive increases in state spending, and zilch spend on the “forgotten mining communities” ?!?

            The BBC is fond of showing the Victorian school building in Doncaster with it’s abandon and broken windows. What have it’s sinecure Labour MPs been doing for those 13 years ?

            BTW, the three Doncaster MPs are :
            Rosie Winterton
            Caroline Flint
            and,
            Red Miliband !!!
            You really couldn’t make this up.
            Did Miliband’s agent supply this video to the BBC ?

    • 2trueblue

      Or all of the above.

    • ArchiePonsonby

      It’s yer typical Blair edjerca’ed yoof, innit?

    • Olly

      Or just some of many children who’s parents had to raise them in the mess of a country she almost entirely by herself has made-with help of Blair’s government. Perhaps they were all old enough to realise that the elimination of our industries-causing unemployment-still affecting families now, is something to be angry at. Perhaps they were old enough to realise that the poll tax was a ridiculous idea? Perhaps they realised that the manipulation of the police to react very violently-crushing the spirit of the normal citizen, was also something to be angry at. Never speak poorly of the dead, Thatcher, she is an exception.

      • fubar_saunders

        Normal citizen? So those flying pickets from unrelated industries that came out in support of the miners and did things like dropping concrete slabs on the cars of those who had the temerity to go back to work and put their families first were “normal citizens”?

        They were out for a rumble, wound up by Scargill and they got what they were looking for. Secondary picketing was illegal. The whole bloody strike was illegal, because he didnt hold a ballot for the shagging thing.

        • Olly

          That’s not who I am talking about, they were a minority. Those idiots are just like the ones in the 2011 riots, and I am not in defense of them. I am defending the peaceful ones who were celebrating, not the morons that take advantage of these events and give you Tory’s the impression that all people celebrating about her death are rioting thugs.

  • Swiss Bob

    Ironically from what I could see, many in the crowd appeared rather too young to remember Thatcher.

    Exactly, just another pathetic bunch of soap dodging Student Grant/Millie Tant know-nothing wasters. Owen Jones and Laurie Penny clones.

    • Eddie

      Yes, and hardly any black people too. Just the usual white middle class socialists wanting to be cool.

    • darwins beard

      Bang on, the Telegraph has a video of the long hair types trowing things at the police who had the audacity to stop people drinking on the street, breaking in to a shop and graffiting on anything standing still for too long.

    • Nicholas chuzzlewit

      Their punishment for their uncivilised, disgusting and all too predictable behaviour will be to continue living their dreary, meaningless lives in well deserved squalor and obscurity.

      • Radiant

        Well said!

    • Jackthesmilingblack

      Don’t sugar-coat it, Bob.

    • Radiant

      A load of wooly thinking leftis.

  • darwins beard

    This is a generation of people who simply think that being anti-establishment is cool no matter what the issue is or how little their understanding of it, I would love to find out how many of these people found the Daily Mail disgusting for politicising the Philpott case.

    • Graham Thompson

      Not sure I understand this – are you saying they were politicising Thatcher? Is that even possible?

      • darwins beard

        what I saying is that jumping on to bandwagon of a tragedy (to her family at least no matter your politics) to promote your politics is as bad if your on the left or right

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